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  1. #26
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BattaM3 Click here to enlarge
    What kind of standalone or piggyback would suggest for a hpf kit. Lots of people are looking at the proefi but i need to see more. After my hpf2.5 warrenty is up I might look around for different ecu.

    Car is daliy driver now but in year or so it won't. PM me if you like.

    Could you guys set me up with something nice and tune it? Pm me please
    What has you thinking about a standalone?

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    What kind of standalone or piggyback would suggest for a hpf kit. Lots of people are looking at the proefi but i need to see more. After my hpf2.5 warrenty is up I might look around for different ecu.

    Car is daliy driver now but in year or so it won't. PM me if you like.

    Could you guys set me up with something nice and tune it? Pm me please
    We'd be happy to help! We do Pectel, MOTEC & Vi-PEC standalones for S54's, and have made well over 1000hp with nitrous and turbo on street-driven car. Unlike Pro-EFI, our kit isn't designed to meet the requirements of street-driven S54s - as such we don't support check engine lights, cruise control or any OBD-II functions. But in terms of ultimate control, capability and drivability, we can help! Instead of a PM, just email info@apexspeedtech.com with some specs on your car and we'll discuss options!

    Kind Regards,

    Neel
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

  3. #28
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    Well I'm never getting rid of my car sticky. So maybe after HPF warrenty is up I might look around at some options. MaxPsi,Apex or proefi. Just really curious!

    My car Is at the end of it daliy driving job. I've had no problem with AEM unit. Just looking at it in long term. My car isn't going anywhere. Stuck with me for life. It will just become a weekend warrior.

    My car is hpf2.5 neel. I'll shoot you a email also. Just curious at this point.

  4. #29
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BattaM3 Click here to enlarge
    Well I'm never getting rid of my car sticky. So maybe after HPF warrenty is up I might look around at some options. MaxPsi,Apex or proefi. Just really curious!

    My car Is at the end of it daliy driving job. I've had no problem with AEM unit. Just looking at it in long term. My car isn't going anywhere. Stuck with me for life. It will just become a weekend warrior.

    My car is hpf2.5 neel. I'll shoot you a email also. Just curious at this point.
    I see what you are saying, definitely shoot Neel an e-mail. He is knowledgeable and is interested in you getting the best setup for your needs, not shoving just any product down your throat.

  5. #30
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    Just brainstorming. The setup now works just fine. Like I said the cars a keeper.

  6. #31
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BattaM3 Click here to enlarge
    Well I'm never getting rid of my car sticky. So maybe after HPF warrenty is up I might look around at some options. MaxPsi,Apex or proefi. Just really curious!

    My car Is at the end of it daliy driving job. I've had no problem with AEM unit. Just looking at it in long term. My car isn't going anywhere. Stuck with me for life. It will just become a weekend warrior.

    My car is hpf2.5 neel. I'll shoot you a email also. Just curious at this point.

    I would go for proefi.... Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge


    Time Attack ///MZ4

  7. #32
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    Proefi is so new. I'll wait to see what happens with the other hpf car going that route.
    Hpfs AEM has worked fine. Like I said this car will be with me
    forever.

  8. #33
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    ProEFI and Vipec are the only real affordable options Batta. By time you get a Pectel with the options unlocked to run what the AEM does, you will have a $6 - $8,000 box with no harness... seriously.


  9. #34
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    I'll stay AEM if the cost are crazy. I've had no issues. Maybe proefi I'm just not one
    jump on new stuff right away.

  10. #35
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    ProEFI and Vipec are the only real affordable options Batta. By time you get a Pectel with the options unlocked to run what the AEM does, you will have a $6 - $8,000 box with no harness... seriously.
    Um, no. Where do you get your numbers? A system like the one in this Z4 starts at less than $6k for THE WHOLE KIT, including harnesses, base maps, etc. The harnesses we build and provide with the systems are much higher spec than what others are providing, and every harness has connections for adding fuel & oil pressure, lambda control, traction control, multiple map select & more.

    The base price of the Pectel ECU is more but they have a lot more functionality in terms of engine control & data logging. The total system cost is actually very similar when you are comparing apples to apples - systems built with the same features. On top of that, they are of a different level - these are professional ECUs that are used by top racing teams all over the world. BMW World Rally uses Pectel.

