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  1. #1
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    Procede v5 update

    Great fing news from shiv

    Hey Guys,
    Iíll let the whole cat out of the bag next week but hereís a just a quick peek at one of the things that v5 firmware will support:

    3-bar MAP Sensor Load Referencing
    All us tuners know, either through actual testing (preferably) or through customer trial and error (ouch!), that the factory DME can only read up to 22psi of boost. And since all the fastest stock turbos run 20+psi boost, having a load reference sensor that can read substantially higher is important when it comes to proper ignition timing and boost control when things don't go as planned. And for cars with upgraded turbos capable of running well over 20psi of boost, a capable load sensor will be the difference between a broken engine and a happy engine.

    So by freeing up another redundant analog input, we can now (for the first time) feed a actual MANIFOLD pressure signal via an external 3-bar MAP sensor into the Procede. Not only does this now let the Procede read manifold vacuum (negative boost), it also allows the Procede to read (and react to) boost pressures of up to 30psi. Plenty of headroom for even the most outrageous turbo system.

    And since the pressure is coming from the manifold and not the charge pipe, the Procede will now read actually boost (manifold pressure) and not ďpre-boostĒ (pressure before throttle body). This means a cleaner, more accurate pressure reading that is free of throttle induced pressure spikes.

    Click here to enlarge

    The 3-bar MAP sensor option consists of a Delphi sensor, a plug-and-play harness (taps into factory TMAP sensor for power and ground) and a 3-foot long signal wire that routes to the Procede harness. This way, you can plumb the MAP sensor just inches away from the pressure source for the fastest, least degraded signal response. We do NOT recommended mounting the MAP sensor in the ECU box or on the firewall since the long vacuum line will add an unwanted delay to the signal. In fact, for those running big fat turbos at high boost, we even recommended going a step further and tapping a new nipple into your plastic manifold so that the MAP sensor gets itís own dedicated signal.

    Below is a datalog I took today of a 3rd to 4th gear run. You can see that the new boost reference is smoother and free of throttle blade induced spikes. Simply put, using it for load referencing will result in better boost control (even with stock turbos) and better tuning while providing plenty of overhead to run BIG boost when the need arises. Also plotted is AFR from both banks, actual throttle blade angle, TMAP pressure, DME ignition advance and RPM. Notice how the 3bar sensor reads slightly different

    Click here to enlarge

    Our 335 will soon be going under the knife for a nice single turbo setup so I should have some interesting logs to post early next year. Do it right. Do it once.

    More next week!

    Cheers,
    Shiv
    Click here to enlarge

  2. #2
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    Very nice. Looks like Vishnu is thinking ahead and preparing the PROcede for upcoming turbo upgrades.

    Wonder who's doing the upgraded single turbo for them? Maybe AR ? (don't quote me, this is just MY own speculation)
    Click here to enlarge

  3. #3
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Got PSI Click here to enlarge
    Very nice. Looks like Vishnu is thinking ahead and preparing the PROcede for upcoming turbo upgrades.

    Wonder who's doing the upgraded single turbo for them? Maybe AR ? (don't quote me, this is just MY own speculation)
    ETS has been hinting at a few things. At least the fuel delivery system.

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    Highly doubt AR is doing it for them
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    Who ever it is this is great news. The more options the better. By the looks of things we going to have to marry our cars with all the progress happening.

  6. #6
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    i for one am very excited. the only downside i can see is it will delay the dyno Click here to enlarge lol. but really like george said this is great news, thanks for the bring-over lamia. i really cant wait for v5 it seems, it should be a real game changer on upgraded turbos, twin or single.
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    More turbo options is great news.

    V5 must have something more to it than just 3bar sensor ability. 3bar sensor scaling is essential addition for me and a few others, but not really needed for the most and hence V5 renaming should be based on something more.

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    Standback 2 has had 3bar map sensor and some people run it already.

  9. #9
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    so does this mean V4 is copying from SB2 Click here to enlarge ?

    Thanks for keeping us updated Click here to enlarge

    **EDIT**

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 654 Click here to enlarge
    Standback 2 has had 3bar map sensor and some people run it already.
    damn, you beat me to it

  10. #10
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    Excellent! I wonder if this is linked in any way to the Standback 2 developments. They use similar hardware, correct?

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    LOL, here we go.

  12. #12
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    so does this mean V4 is copying from SB2 Click here to enlarge ?

