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  1. #26
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    lol i was being a bit exaggerative. but sea foam is good stuff but pointless IMO on these motors... build up on top of piston head is nothing compared to valves. i think it should be OK.
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  2. #27
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    I swapped injectors 5 and 6, with the same results. Now, I didn't re-code them yet. Don't know if that will make a difference as #6 is still silent (the problem didn't follow the injector).

    Attached logs are on e65, 8 deg of timing flat. You can still see #5 pulls timing on all but two logs.

    I'm out of ideas here. Melted piston?

    http://www.datazap.me/u/ghost/18-8-d...11-12-13-16-17
    http://www.datazap.me/u/ghost/19-8-d...11-12-13-16-17
    http://www.datazap.me/u/ghost/21-8-d...11-12-13-16-17
    http://www.datazap.me/u/ghost/17-8-d...11-12-13-16-17
    Clean two:
    http://www.datazap.me/u/ghost/16-8-d...11-12-13-16-17
    http://www.datazap.me/u/ghost/20-8-d...11-12-13-16-17

    For comparison, I could always run 12-13 degrees flat with no corrections on E60-70 (two last month or so):
    http://www.datazap.me/u/ghost/142-4t...13-14-15-16-22
    Change is constant

  3. #28
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    That's some weird stuff... I am beginning to wonder if you might have a problem with the ECU circuit board.
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  4. #29
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    ummm, I am showing ignition retard on more than just #5 . #4 is also having issues.
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  5. #30
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by vasillalov Click here to enlarge
    ummm, I am showing ignition retard on more than just #5 . #4 is also having issues.
    Yes, in the above there are corrections in #4 , but that isn't normal. #5 always corrects now, as much as 9 degrees.
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  6. #31
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    Have you tried changing fuel sources? Might be some winter blend Ethanol? What do the logs look like if you load up the "stock" cobb map? Still seeing corrections on that cylinder?
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  7. #32
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    Would imagine you’d have some pronounced drivability issues if you had serious piston or ring damage. I know the car is pulling out a lot of timing, but assuming it drives more or less OK just putzing around town? I am quite surprised it didn’t follow the injector, would have put my money on a leaky or otherwise failing fuel supply to cyl 5.

    Shot in the dark: Maybe Cyl 5 fuel line is clogged or otherwise fouled?
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  8. #33
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    Would imagine you’d have some pronounced drivability issues if you had serious piston or ring damage. I know the car is pulling out a lot of timing, but assuming it drives more or less OK just putzing around town? I am quite surprised it didn’t follow the injector, would have put my money on a leaky or otherwise failing fuel supply to cyl 5.

    Shot in the dark: Maybe Cyl 5 fuel line is clogged or otherwise fouled?
    Turbo cars can really mask any piston damage to a single cylinder. I had 60psi compression (vs 150) in one cinder on my Subaru and the only way I knew is my traps speed went down by 4mph. 'Felt' the same.

    In fact, here is what my piston looked like when I pulled it.
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  9. #34
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    Have you tried changing fuel sources? Might be some winter blend Ethanol? What do the logs look like if you load up the "stock" cobb map? Still seeing corrections on that cylinder?
    I can try that. I measured the ethanol content of this fuel in the first post and jt is exactly 85%. Maybe there are other things that they can blend in.
    Change is constant

  10. #35
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by The Ghost Click here to enlarge
    I can try that. I measured the ethanol content of this fuel in the first post and jt is exactly 85%. Maybe there are other things that they can blend in.
    Honestly, i would try loading a stage 1 or stock map and observe the timing across all cylinders on pump gas. If there is something wrong, i'd rather not risk having unnecessary cylinder pressure while you are diagnosing the issue.
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  11. #36
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    @The Ghost That’s intense…those rings are totally smoked and the car still “felt” normal? Wow.
    Anyways…if it were a fuel/octane issue, wouldn’t that be apparent across banks? I can’t see why one particular cylinder would be so repeatedly noisy if the fuel sucked. Perhaps the ignition components in cyl 5 are on the way out but I’m sure OP already checked the basics. If you were getting multiple misfire codes I’d even begin thinking along the lines of a DME failure…but all the instances of that I’ve seen are not isolated to one cylinder as yours is.

    Agreed with Lulz on troubleshooting though. Obviously something isn’t right in cyl 5…may as well try to deduce it on the most conservative map possible.
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  12. #37
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    Do you have a pic of the plugs and an age on them? Got a boroscope to see the piston top?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
    Do you have a pic of the plugs and an age on them? Got a boroscope to see the piston top?
    Note attached. This was #5 when I pulled it a few weeks ago. Plugs have roughly 8k miles on them.
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    Change is constant

  14. #39
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    I don't see any obvious fouling or oil/fuel on the business end...looks normal to me?
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  15. #40
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    Is this occurring on a pump gas tune? At least to narrow it down whether it's def tune or hardware related
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  16. #41
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Is this occurring on a pump gas tune? At least to narrow it down whether it's def tune or hardware related
    I just loaded stage 1+ aggr with the same results. Small corrections, mostly in #5 . AFR is 12.0:1, boost around 13psi, timing super low.

