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  1. #101
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    Interesting. I use the AFR targeting tables that Shiv flashes with his OFT procede fueling maps. They target 10.8 - the car hits 10.8. Any ideas why shiv does that for every car that gets procede fuel flash?
    Maybe he targets it rich just for safety. Tough to melt things at 10.8, and I’d imagine any time the tuners release an OTS type map, they err on the side of caution.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....Stock
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  2. #102
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    Because Shiv pedaled a very aggressive(for stock) tune as "safe" for stock hardware and 91 octane.
    Ya those maps were ridiculous for a stock car.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....Stock
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  3. #103
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    Yea they were way overfueled. Not to mention some guys who got the wrong flash and were running 9.8 AFR or something stupid and blowing unburnt fuel out their exhaust.

  4. #104
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    I feel bad for the FRS/GT86/BRZ guys...
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    MOTIV750, MOTIV P-1000 PI, MOTIV/FUEL-IT! low pressure fuel system, AEM EMS/COBB AP, Aquamist HFS-3, ETS FMIC, SPEC stage 3+ clutch/SS flywheel, BC Racing coilovers and VMR wheels wrapped in Hankook RS3s.

  5. #105
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    How much is this going to run assuming one already has the piggyback and HSF-4? Is it using the stock pump of the HSF-4 kit?
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    MOTIV750 / MHD+JB4 / ADV / SB REAR O2

  6. #106
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    I want to do a setup like this but i am not convinced my HSF4 will be able to control things properly. I hate to admit it, but i honestly think the Procede will be the only system with enough flexibility to control the meth kit properly.
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

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  7. #107
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    You will need a piggy anyways as a failsafe, just like any other meth kit. Only difference is it's pumped to each port. Just curious if the pump was upgraded or not.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    I want to do a setup like this but i am not convinced my HSF4 will be able to control things properly. I hate to admit it, but i honestly think the Procede will be the only system with enough flexibility to control the meth kit properly.
    Click here to enlarge
    MOTIV750 / MHD+JB4 / ADV / SB REAR O2

  8. #108
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by blisstik Click here to enlarge
    You will need a piggy anyways as a failsafe, just like any other meth kit. Only difference is it's pumped to each port. Just curious if the pump was upgraded or not.
    My HFS4 failsafe works great, the least of my worries actually. My worry would be direct control over pump DC/injection, based on air mass or boost & RPM.
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

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  9. #109
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    My HFS4 failsafe works great, the least of my worries actually. My worry would be direct control over pump DC/injection, based on air mass or boost & RPM.
    Yea the Aquamist failsafe is pretty much foolproof since it just dumps boost and isn’t spraying off imaginary targets anyways.

    Why do you think the HFS-4 wouldn’t be able to control a setup like this? You could still have it spray off injector DC; I don’t see the issue on the software side. All this port injection has me curious…
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....Stock
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  10. #110
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    The problem with using the PROcede is you lose individual cylinder monitoring. I don't like the idea of JUST using bank vs bank fuel trims as your only means of determining equal cylinder distribution and spray.

    Let's just say #5 's nozzle is a little clogged but sprays enough to keep fuel trims fairly close(or how many times have you seen PROcede users recommend resetting adaptions for fairly common fuel trim issues? The PROcede has virtually desensitized people to fueling issues lol) while you may be having timing corrections but not seeing them. That's not really an issue at stock turbo levels but imagine what could happen at the 800whp, 900whp or even 1Kwhp mark where the margin for error the piggys rely on is no longer there.
    Click here to enlarge
    MOTIV750, MOTIV P-1000 PI, MOTIV/FUEL-IT! low pressure fuel system, AEM EMS/COBB AP, Aquamist HFS-3, ETS FMIC, SPEC stage 3+ clutch/SS flywheel, BC Racing coilovers and VMR wheels wrapped in Hankook RS3s.

  11. #111
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    Yea the Aquamist failsafe is pretty much foolproof since it just dumps boost and isn’t spraying off imaginary targets anyways.

    Why do you think the HFS-4 wouldn’t be able to control a setup like this? You could still have it spray off injector DC; I don’t see the issue on the software side. All this port injection has me curious…
    It only monitors 2 of 3 fuel parameters. It monitors injector DC and high fuel pressure, but does not monitor IPW. From what i have seen the DME does some very strange stuff IDC staying within a certain window. I think the DME varies IPW much more than any other variable. I also dont like the fact that the HFS4 will actually decrease meth flow based on the High pressure fuel rail pressure dropping. If the HPFP cannot keep up with demand, it will actually flow LESS meth based on that variable.