    -Neel
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

  11. #36
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    Um one sold for 3300 euros just recently... never installed but used, no harness. Then to get all the features you have to pay for an unlock. Sorry but $500 for a second lamba input and a base price of around around $4500 creeps up FAST.

    how about this one:

    http://storebypsi.com/index.php?p=product&id=3&parent=5

    For a viper, adapter harness, map sensor and a base file, $8900.


  12. #37
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    Um one sold for 3300 euros just recently... never installed but used, no harness. Then to get all the features you have to pay for an unlock. Sorry but $500 for a second lamba input and a base price of around around $4500 creeps up FAST.
    We are the US distributor for Cosworth Electronics and have sold dozens of BMW Systems. What you saw for 3300 Euros used is a higher-end ECU Cosworth M-Series ECU, with Mil-Spec connectors designed for harsh environments with even more capability than the standard versions.

    First off, US retail pricing is $3985. No other system does so much for that price, comparably featured ECUs cost twice as much. Dual lambda is $390, not $500. But its not just dual lambda. It allow full, closed loop control on up to 4 inputs. So you could run a 4-cylinder with a separate air/fuel, running in full closed-loop per cylinder! And the system is far more advanced than any other, with target compensations for things like Traction Control intervention & EGT.

    Almost everything is standard, including.

    1MB data logging standard - 1000Hz maximum logging rate (4 times faster than most of the competition) and the ability to chose from over 200 channels. Uses Pi Toolbox software, as used by Indycar, ALMS and Formula 1 teams.

    Knock control standard, with 2 inputs, two programmable frequencies, 4 filters and individual cylinder detonation controls for up to 12 cylinders.

    12 ignition drivers internally, 8 internal ignition amplifiers (most ECUs require external ignition modules or smart coils) up to 48 analog inputs - you can use the Pectel SQ6 as your ECU AND chassis data system, with inputs for shock pots, steering sensors, accelerometers, 4 wheelspeed sensors and more!

    Dual CAN bus, GPS inputs for beaconless lap times & track mapping.

    4 calibrations per ECU, switchable on the fly by switch, button or gear position. Can also have a "push to pass" calibration for overboost.

    The standard single lambda has 4 lambda tables that can be gear position or driver selectable.

    There are many, many more advanced features that are on a completely different level than the ECUs you are comparing it to. There are other options for up to 2GB of data, dash displays and much more. Since we specialize in custom, built to suit solutions and I can quote you based on your needs. I am confident that you will find it an excellent value, and dollar for dollar, feature for feature a better product than ECUs that have a lower base price but nowhere near the quality of features. Its why guys like GSR Motorsports and some of the biggest names in BMW Performance use it.

    And that Viper system? That's one of our distributors, John Reed. His kit not only includes the ECU & harness, but sensors, actuators and fully developed map. Its plug & play electronics that give 1200+hp twin turbo Vipers traction control, very advanced boost control and all-day around town streetability. Pectel Viper kits have proven to be the best value and some of the biggest names in the business run them, including DC Performance, Viper Specialty and Underground Racing. Not to mention Vipers running in FIA GT in Europe and Brazil!

    Feel free to ask more questions, we're always glad to help!

    -Neel
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

  13. #38
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    So how was I wrong? I said $6 - 8k. $4k in the box with no options + sensors + options. Easily $8k. No harness, either.

    I know the details of the box, its a good ECU, but like I Pro EFI and Vipec are the only affordable options. I would love a Pectel, but I would also want all the options and I know my DTA setup started at around $2k for the box, but by time I was done adding sensors, accessories, connectors, pins, harness, I was up over $5k. When you start at $4k, it goes up rapidly - no need to pretend it doesn't Click here to enlarge

    BTW I know more about Pectel than you might know - we make hardware for them Click here to enlarge

    And no the SQ6 I saw sell was 3000 euro for the standard bosch motronic style connector. I found another one selling for 2200 euro used also with the bosch connector. Not the bosch motorsport circular connectors.

    Btw - Viper Specialty sells the SQ6 w/ drive by wire throttle, traction control, dual lambda, and 2MB internal logging for $5826.54 Click here to enlarge Sounds like I was dead nuts on in my price estimate of $6 - 8k. Thats $5826 w/ no sensors or harness Click here to enlarge
    Last edited by 5mall5nail5; 05-27-2011 at 11:56 PM.


  14. #39
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    Sorry, but your response is inaccurate.