    Logs:



    I also got all of my injectors recoded today.

    Running total of things that I've tried:


    • e50, e70, e85
    • Run only 8 deg advance
    • Compression test (150psi on all)
    • Swap plug and coil for #5
    • Test ethanol of fuel (reads exactly 85% ethanol)
    • No codes thrown
    • Swap injector 5&6
    • Recode all injectors
    • Run stage 1+ (pump) map


    I am looking for someone local to swap APs, trying to revert to AP V2 for the long shot that the base ECU file I have is acting funny on my car.
    Change is constant

  17. #42
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    Swapping APs won't change a thing. Software is software. You have some sort of a mechanical/hardware issue that needs to be figured out. At this point, I am placing my bet on ECU going bad.
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    Next steps:
    • Borescope will be here in Friday, will inspect
    • Swapping back to APV2 maps (it is the only thing that I've changed before this started happening. Likely a coincidence)
    • Looking at swapping knock sensors from bank 1 to bank 2


    On the last item, does anyone know if you can simply reverse the banks for the knock sensors? I ask because it seems that there are two sensors connected to a "Y" joining into a single connector. Now, either the ECU knows which cylinders it is listening to based on crank angle or one sensor must be used for a given bank. I don't know the answer to this question.

    Diagram: http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...11&fg=10&hl=20

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    Change is constant

  19. #44
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by The Ghost Click here to enlarge
    Next steps:
    • Borescope will be here in Friday, will inspect
    • Swapping back to APV2 maps (it is the only thing that I've changed before this started happening. Likely a coincidence)
    • Looking at swapping knock sensors from bank 1 to bank 2


    On the last item, does anyone know if you can simply reverse the banks for the knock sensors? I ask because it seems that there are two sensors connected to a "Y" joining into a single connector. Now, either the ECU knows which cylinders it is listening to based on crank angle or one sensor must be used for a given bank. I don't know the answer to this question.

    Diagram: http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...11&fg=10&hl=20

    Happy new year!
    good question lol maybe crank sensor also craping out?

    but you would also get dme related issues, in my car when it went out it was stuck in 3rd gear till i got back to the shop
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  20. #45
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    No, there are indeed two sensors. Take a look at the diagram. I verified this myself today.
    Change is constant

  21. #46
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    Knock sensor appears to not be specific to either bank, I think swapping them is a logical choice in ruling things out.
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  22. #47
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    Swapping knock sensors is interesting, but these are pretty simple devices and can't see how it could just effect 1 cyl... unless its the reluctor.

    Do you have a RB PCV valve? Maybe clean the VC ports.
    Try the NGK plugs. Unfortunately you may have to live with it or tune around it. 2 and 5 should have little higher BP/EGT then the rest and potentially rear turbo is working a little harder than front due to uneven WG wear. Would have to pull the DPs to check this.

  23. #48
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by The Ghost Click here to enlarge
    Note attached. This was 5 when I pulled it a few weeks ago. Plugs have roughly 8k miles on them.
    That plug looks like it's getting either light oil contamination (most likely), too much fuel or fuel is hitting it directly from a bad injector spray pattern. Was it significantly different than the other plugs?

    If it was mine, I'd do a leakdown test to check for bad rings. $50 for a tester, just need an air compressor. Compression tests are so-so and will only tell you some things. Leakdown is much better and you can put your hand over the intake, exhaust or PCV and noting where the air is escaping to get an idea.

    You might have damaged or pinched a ring which could be letting oil by. Or it could be a bad valve guide. Hopefully none of the above but that plug is getting some carbon on it from something.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BavarianBullet Click here to enlarge
    That plug looks like it's getting either light oil contamination (most likely), too much fuel or fuel is hitting it directly from a bad injector spray pattern. Was it significantly different than the other plugs?

    If it was mine, I'd do a leakdown test to check for bad rings. $50 for a tester, just need an air compressor. Compression tests are so-so and will only tell you some things. Leakdown is much better and you can put your hand over the intake, exhaust or PCV and noting where the air is escaping to get an idea.

    You might have damaged or pinched a ring which could be letting oil by. Or it could be a bad valve guide. Hopefully none of the above but that plug is getting some carbon on it from something.
    I agree. A couple of my plugs looked similar to that and I was losing timing. Swapped plugs and have full timing again. I need to figure out why its happening too though.

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