    Thanks for keeping us updated Click here to enlarge

    **EDIT**


    damn, you beat me to it
    Well its haltech based so no reason why it cant run the GM 3 bar map sensor.

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    0 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lamia2super Click here to enlarge
    Highly doubt AR is doing it for them
    Highly doubt is a good way to put it Click here to enlarge

  15. #15
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Matt@Camber-Toe Click here to enlarge
    Well its haltech based so no reason why it cant run the GM 3 bar map sensor.
    Of course, ANY of the tuners can do it. just find it funny in the hipocracy. (XXX rides our coatails and steals our stuff all the time Click here to enlarge... But we can copy from XX-x Click here to enlarge )

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    Of course, ANY of the tuners can do it. just find it funny in the hipocracy. (XXX rides our coatails and steals our stuff all the time Click here to enlarge... But we can copy from XX-x Click here to enlarge )
    3 bar map sensor capabilities isn't exactly innovative (unlike CAN integration). Thats been done many times over on multiple different platforms. Thats not even the point for me..BMS said autotuning is unnecessary and CPS offsetting isn't needed etc. But now they are offering it.

    Vishnu never bashed 3 bar map sensor capabilities, but back OT.

  17. #17
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by supracg Click here to enlarge
    3 bar map sensor capabilities isn't exactly innovative (unlike CAN integration). Thats been done many times over on multiple different platforms. Thats not even the point for me..BMS said autotuning is unnecessary and CPS offsetting isn't needed etc. But now they are offering it.

    Vishnu never bashed 3 bar map sensor capabilities, but back OT.
    autotuning isnt neccessary, i dont believe in it, i never have. its backwards tuning. will people throw it in there, sure why not, no reason not to offer it. Its a feature, some people might want it

    so your saying CAN has never been accessed on any car before? WOW, the N54 is the ONLY platform to do this on? Because it sounds to me like it was just the first to offer it on this model. Wait a sec.. SB2 was the first to offer 3bar sensor on this model.. thats sounds like the same argument then now doesnt it?

  18. #18
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by supracg Click here to enlarge
    BMS said autotuning is unnecessary and CPS offsetting isn't needed etc. But now they are offering it.
    Now I'm starting to think you guys just make this stuff up? CPS offsetting is unnecessary but I've always liked the idea of automatically monitoring knock and setting the tuning accordingly. It's true I've never been thrilled with the implementation and hype but the fundamental idea is solid. And hardly an original one.

    If Vishnu wants to present an external boost sensor as original then so be it. I personally find it comical that they warn against the dangers of a long vacuum line to the TMAP sensor yet their methanol implementation of choice probably has 12' of vacuum line to the methanol controller.

  19. #19
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    When did I present adding a new higher range load sensor as original? Us tuners have been doing it for decades. CAN integration, closed loop timing and boost control based upon historic knock retard activity, not so much.

    Shiv

  20. #20
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu Click here to enlarge
    When did I present adding a new higher range load sensor as original? Us tuners have been doing it for decades. CAN integration, closed loop timing and boost control based upon historic knock retard activity, not so much.

    Shiv
    actually SHiv, you didnt. I made the correlation between how x company throws a hissy fit and says that Y company copies off of them, but X company will turn right around and do the same and copy from Z company, and well, you can see where the connection was made.

    It wasnt you this time, just a groupie Click here to enlarge

    Cheers,

    LM

  21. #21
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    comon LM, try to be a bit more open and objective. shiv didnt even start this thread, although he did bump it lol. you could argue that shiv is 'copying ideas' from cp-e but i think thats bs. this was the logical next step, people are pushing the limits much higher with the power of upgraded turbos. fueling will be our biggest hurdle once we can boost higher safely. hopefully unfor's system will be tested rigorously and then become available soon for the rest of us.
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  22. #22
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    Im thankful that this was posted here. And I agree it is the logical next step. But does nobody see the irony in the situation? I could say what you just said, in every "Vs" thread there is.

  23. #23
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    Jeez, LM, you're on the prowl for any chance you can get huh?
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  24. #24
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    always.

  25. #25
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    I do not understand why these threads go in this direction each and every time. Lost Marine if you got so much confidence in the JB3 tune why you holding back? Why are we not seeing any 500whp dynos? Its not so hard to set up it seems since you do not even find autotune which even the stock DME has necessary. Damn if I had those puppies on my car it would be sitting at 20.5psi from day one or have you got pics of melted pistons inpregnated in your mind?

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