    So how was I wrong? I said $6 - 8k. $4k in the box with no options + sensors + options. Easily $8k. No harness, either.
    Your assessment is incorrect. The only option most people get for the S54 kit is fly by wire, something that DTA doesn't even support. And at $390, it cheaper than any throttle cable conversion kit. One amazing thing about the SQ6 is it can run off the stock sensors. so:

    ECU: $3985
    Harness: $1000 for a basic setup.

    So $4985 for a kit nearly with full VANOS control using all stock sensors, if you go the direction that you did with a cable throttle. And even that price includes a harness that plugs right in and fires right up.

    Sure, many people like to add fuel & oil pressure sensors, custom harnessing options like mil-spec connectors or boost control solenoids, but they cost no more and it some cases less than those from DTA or any other lower-end kit. The reason is that Pectel features things like user-definable pull-ups and edge selection that makes it possible to add almost any sensor and actuator quickly. The options are way broader than a DTA, and the control is much finer.

    I know the details of the box, its a good ECU, but like I Pro EFI and Vipec are the only affordable options. I would love a Pectel, but I would also want all the options and I know my DTA setup started at around $2k for the box, but by time I was done adding sensors, accessories, connectors, pins, harness, I was up over $5k. When you start at $4k, it goes up rapidly - no need to pretend it doesn't Click here to enlarge
    I'm not pretending, I have actual customers running at the price I'm telling you, and my wiring harnesses are professionally built with mil-spec wire and completely plug & play - no accessories, connectors, pins or anything else required. You could have had a much better, more advanced ECU for not much more than what you paid for your DTA kit. I know this because most people call us after getting DTA pricing first. We tune DTAs and know them well. We don't sell them because we have a much better system at a great value.

    BTW I know more about Pectel than you might know - we make hardware for them Click here to enlarge
    I'm not sure what hardware you make for them, but you probably shouldn't claim you know more than we do. We've sold nearly 150 systems in the US and have quarterly visits from the founder of the company and technical manager. You might want to ask us first before you draw the conclusions you have.

    And no the SQ6 I saw sell was 3000 euro for the standard bosch motronic style connector. I found another one selling for 2200 euro used also with the bosch connector. Not the bosch motorsport circular connectors.
    Please let those people know that they can buy an SQ6 for brand new from me for less than 2800 Euro. I'd love to have their business. The circular connectors you speak of are not Bosch Motorsports, they're Deutch Autosports.

    Btw - Viper Specialty sells the SQ6 w/ drive by wire throttle, traction control, dual lambda, and 2MB internal logging for $5826.54 Click here to enlarge Sounds like I was dead nuts on in my price estimate of $6 - 8k. Thats $5826 w/ no sensors or harness Click here to enlarge
    They are selling a system that runs a V10 with dual electronic throttles, 2 banks of cylinders individually controlled for fuel, per-cylinder knock control, variable cam timing and fully sequential fuel & spark at that price. Just try to match that with anything else.

    You are comparing a system that runs a seriously complex engine to one for an S54, is that really fair? And almost all the cost over the S54 kit is irrelevant to the S54 - its additional features you would not have use for in your application.

    So I appreciate your research, but I find it odd that you're bringing up things you find from kits on the internet instead of the source, which is Apex Speed Technology. Beyond that, who do you buy a DTA kit from? Apex has 4 full-time technicians who build systems and tune cars and a support system including our web forums and real customer support that no one else competes with. Call us, email us or post on the forum and you get a hold of a real engineer who knows their stuff.

    I invite you and anyone else to talk to people around the world who have become part of the Apex family of customers. Go to our website, facebook, web forum or just google us! You'll find we speak the truth and deliver on what we promise!

    Kind Regards,

    -Neel
    Last edited by Apex Speed Technology; 05-28-2011 at 01:12 AM.
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

  15. #40
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Apex Speed Technology Click here to enlarge
    Your assessment is incorrect. The only option most people get for the S54 kit is fly by wire, something that DTA doesn't even support. And at $390, it cheaper than any throttle cable conversion kit. One amazing thing about the SQ6 is it can run off the stock sensors. so:
    Not sure why you like to compare to DTA so often, but yes, DTA supports fly by wire.


    ECU: $3985
    Harness: $1000 for a basic setup.

    So $4985 for a kit nearly with full VANOS control using all stock sensors, if you go the direction that you did with a cable throttle. And even that price includes a harness that plugs right in and fires right up.
    Right, so you're at $5k for the box + another ~$1000 by time you add EGT, fuel pressure, manifold pressure, oil pressure, boost control, etc. At LEAST $1000 (kavlico transducers are what, $150 - $250 each?)

