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    Car keeps blowing LPFP fuse. This aggression will not stand.

    Hey all,

    So since the FFTEC pump went in about a month ago, my car has smoked the same fuse twice, leaving me stranded. I want to say it's the 20 amp #70 but I don't recall, it was a lime green fuse i'd have to re-check. But it's def fuel related, so i'm clearly drawing too many amps and popping it courtesy of the twin low pressure pumps. Does anyone have thoughts as to why, and how to remedy it? Tony suggested I go up to 25 amps for the fuse, wanted to see what the rest of the community thought, I certainly appreciate the help in advance.

    I'm thinking it has to be a wiring issue with the FFTEC pump to the OE LPFP, though there is nothing exotic about wiring this particular pump up, it's no different than a Walbro 255.

    In terms of symptoms it's pretty simple, the fuse goes out of nowhere and fuel pressure at the rail takes a bath. I didn't even bother trying to get the car re-started more than once this time, was obvious right away what the problem was.

    Have at it BB Click here to enlarge
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    Hey all,

    So since the FFTEC pump went in about a month ago, my car has smoked the same fuse twice, leaving me stranded. I want to say it's the 20 amp #70 but I don't recall, it was a lime green fuse i'd have to re-check. But it's def fuel related, so i'm clearly drawing too many amps and popping it courtesy of the twin low pressure pumps. Does anyone have thoughts as to why, and how to remedy it? Tony suggested I go up to 25 amps for the fuse, wanted to see what the rest of the community thought, I certainly appreciate the help in advance.

    I'm thinking it has to be a wiring issue with the FFTEC pump to the OE LPFP, though there is nothing exotic about wiring this particular pump up, it's no different than a Walbro 255.

    In terms of symptoms it's pretty simple, the fuse goes out of nowhere and fuel pressure at the rail takes a bath. I didn't even bother trying to get the car re-started more than once this time, was obvious right away what the problem was.

    Have at it BB Click here to enlarge

    I replaced my 20 amp with a 25 amp immediately after installing mine pats. It's been trouble free for me so far, going on 6 + months.
    E92 N54 3368lbs

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by R.G. Click here to enlarge
    I replaced my 20 amp with a 25 amp immediately after installing mine pats. It's been trouble free for me so far, going on 6 + months.
    Thanks for the quick response bud.

    Yea that makes the most sense, Tony was very clear and I appreciated that.

    Is it indeed fuse #70 that's the lime green 20 amp? I need to re-check, I could be totally making that up. Off the top of my head it makes perfect sense to go up to 25 amps, anything higher than that would start to concern me. I'll see if anyone else has a different idea on the culprit, but again that seems to make the most sense. You now have two pumps drawing ampage, so clearly the stock 20 amp is going to pop. Surprised this hasn't been an issue for more people running twin pumps on the low pressure side. Hm.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    Can't recall the fuse number off hand but will try to to double check for you this afternoon. Curious as to if you reset adaptations after install? Whats your LPFP PSI range on logs? Since I use Cobb I actually disconnected my battery for 4-5 hours after the install to attempt to reset "all" adaptations.
    From what I understood at that the time, the fuse swap was more of a precautionary measure. Seems a bit unusual yours popped twice but it could be just bad luck.
    E92 N54 3368lbs

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by R.G. Click here to enlarge
    Can't recall the fuse number off hand but will try to to double check for you this afternoon. Curious as to if you reset adaptations after install? Whats your LPFP PSI range on logs? Since I use Cobb I actually disconnected my battery for 4-5 hours after the install to attempt to reset "all" adaptations.
    From what I understood at that the time, the fuse swap was more of a precautionary measure. Seems a bit unusual yours popped twice but it could be just bad luck.
    I reset adaptations with the BT cable, so yes.

