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  1. #51
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bimmer305 Click here to enlarge
    Log:

    Load requested
    Actual load
    TPS Act
    Req. boost
    Boost mean
    Actual load and TPS are there and target load is 195 in most places. I'm not trying to diagnose throttle closures or boost control.


    What are you hoping to see with those? I'm open to ideas.
    Change is constant

  2. #52
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
    I agree. A couple of my plugs looked similar to that and I was losing timing. Swapped plugs and have full timing again. I need to figure out why its happening too though.
    Yeah, I ordered the NGKs. Will see what effect, if any, it has.
    Change is constant

  3. #53
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BavarianBullet Click here to enlarge
    That plug looks like it's getting either light oil contamination (most likely), too much fuel or fuel is hitting it directly from a bad injector spray pattern. Was it significantly different than the other plugs?

    If it was mine, I'd do a leakdown test to check for bad rings. $50 for a tester, just need an air compressor. Compression tests are so-so and will only tell you some things. Leakdown is much better and you can put your hand over the intake, exhaust or PCV and noting where the air is escaping to get an idea.

    You might have damaged or pinched a ring which could be letting oil by. Or it could be a bad valve guide. Hopefully none of the above but that plug is getting some carbon on it from something.
    I can do a leakdown test, however it only tells you where the air is escaping. The compression test tells you if any significant compression variance exists. With 150psi (175 with the injectors unplugged), I expect a very small (5%) leakdown so there won't be much, if any, air to listen for. Good idea on the plugs.
    Change is constant

  4. #54
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by The Ghost Click here to enlarge
    Actual load and TPS are there and target load is 195 in most places. I'm not trying to diagnose throttle closures or boost control.


    What are you hoping to see with those? I'm open to ideas.
    I want to see if you are overshooting load or boost. Because the DME will pull timing and close throttle when overshooting. I have found by personal experience that #5 is the first one to take the hit, always, I don't know why.

    Just and easy option to check off, plus I have seen you are getting some throttle closures.
    Cobb E30 / DCI / VRSF Downpipes / VRSF 7" Intercooler / Walbro LPFP / E85

  5. #55
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bimmer305 Click here to enlarge
    I want to see if you are overshooting load or boost. Because the DME will pull timing and close throttle when overshooting. I have found by personal experience that #5 is the first one to take the hit, always, I don't know why.

    Just and easy option to check off, plus I have seen you are getting some throttle closures.
    Overshooting load or boost results on a global reduction of timing, not just a single cylinder. It also reduces the timing target, not reduces timing by means of a timing correction.
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

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  6. #56
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    Overshooting load or boost results on a global reduction of timing, not just a single cylinder. It also reduces the timing target, not reduces timing by means of a timing correction.
    Wrong.
    Cobb E30 / DCI / VRSF Downpipes / VRSF 7" Intercooler / Walbro LPFP / E85

  7. #57
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bimmer305 Click here to enlarge
    Wrong.
    Proof?
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  8. #58
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bimmer305 Click here to enlarge
    I want to see if you are overshooting load or boost. Because the DME will pull timing and close throttle when overshooting. I have found by personal experience that #5 is the first one to take the hit, always, I don't know why.

    Just and easy option to check off, plus I have seen you are getting some throttle closures.
    Cyl 5 is in a nasty location, makes sense it would see the highest BP and combustion temps. It’s almost always the noisiest cylinder on both my N54s.
    E88 N54 w stuff
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  9. #59
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by The Ghost Click here to enlarge
    I can do a leakdown test, however it only tells you where the air is escaping. The compression test tells you if any significant compression variance exists. With 150psi (175 with the injectors unplugged), I expect a very small (5%) leakdown so there won't be much, if any, air to listen for. Good idea on the plugs.
    The leakdown is much more valuable than a compression test IMO. It's just as sensitive as compression test and you'll know where the air is going which will tell you where the problem is. Compression can easily miss some problems and it won't tell you where the air is going.