    Sure, many people like to add fuel & oil pressure sensors, custom harnessing options like mil-spec connectors or boost control solenoids, but they cost no more and it some cases less than those from DTA or any other lower-end kit. The reason is that Pectel features things like user-definable pull-ups and edge selection that makes it possible to add almost any sensor and actuator quickly. The options are way broader than a DTA, and the control is much finer.

    I'm not pretending, I have actual customers running at the price I'm telling you, and my wiring harnesses are professionally built with mil-spec wire and completely plug & play - no accessories, connectors, pins or anything else required. You could have had a much better, more advanced ECU for not much more than what you paid for your DTA kit. I know this because most people call us after getting DTA pricing first. We tune DTAs and know them well. We don't sell them because we have a much better system at a great value.
    Again, not sure why you are comparing to DTA. Yes DTA doesn't have quite so many options. Its also not $6,000. I said Vipec and Pro EFI were more affordable. You have yet to prove me wrong. I didn't say Pectel sucks. I said Pectel is good and I would like one, but that Vipec and Pro EFI is more affordable - the end. But for some reason you're just proving what I said so...

    I'm not sure what hardware you make for them, but you probably shouldn't claim you know more than we do. We've sold nearly 150 systems in the US and have quarterly visits from the founder of the company and technical manager. You might want to ask us first before you draw the conclusions you have.
    LOL broski, where did I say I know more than you? Cosworth is a company of ours. I work with the engineers that put the circuits in the box. That's where I am coming from. I didn't once say anything about "knowing more". I said I may know more than you think I do.

    Please let those people know that they can buy an SQ6 for brand new from me for less than 2800 Euro. I'd love to have their business. The circular connectors you speak of are not Bosch Motorsports, they're Deutch Autosports.

    They are selling a system that runs a V10 with dual electronic throttles, 2 banks of cylinders individually controlled for fuel, per-cylinder knock control, variable cam timing and fully sequential fuel & spark at that price. Just try to match that with anything else.

    You are comparing a system that runs a seriously complex engine to one for an S54, is that really fair? And almost all the cost over the S54 kit is irrelevant to the S54 - its additional features you would not have use for in your application.

    So I appreciate your research, but I find it odd that you're bringing up things you find from kits on the internet instead of the source, which is Apex Speed Technology. Beyond that, who do you buy a DTA kit from? Apex has 4 full-time technicians who build systems and tune cars and a support system including our web forums and real customer support that no one else competes with. Call us, email us or post on the forum and you get a hold of a real engineer who knows their stuff.

    I invite you and anyone else to talk to people around the world who have become part of the Apex family of customers. Go to our website, facebook, web forum or just google us! You'll find we speak the truth and deliver on what we promise!

    Kind Regards,

    -Neel
    Again with the DTA - I didn't once bring up DTA other than to say that by time I added all my stuff in I was knee deep. Personally Neel I find your presumptions/truncation/assumptions/paraphrasing to be rather irritating when you're interpreting what I am saying as something else all together. I know your business does a good job - that's awesome. However, all I said was that Vipec and Pro EFI are more affordable than Pectel... and it's true. I quoted a price range to expect to pay for an S54 turbo car... and its true. Yeah sure if you don't want to know your fuel pressure or oil pressure or how hot your manifold is, then you can get out of Pectel at $5k (which is only $1k off from my estimate). But add those rather mandatory sensors in and some wiring/connectors, and you're right back where I quoted.


  16. #41
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Apex Speed Technology Click here to enlarge
    On another note, I just did some research and found people online claiming DTA's are 1/3rd the price of Pectel systems. This is misguided to the point of dishonesty and I think its too bad. We aren't the cheapest, but the best value. We have invested as much in our business to support our customers as we have in developing the product. In the end, its up to the customers to decide what they want, I just want to make sure the information here is honest and accurate.

    -Neel
    Why are you so hung up on DTA? You realize you're talking about it with yourself, right? I mentioned how much more affordable ProEFI and Vipec are. DTA itself is $1700 for a S80 Pro. S100 is around $1900 - $2000 to control dual vanos. The drive by wire computer and module are 500E, so like $800 or so. Again, having nothing to do with the conversation and all.


  17. #42
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 5mall5nail5 Click here to enlarge
    Not sure why you like to compare to DTA so often, but yes, DTA supports fly by wire.
    Likely due to your love affair with DTA.