    It's been providing too much PSI low pressure for sure. mid 80s at idle, spikes into the 90s at the onset of WOT then settles into high 70s-low 80s. The only log I have with it was right after resetting adaptations, so trims etc are all over the place, and it's not very useful. But yes, IMO it's providing too much pressure and i'm not sure if the two are related. I was told that in and of itself was not something to worry about.

    I agree it's odd mine keeps going. The wiring is identical to any other inline pump, so I would think people would be blowing fuses all over the place. Like I said, i'm open to any/all ideas. Having a tow truck on speed dial is not an acceptable outcome.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    @MikeB@FFTEC
    @Anthony@FFTEC

    Your insight would be particularly useful, thanks everyone.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    It's been providing too much PSI low pressure for sure. mid 80s at idle, spikes into the 90s at the onset of WOT then settles into high 70s-low 80s.
    I remember having a similar problem when I first installed the pump. Was getting intermittent fuel pump warnings on my idrive and after driving around with my eye on my LPFP noticed it was triggering when PSI was greater then 86 PSI. Spoke to Vishnu and they advised it was normal but a few local guys weren't having the same problem. Adjusted my fuel scalar higher, flashed and re flashed the ecu, swapped fuse and PSI just settled. Problem went away.
    E92 N54 3368lbs

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by R.G. Click here to enlarge
    I remember having a similar problem when I first installed the pump. Was getting intermittent fuel pump warnings on my idrive and after driving around with my eye on my LPFP noticed it was triggering when PSI was greater then 86 PSI. Spoke to Vishnu and they advised it was normal but a few local guys weren't having the same problem. Adjusted my fuel scalar higher, flashed and re flashed the ecu, swapped fuse and PSI just settled. Problem went away.
    Yea right now i'm thinking

    1. adjust 3d scalars for more headroom
    2. Go up to 25 amp for whichever one is the low pressure fuel, think it's 70.

    Thanks for the help man
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    IMO...if you are seeing pressure of 80psi+ while at idle or cruising...you are over driving the fuel system and this is why you are blowing fuses. The DME for whatever reason isn't able to control the flows via the pwm and you are pushing too much fuel and overwhelming the regulator.

    If the fuel system is operating properly, the DME will maintain between 70 and 80psi at idle and cruise without a regulator. At WOT (100% PWM), it doesn't matter as you're using more fuel and the regulator is able to perform it's function.

    JMO based on what I've seen and what I run.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Ethanol.tester Click here to enlarge
    IMO...if you are seeing pressure of 80psi+ while at idle or cruising...you are over driving the fuel system and this is why you are blowing fuses. The DME for whatever reason isn't able to control the flows via the pwm and you are pushing too much fuel and overwhelming the regulator.

    If the fuel system is operating properly, the DME will maintain between 70 and 80psi at idle and cruise without a regulator. At WOT (100% PWM), it doesn't matter as you're using more fuel and the regulator is able to perform it's function.

    JMO based on what I've seen and what I run.
    I don't disagree. Was thinking more fuel scalar would help, what do you think?
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    Honestly, I've never tried manipulating it that way. It may cause other issues but worth a shot, just make sure your trims, both STFT and LTFT, and AFRs stay in check.

    I don't have any experience with the pump you are using. It may be that it can't be PWM controlled...no idea, but I do know that some can't. I have a Fuelab pump that can't...too bad as I wish I could give it a go in the tank.

    I'm actually currently running 3 pumps (testing purposes) and an external boost referenced regulator that is set to 83psi + boost and don't have the issues you're seeing. My lpfp pressures at idle and light cruise is a very constant 73psi with the stock regulator removed and plugged. Consequently it seems as the DME can do a very good job of regulating pressure if given the opportunity. Of those three pumps...one is also an in tank inline (255) pump wired in parallel.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Ethanol.tester Click here to enlarge
    Honestly, I've never tried manipulating it that way. It may cause other issues but worth a shot, just make sure your trims, both STFT and LTFT, and AFRs stay in check.