    PWM injection based on calculated air mass would be ideal...
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

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  12. #112
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    I have a pwm vishnu kit for sale with trunk pump/tank mount. It really is a good system, but not very popular. Not sure of the AM thesholds like witha leak, procede accounts for this if excess flow. A tuning failsafe reacts much quick, meaning safer. And the 3D mapping is great, along with the visibility in the logs.

  13. #113
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    The problem with using the PROcede is you lose individual cylinder monitoring. I don't like the idea of JUST using bank vs bank fuel trims as your only means of determining equal cylinder distribution and spray.

    Let's just say #5 's nozzle is a little clogged but sprays enough to keep fuel trims fairly close while you may be having timing corrections but not seeing them. That's not really an issue at stock turbo levels but imagine what could happen at the 800whp, 900whp or even 1Kwhp mark where the margin for error the piggys rely on is no longer there.
    Yeah, i would feel naked without seeing all 6 cylinders timing too. Too bad we couldnt talk any piggyback owners (vishnu or @Terry@BMS) into enabling monitoring of all 6 cylinders on Cobb equiped cars. Since we know Cobb enables all 6 cylinders timing corrections for all Cobb ROM files, it should be possible to enable the piggyback to monitor those channels. Honestly that would probably be the last straw to get me to jump to a stack combo vs flash only. I really am getting tired of dialing in my boost curves.
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

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  14. #114
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    I have a pwm vishnu kit for sale with trunk pump/tank mount. It really is a good system, but not very popular. Not sure of the AM thesholds like witha leak, procede accounts for this if excess flow. A tuning failsafe reacts much quick, meaning safer.
    Aquamist monitors over and under flow conditions and activates failsafe based on both.
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

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  15. #115
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    I'll leave this here:
    http://datazap.me/u/uniter/defiv-fab...-added-2?1-5-6

    18.5 PSI.

    Road speed & WGDC is available now for the curious masses.
    @uniter, you have different turbo intake pipes right?

  16. #116
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    @blisstik @lulz_m3 @135pats
    All indications are that the HFS-4 would be more than capable of driving this, it has all the same robust failsafe as anything else does. In fact I have every intention of driving this setup with an HFS-4 controller just to see if it makes more power. The only reason I'm using the procede is because I already have it, it works for boost control and the integration and failsafe work great.

    All other parts are pretty much bread and butter HFS-4 stuff - Jeff @ Howerton has told me it would work great. It's a standard Aquamist 160 PSI pump.. (In the future I may want more PSI in the injection system, not sure yet.)
    If one were to duplicate this setup:

    1 DEFIV plate + 6 port distro block + 6x90CC .4mm checkvalved injectors + 1.2mm CP Checkvalved injector + procede PWM kit = done.

    1 DEFIV plate + 6 port distro block + 6x90CC .4mm checkvalved injectors + 1.2mm CP Checkvalved injector + HFS-4 PWM kit = done.

    1 DEFIV plate + 6 port distro block + 6x90CC .4mm checkvalved injectors + 1.2mm CP Checkvalved injector + JB-4 PWM kit = done. @Terry@BMS you can hack out a firmware to use the flow-sensor & drive PWM output based on RPM and load?

    Not sure what the minimum order is for Rick to get these bad boys CNC'd up, but it's more than 2.
    @dzenno@PTF: Yes. See something interesting?




    Who wants to guess what expensive component failed on the way to the dyno tonight? Hint: It rhymes with 'disasters'.
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

  17. #117
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    @blisstik @lulz_m3 @135pats
    All indications are that the HFS-4 would be more than capable of driving this, it has all the same robust failsafe as anything else does. In fact I have every intention of driving this setup with an HFS-4 controller just to see if it makes more power. The only reason I'm using the procede is because I already have it, it works for boost control and the integration and failsafe work great.

    All other parts are pretty much bread and butter HFS-4 stuff - Jeff @ Howerton has told me it would work great. It's a standard Aquamist 160 PSI pump.. (In the future I may want more PSI in the injection system, not sure yet.)
    If one were to duplicate this setup:

    1 DEFIV plate + 6 port distro block + 6x90CC .4mm checkvalved injectors + 1.2mm CP Checkvalved injector + procede PWM kit = done.

    1 DEFIV plate + 6 port distro block + 6x90CC .4mm checkvalved injectors + 1.2mm CP Checkvalved injector + HFS-4 PWM kit = done.