  18. #43
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 5mall5nail5 Click here to enlarge
    BTW I know more about Pectel than you might know - we make hardware for the
    Just wanted to clarify this statement as it caused some consternation.

    I think what you mean by this is that you may know more about the Pectel than Neel might anticipate you know, not that you know more than he does about their units. Correct?

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    This is what I do for a living.

    Why are you so hung up on DTA? You realize you're talking about it with yourself, right? I mentioned how much more affordable ProEFI and Vipec are. DTA itself is $1700 for a S80 Pro. S100 is around $1900 - $2000 to control dual vanos. The drive by wire computer and module are 500E, so like $800 or so. Again, having nothing to do with the conversation and all.
    Not sure why you like to compare to DTA so often, but yes, DTA supports fly by wire.
    I am using DTA as an example because you brought it up - but the same applies to any ECU you want to compare it to. S100 is $2000 for Dual Vanos, but you also have to buy a $300 USB-CAN adapter to program it. Your drive by wire module is quoted at $800 but I have yet to see one in the states. Also, you have to add the cost of extra harnessing to wire in that box - in our shop that might be $200 Now we're up to $3300.

    So you are right, there is a real world $1100 difference in the price of the boxes. But you have 2 boxes and a comms adapter, plus more complex harnessing and your system is less capable. For the cost of a set of tires you are getting a lot more.

    Right, so you're at $5k for the box + another ~$1000 by time you add EGT, fuel pressure, manifold pressure, oil pressure, boost control, etc. At LEAST $1000 (kavlico transducers are what, $150 - $250 each?)
    Yeah sure if you don't want to know your fuel pressure or oil pressure or how hot your manifold is, then you can get out of Pectel at $5k (which is only $1k off from my estimate). But add those rather mandatory sensors in and some wiring/connectors, and you're right back where I quoted.
    But we're comparing apples to apples. The cost is exactly the same for those components on any system. But in the real world, we can have that functionality for less with a Pectel. For example, if you don't want to use the $150 Kavlico sensors, Pectel also directly supports VDO 2-wire 10 bar sensors as well, that cost $67. You can't even use those with many other systems. The reason I'm not including all the other components you speak of is that their pricing is no different whatever system you run. So what's relevant here is ECU price for a given capability - specifically dual vanos, drive-by-wire and communications capability.

    I said I may know more than you think I do.
    What you actually said was:

    I know more about Pectel than you might know - we make hardware for them
    One way to read this is as a comparison of our product knowledge, hence my response.

    Cosworth is a company of ours. I work with the engineers that put the circuits in the box.
    If you work for KPLJ, you should have called us! I would have definitely sold you a system for what you paid for your DTA. If you work with the engineers, please give Steve Phillips, Roland Meister, Oli, Charles and the rest of the gang a call - they'll verify what we are saying about the product. You should also note technical details about the quality of the hardware - a billet case versus an extrusion, the board layout and design, components they used - if you are in the electrical hardware business you should be able to lay any of these cheaper boxed beside the Pectel and see the difference - its pretty stark.

    Its unfortunate that you find my response irritating. I found yours to be misinformed and my goal is to keep these discussion honest. Your original quote was:

    By time you get a Pectel with the options unlocked to run what the AEM does, you will have a $6 - $8,000 box with no harness... seriously.
    You are misrepresenting the price of my product by $2-4k. That's a big deal, you are out there telling people my product - your words being "box with no harness" costs 50-100% more than it actually does.

    So let's try to agree on this:

    Pectel's actual cost over the ECU you are using is about $1100. For the extra $1100, you get:

    1. Built-in, advanced knock control.
    2. Ethernet-Based comms.
    3. 4 calibrations per ECU.
    4. The ability to turn it into an integrated data system with ECU-controlled dash displays, GPS, 2GB of logging, etc.
    5. More advanced inputs and outputs - the Pectel has 2 EGTs built in, standard, plus up to 48 analog inputs, so you can run a lot more sensors. Plus 2 can buses, stepper motor control and more.
    6. A company with a full tech and engineering staff dedicated to supporting your product.

    So I get your point, for bottom line pricing, there are some boxes that are 30% cheaper. But my point is for most customers, Pectel is the better value - and the cost difference may become nothing as they develop their car.