    I don't have any experience with the pump you are using. It may be that it can't be PWM controlled...no idea, but I do know that some can't. I have a Fuelab pump that can't...too bad as I wish I could give it a go in the tank.

    I'm actually currently running 3 pumps (testing purposes) and an external boost referenced regulator that is set to 83psi + boost and don't have the issues you're seeing. My lpfp pressures at idle and light cruise is a very constant 73psi with the stock regulator removed and plugged. Consequently it seems as the DME can do a very good job of regulating pressure if given the opportunity. Of those three pumps...one is also an in tank inline (255) pump wired in parallel.
    The FFTEC pump is just a 455 with an adapter to run inline, the wiring etc is not at all exotic. So it wires up no differently than a "normal" inline setup. Which is why i'm not so sure it's a install issue. At the same time, I agree it shouldn't be providing so much fuel pressure and resetting adaptations hasn't done anything. I really need to get this sorted out, the car is blowing these 20 amps all over the place.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    the car is blowing these 20 amps all over the place.
    Have you tried replacing it by a 25 amp or even with a silver quarter?

    (just joking on the quarter)

    I would put a 25 amp and see what happens. If IT blows, then you know something is drawing too much amperage. It is possible that one or even both pumps are bad. Trying different pumps will help pin point the issue in that case.

    And if the 25 amp doesn't blow, hugs all around?

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    If the DME is sensing something is wrong...it'll go in to a bit of a safe mode of sorts. At which time it'll give the LPFP a 100% PWM signal the entire time.

    Take a log at idle, cruise, and WOT making sure to log the LPFP requested and LPFP actual pressures if you have the ability.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Ethanol.tester Click here to enlarge
    If the DME is sensing something is wrong...it'll go in to a bit of a safe mode of sorts. At which time it'll give the LPFP a 100% PWM signal the entire time.

    Take a log at idle, cruise, and WOT making sure to log the LPFP requested and LPFP actual pressures if you have the ability.
    This is a log but it was shortly after resetting adaptations, so trims etc are all over the place. Not sure if it's representative but FWIW. It throws the 2aae shadow code but other than destroying 20 amp fuses it doesn't do anything odd. Drives beautifully and no limp mode or obvious fueling issues. Pressure at the rail is just high coming off the LPFP, obviously. Older logs trims were beautiful, and again all the pumps are brand new.

    http://www.datazap.me/u/135pats/3-5
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by AlexQuattro Click here to enlarge
    Have you tried replacing it by a 25 amp or even with a silver quarter?

    (just joking on the quarter)

    I would put a 25 amp and see what happens. If IT blows, then you know something is drawing too much amperage. It is possible that one or even both pumps are bad. Trying different pumps will help pin point the issue in that case.

    And if the 25 amp doesn't blow, hugs all around?
    What's the downside of a 25 amp fuse if it's say a wiring installation issue? I'm an electronics noob.

    But that's what i'm inclined to do. Especially if the wiring looks good and there are no shorts, etc.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    What's the downside of a 25 amp fuse if it's say a wiring installation issue?
    Only risk is if the wire gage can't support 25 amps and starts to melt and cause a fire but I doubt that will happen. It's not like you are putting a 50 amp fuse.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    and there are no shorts
    If there was a short, the fuse would blow as soon as you turn the key. That's what the fuse is supposed to do.

    Do you have any specs on the pumps? Like operating watts?

    We could be able to calculate the amps the pumps need and if we come up with, say 10 amps, then we know something is wrong because you have twice the amount of amps going through but if it's like 18 amps, that could make a 20 amp fuse blow. A 20 amp fuse doesn't necessarily blow at 20.00000000..... amps.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by AlexQuattro Click here to enlarge
    Only risk is if the wire gage can't support 25 amps and starts to melt and cause a fire but I doubt that will happen. It's not like you are putting a 50 amp fuse.



    If there was a short, the fuse would blow as soon as you turn the key. That's what the fuse is supposed to do.