    1 DEFIV plate + 6 port distro block + 6x90CC .4mm checkvalved injectors + 1.2mm CP Checkvalved injector + JB-4 PWM kit = done. @Terry@BMS you can hack out a firmware to use the flow-sensor & drive PWM output based on RPM and load?

    Not sure what the minimum order is for Rick to get these bad boys CNC'd up, but it's more than 2.
    @dzenno@PTF: Yes. See something interesting?




    Who wants to guess what expensive component failed on the way to the dyno tonight? Hint: It rhymes with 'disasters'.


    Ahhhh, what broke?? I suck when it comes to guessing. We should get a tentative list going on who is interested on purchasing the plate.

  18. #118
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by CaliforniaBred Click here to enlarge
    Ahhhh, what broke?? I suck when it comes to guessing. We should get a tentative list going on who is interested on purchasing the plate.
    Stuff that just means it's making good power. LMAO.
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

  19. #119
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by CaliforniaBred Click here to enlarge
    We should get a tentative list going on who is interested on purchasing the plate.
    +1
    -'09 135i MT - Custom 6466 ST - 680whp Click here to enlarge
    -'08 135i AT - 6466 ST - dead
    -'97 318is - Daily
    -'82 320i

  20. #120
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    10.8 is rediculous on a DI motor. I call that laziness not safety.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    Maybe he targets it rich just for safety. Tough to melt things at 10.8, and I’d imagine any time the tuners release an OTS type map, they err on the side of caution.
    2011 335is DCT, JB4 + MHD BEF, stage 2 LPFP, e50 + 50/50 meth, DCI, 7" FMIC, MT ET Streets when needed


  21. #121
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    2 out of 2 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bigdnno98 Click here to enlarge
    10.8 is rediculous on a DI motor. I call that laziness not safety.
    Lol I was trying to play nice my first week over on BB, was being diplomatic Click here to enlarge. Yea thatís not close to stoich for pump gas, and not in the zip code of what you could lean out E85 for. And on a DI motor. Not Shivís finest moment.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....Stock
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  22. #122
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135pats Click here to enlarge
    Lol I was trying to play nice my first week over on BB, was being diplomatic Click here to enlarge. Yea that’s not close to stoich for pump gas, and not in the zip code of what you could lean out E85 for. And on a DI motor. Not Shiv’s finest moment.
    Well it's easy enough to change the 10.8s to 12 and higher to see what that does to knock activity, then see the difference on a dyno.

    Unfortunately my dual-disk ClutchMasters is slipping with 2,000 miles on it. #suspicious . I guess that means I MUST be at 1,000 HP, right?

    5th slipped on the way to the dyno; 3 and 4 slipped on the dyno at 350hp. It's ludicrous that the most expensive clutch option on the market started slipping, we hope that CM will find the root cause and solve the problem ASAP.

    Once that's done we're looking at a few hundred for 4 hours of dyno tuning to figure out what goes on at various levels of boost, timing advance and AFR.

    Everything prior to that is navel-gazing and arm-chair engineering.

    In other news we're working on getting the intake manifold plate solidworks drawing printed up on a makerbot for test fitment, then we'll see what the pricing is at various order quantities.

    The plate has ports for meth, fuel and n2o.

    R&D is time consuming and expensive.
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

  23. #123
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    In other news we're working on getting the intake manifold plate solidworks drawing printed up on a makerbot for test fitment
    That's awesome.
    Eppur si muove.

  24. #124
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    @ajm8127
    Prototyping car parts on makerbot is pretty slick Click here to enlarge
    Another indication of nerdery is that www.defivfabrication.com takes Bitcoin for orders.
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

  25. #125
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    Rick should just fab up complete intake manifolds suited for port injected methanol. Total pipe dream/money pit from an R&D standpoint in relation to return on investment…but it would be badass.
    E88 N54 Alpinweiss/Coral Red/Motiv HTA 3586r Tial .82AR/Motiv Port Fuel/BMR 3.5" Exhaust/ER CP/Synapse/VRSF FMIC/Rob Beck PCV Valve + Cap/ST Coilovers/M3 FCA + Tension Rods/M3 Subframe Bushings/M3 FSB/AA Strutbrace/DINAN Camber Plates/Apex ARC-8/Project Kics/VAC Hubs/Rogue Transmission Mounts/Alpina TCU Flash/Icarbon/Kerscher/BMW Performance
    F30 335 X-Drive EBII....Stock
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