    By the way, we are Vi-PEC and AEM dealers and have sold several S54 kits. But I found that once you added the 4 channel ignition amplifier and some external bits to run the stock IAC, we were in a similar situation. So now we concentrate on Pectel since the customer who wants to save an extra $1100 at the very bottom end is probably not the best fit for us anyway.

    Its unfortunate that this has become contentious but you did make inaccurate claims about the price of my product that I feel should be addressed, for the better of this whole community.

    -Neel
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Just wanted to clarify this statement as it caused some consternation.

    I think what you mean by this is that you may know more about the Pectel than Neel might anticipate you know, not that you know more than he does about their units. Correct?
    Precisely - I am saying "I know more about Pectel than you [think I might know]" - not "i know more than you".


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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Apex Speed Technology Click here to enlarge
    I am using DTA as an example because you brought it up - but the same applies to any ECU you want to compare it to. S100 is $2000 for Dual Vanos, but you also have to buy a $300 USB-CAN adapter to program it. Your drive by wire module is quoted at $800 but I have yet to see one in the states. Also, you have to add the cost of extra harnessing to wire in that box - in our shop that might be $200 Now we're up to $3300.

    So you are right, there is a real world $1100 difference in the price of the boxes. But you have 2 boxes and a comms adapter, plus more complex harnessing and your system is less capable. For the cost of a set of tires you are getting a lot more.



    But we're comparing apples to apples. The cost is exactly the same for those components on any system. But in the real world, we can have that functionality for less with a Pectel. For example, if you don't want to use the $150 Kavlico sensors, Pectel also directly supports VDO 2-wire 10 bar sensors as well, that cost $67. You can't even use those with many other systems. The reason I'm not including all the other components you speak of is that their pricing is no different whatever system you run. So what's relevant here is ECU price for a given capability - specifically dual vanos, drive-by-wire and communications capability.



    What you actually said was:



    One way to read this is as a comparison of our product knowledge, hence my response.



    If you work for KPLJ, you should have called us! I would have definitely sold you a system for what you paid for your DTA. If you work with the engineers, please give Steve Phillips, Roland Meister, Oli, Charles and the rest of the gang a call - they'll verify what we are saying about the product. You should also note technical details about the quality of the hardware - a billet case versus an extrusion, the board layout and design, components they used - if you are in the electrical hardware business you should be able to lay any of these cheaper boxed beside the Pectel and see the difference - its pretty stark.
    Sorry man done arguing - you know what I am saying. And I didn't mention DTA as "affordable". Everyone who asks me "Should I go with a DTA?" I first say "well... take the box price... and add about $2k on it. I am completely honest. I have no love affair with DTA and personally right now I am frustrated with mine (actually, its my car that I am frustrated... up to my elbows right now re-wiring things). I have used an abundance of ECUs especially for a hobbyist (haltech, vems, ms, dta, tec3, aem, wolf, kms, 034, efi tech, autronic, off the top of my head) and have been subjected to each of them in their own little charming ways. What I am saying, though, is very simple - of the ECUs that Batta mentioned or the topic is discussing, Vipec and ProEFI are the most affordable. Period. No arguing. Pectel is great. I'd love one. But its not affordable. Nor is it cheap to add onto. The ProEFI offers a lot. Vipec offers a lot. Vipec didn't really catch on - dunno if it will. Though, Autronic didn't make a huge showing in the US either. But regardless, of the Vipec/ProEFI vs Pectel, you can't argue that Pectel isn't more expensive. Yes, it has "more stuff". But to an HPF owner coming from an AEM junkbox, the ProEFI/Vipec is WORLDS better... for considerably less than Pectel.

    Also, I didn't mean "company of ours" - it was late and I was tired. I mean that Cosworth Electronics is a customer of ours.


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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 5mall5nail5 Click here to enlarge
    Precisely - I am saying "I know more about Pectel than you [think I might know]" - not "i know more than you".
    It could have been interpreted either way due to how it was phrased but glad we clarified.

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    Apex Speed Tech is my technical support....

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    the vid is sick Click here to enlarge

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    Neel don't bother trying to reason with this guy he knows all! LOL comparing a Pectel to a pro efi is a joke! They are not even in the same world! The pro efi does nothing new. I can personally vouche for the price i have one on my car and it did not cost 6000 you do not know what you are talking about! And yes i have all the sensor capabilities, traction control drive by wire etc. I have always stood up for you as i think you have alot of knowledge in the bmw fi scene but you are way off base here and flat out wrong!

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