    Do you have any specs on the pumps? Like operating watts?

    We could be able to calculate the amps the pumps need and if we come up with, say 10 amps, then we know something is wrong because you have twice the amount of amps going through but if it's like 18 amps, that could make a 20 amp fuse blow. A 20 amp fuse doesn't necessarily blow at 20.00000000..... amps.
    Those are the numbers I found for the Walbro E85 pump, it's the pump that usually runs in-tank. The FFTEC pump just has an adaptor so it runs inline.

    Technical Pump Specifications Overall pump length: 121mm main Housing Dia.: 39mm Lower Housing Dia.: 50mm Fuel inlet Dia.: 11mm OD Fuel Outlet Dia.: 11mm OD Flow rate: 400LPH @ 40PSI Test Voltage: 13.5 Volts


    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    Those are the numbers I found for the Walbro E85 pump, it's the pump that usually runs in-tank. The FFTEC pump just has an adaptor so it runs inline.

    Technical Pump Specifications Overall pump length: 121mm main Housing Dia.: 39mm Lower Housing Dia.: 50mm Fuel inlet Dia.: 11mm OD Fuel Outlet Dia.: 11mm OD Flow rate: 400LPH @ 40PSI Test Voltage: 13.5 Volts


    Ya it only gives voltage which is no help for us.

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    5 out of 5 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    To start with...unfortunately I can't post images or links because I don't have enough rep. But...the 450 pump at 80psi/13.5 volts shows it pulls 18.68amps. Of course there is more to that picture than that because you are running two pumps plumbed in serial and wired in parallel. So the efficiency of the the 450 goes up, but you're also running the stock pump off the same source.

    As to your log, the LPFP looks normal but I still want to see it at idle. Are you running a OTS E30 map?

    As for your STFTs...it appears your scalar could use some adjustment but you should also log the LTFTs to see the whole picture. Other than that, they look fine.

    Your HPFP looks normal for what you're running. You must be running an auto.

    I concur with going to a 25amp fuse.

    BTW, I have run that pump, just not in that configuration. It ran fine and was a strong running pump, the only reason I ditched it was to test other options with a stock bucket.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Ethanol.tester Click here to enlarge
    To start with...unfortunately I can't post images or links because I don't have enough rep.
    Yes you do.

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    Thanks...
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Ethanol.tester Click here to enlarge
    Thanks...
    It's kinda hard to see.....

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Ethanol.tester Click here to enlarge
    To start with...unfortunately I can't post images or links because I don't have enough rep. But...the 450 pump at 80psi/13.5 volts shows it pulls 18.68amps. Of course there is more to that picture than that because you are running two pumps plumbed in serial and wired in parallel. So the efficiency of the the 450 goes up, but you're also running the stock pump off the same source.As to your log, the LPFP looks normal but I still want to see it at idle. Are you running a OTS E30 map?As for your STFTs...it appears your scalar could use some adjustment but you should also log the LTFTs to see the whole picture. Other than that, they look fine.Your HPFP looks normal for what you're running. You must be running an auto.I concur with going to a 25amp fuse.BTW, I have run that pump, just not in that configuration. It ran fine and was a strong running pump, the only reason I ditched it was to test other options with a stock bucket.
    That's a very helpful post, I appreciate it. Yes that log is OTS E30, i'm not running anything aggressive until I get this sorted. That map needs fuel scalar work, no question. Yes it's 6AT, the HPFP is brand new but as you noted it flows par for the course. I will log fuel pressure at idle when I get the car back. Right now I think going up to a 25 amp plug (after inspecting the wiring etc in tank one more time) is the solution. Sounds like when it spikes above 20 amps, which it certainly could do, it blows the fuse.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....PPK otherwise Stock
    Click here to enlarge

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    You put that 25 amp fuse in, your entering a world of pain....a world of pain. Click here to enlarge

    All jokes aside sounds like your best bet.

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