    I've done a significant number of leakdown and some compression tests years ago on my V8s and, believe me, I've spotted things like mildly bent intake valves and shot rings pretty easily. I could always easily tell where the air was coming from. Hopefully you DONT have a serious problem, but if you get stuck and decide to invest the $50 in a LD tool, if you use it and had say a pinched ring, you'll both hear and feel the air escaping out of the oil fill/PCV. The big indicator of course will be cyl 5 is leaking a bit more than the others. On a modern engine I'd expect a healthy cylinder in a warm block to be no more than 2%.

    BTW, I hope you find NO major problems! Engine problem$ suck!
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  10. #60
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Update, swapped in NGK 5992's and changed to new gas station with the same results. Actually, I get timing reduction on multiple cylinders now, but number 5 is the most noisy.

    I also took video using a USB borescope as shown below:

    • Cyl #1:
    • #2:
    • #3:
    • #4 :
    • #5 :
    • #6: (still uploading, but looks the same)


    I don't see anything obvious, but see deposits at the edge of #4 and #5 . It looks metallic, but that could just be reflection from the LED. I'd appreciate any insight on these videos.


    Running total of things that I've tried:

    • e50, e70, e85
    • Run only 8 deg advance
    • Compression test (150psi on all)
    • Swap plug and coil for #5
    • Test ethanol of fuel (reads exactly 85% ethanol)
    • Switch e85 stations
    • No codes thrown
    • Swap injector 5&6
    • Recode all injectors
    • Run stage 1+ (pump) map
    • Change to NGK 5992 sparkplugs
    Change is constant

  11. #61
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    Thia is just a guess but have you checked the wiring and connector pins supplying firing voltage to the coil. I believe there is a procedure in the Bently to check the signal amplitude and waveform shape supplied to the coil. Could be a weak Mosfet in the ECU.

  12. #62
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    Time for a leak down test. I doubt it's DME/coil... you have to have fire to have knock (which is a very specific freq).

    You have a log with ST trims. I'm curious about my BP theory. Bank 2 would be lower %.

    EDIT: I haven't changed injectors, but it's there 1 bracket holding 2 cyl. What if it's angling the injector weird.

  13. #63
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    Gravedigging this, but did you ever find out what was wrong?

  14. #64
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by nyt Click here to enlarge
    Gravedigging this, but did you ever find out what was wrong?
    +1. This seems like a very odd issue, curious how you turned out.

  15. #65
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    I never figured it out. #5 is still chatty but it doesn't appear to be under my direct control.
    Change is constant

  16. #66
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    Dang! I was hoping to see that you fixed it.. I'm fighting the same problem, looks like your efforts saved me some work though, so I appreciate that.

  17. #67
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    I am now running e85 and meth and #5 shows retard often (not all the time).
    Change is constant

  18. #68
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    Overshooting load or boost results on a global reduction of timing, not just a single cylinder. It also reduces the timing target, not reduces timing by means of a timing correction.
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bimmer305 Click here to enlarge
    Wrong.
    Can anyone confirm if this is right or wrong?

    Thanks!

  19. #69
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    From my experience, it's a global reduction in timing.

  20. #70
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    Have you ever tried just replacing the sensor? There's one that sits by 5 under the manifold that could have been damaged during a valve cleaning, maybe.

  21. #71
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by V8Bait Click here to enlarge
    Have you ever tried just replacing the sensor? There's one that sits by 5 under the manifold that could have been damaged during a valve cleaning, maybe.
    That's the one thing I haven't done. I'll try that, as they are only $100.
    Change is constant

  22. #72
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    Maybe valve cover? Heard that the passages in the cover directs recycled air over cyl5?

    Could be clogged passages in the VC? Someone correct me if I'm wrong

  23. #73
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    I'm also dealing with this running a custom E55 flash. Chexk your injector decouplers too

    I replaced all of mine and timing improved as I imagine they were causing small leaks.

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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    I might be having this same problem as well. Please keep us updated as what you figure out

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    Did you dyno pre & post cyl. 5 timing issues?

    I was facing this issue too and also had some Cyl 5 misfires and it ended up being a leaking decoupler.

    Thinking about it, I'm going to replace all of my injector decouplers....

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