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  1. #26
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GG///M3 Click here to enlarge
    Have the said human vendor mention what he has done here in this thread for m50 based motors. Info and questions posted on a forum make forums good.
    HERE is a thread where Neel talks much the tuning that Apex Speed Tech offers.
    It is standalone/race tuning in general that starts at double the OE DME tune price point for the hardware (not including any needed sensors, hardware, wiring/harness sections or tuning of a specific vehicle);
    however, the precision with which these components can communicate and create a powerful car will astound.

    It is very likely that Apex could control an OBD1 turbo system as efficiently as a silver or red labeled box. The cost would be significantly different, but so would the NEED if a user is turning to a FULL standalone.

    Nitrous and BMW has been an unspoken no for years
    but a few members are trying their hands.
    It is science, for sure;
    however, there are other proven ways to gain power without the R&D, guesswork or the risk.

    Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge
    www
    milkt org

  2. #27
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Neel is not required to appease you on M50's or when you desire. As stated, if you want to learn more go to their website and poke around. Kind of ridiculous to expect him to post everything he has done with every motor or that he needs to go out of his way to prove something to you.
    This is the problem here asking questions ='s being punished. My post was asking for a vendor to come in and share some info here for the m50 motor heads. I guess its better to not ask questions here?
    Click here to enlargeClick here to enlarge

  3. #28
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GG///M3 Click here to enlarge
    This is the problem here asking questions ='s being punished. My post was asking for a vendor to come in and share some info here for the m50 motor heads. I guess its better to not ask questions here?
    You don't ask questions, you instigate. No other members have any problems asking questions, hence, the problem is you. Namely that you apply your standard to M50's and that you expect vendors to be at your beck and call. You dismiss Apex for tuning without having any idea as to what they have or have not done coming to a premature conclusion. As stated, you need to read up on Apex, Apex does not need to serve you.
    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale: http://www.boostaddict.com/showthrea...r-kit-for-sale

  4. #29
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    M50 options

    Hiya Everybody! Sorry I've been a little busy - got a baby on the way this week and my wife's got me tuning the house instead of cars!

    Here's my 10 cents:

    If get a direct port setup you can still keep your aggressive NA tune and not need to mess with a new EMS and extra tunes.
    Port setup - good. Not a new EMS - VERY BAD. You want something that is:

    1. Failsafe.
    2. Has the ability to retard timing based on nitrous.
    3. Progressive.

    Don't use piggybacks with Nitrous if you can avoid it! The only time anyone should ever NOT use a standalone with Nitrous is if they have to meet OBD-II compliance and there's no other way. In my career I've seen about a 50% failure rate on nitrous motors - why would anyone take a chance? Save $2000 now and you might spend $5000 on an engine rebuild in 2 passes.

    Also, its VERY important to test and do dry runs with your system before you proceed.

    Finally, you want to use a port system whenever possible WITHOUT secondary injectors. Why?


    1. If you have a "wet" setup with secondary injectors, when your secondary injection system fails, runs out of pressure, whatever, you will be screwed
    2. Secondary injection systems have a bad habit of leaving fuel in the manifold, and that plus nitrous = blow your intake manifold up.
    3. Fuel injected intake manifolds are designed to run dry. When you do a fogger/wet setup, you end up with uneven fuel distribution due to wall wetting effects.

    Of course, there are 1000's of people who get fogger/wet systems to work well. There are also 1000's of them who blow up their motors trying to get the to work well.

    have never heard of them doing anything with m50 based motors.
    Well, ya never asked, didya?

    In the past I worked on M50's that competed in Speed World Challenge, NASA & SCCA. Done them in all sorts of configurations - B20's, TU's, S50B30's.

    Any links to better info for their tuning? The proven humans that I know of are not Apex Speed.
    Just go to our webpage, find any of our customers or anyone here. They'll vouch for me. We've tuned some of the top BMW's in the world, period.

    As far as proving my humanity goes, my 9 month pregnant wife may have something to say about that - by the way its treating here she's wondering if I implanted some spiteful alien up in there.

    Don't do AEM. We're AEM dealers; I like some of the directly-supported plug & plays, but the failure rates are too high and some of their features are too limited. We've gone away from them. For a nitrous E30, we could easily do a plug & play kit that will plug right into your motor and the stock E30 harness, giving you full dash compatibility and more.

    Let me know how we can help! And thanks to everyone on this forum for all the kind words!

    -Neel
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

  5. #30
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    It is standalone/race tuning in general that starts at double the OE DME tune price point for the hardware (not including any needed sensors, hardware, wiring/harness sections or tuning of a specific vehicle);
    however, the precision with which these components can communicate and create a powerful car will astound.
    I can't stress enough though - Nitrous is an easy thing to kill your motor with. You want a standalone because you can add in a lot more control in terms of timing retard and fuel addition. It only needs to save your motor once to more than pay for itself.

    It is very likely that Apex could control an OBD1 turbo system as efficiently as a silver or red labeled box. The cost would be significantly different, but so would the NEED if a user is turning to a FULL standalone.
    Any system we do will control an OBD1 turbo system better than any other solution.

    Nitrous and BMW has been an unspoken no for years
    but a few members are trying their hands.
    It is science, for sure;
    however, there are other proven ways to gain power without the R&D, guesswork or the risk.
    We have done nitrous BMWs with success. Yes, there is risk but if you have the proper equipment and people helping you, it can be effective.

    -Neel
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

  6. #31
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Apex Speed Technology Click here to enlarge
    As far as proving my humanity goes, my 9 month pregnant wife may have something to say about that - by the way its treating here she's wondering if I implanted some spiteful alien up in there.
    Sorry to take your time up with this, sounds like she is due soon. Congrats of course, that is obviously way more important than this internet nonsense.

    Thanks for your perspective.
    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale: http://www.boostaddict.com/showthrea...r-kit-for-sale

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    My thread turned into a crazy session...what about a WAR chip..I am looking for the best bang for my buck..I know my chances on frying the rings and damaging a lot more inside..

    You said your friends runs a 75 with no turn? Is he monitoring his a/f ratio...walbro fuel pump?

  8. #33
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Apex Speed Technology Click here to enlarge
    Hiya Everybody! Sorry I've been a little busy - got a baby on the way this week and my wife's got me tuning the house instead of cars!

    Here's my 10 cents:



    Port setup - good. Not a new EMS - VERY BAD. You want something that is:

    1. Failsafe.
    2. Has the ability to retard timing based on nitrous.
    3. Progressive.

    Don't use piggybacks with Nitrous if you can avoid it! The only time anyone should ever NOT use a standalone with Nitrous is if they have to meet OBD-II compliance and there's no other way. In my career I've seen about a 50% failure rate on nitrous motors - why would anyone take a chance? Save $2000 now and you might spend $5000 on an engine rebuild in 2 passes.

    Also, its VERY important to test and do dry runs with your system before you proceed.

    Finally, you want to use a port system whenever possible WITHOUT secondary injectors. Why?


    1. If you have a "wet" setup with secondary injectors, when your secondary injection system fails, runs out of pressure, whatever, you will be screwed
    2. Secondary injection systems have a bad habit of leaving fuel in the manifold, and that plus nitrous = blow your intake manifold up.
    3. Fuel injected intake manifolds are designed to run dry. When you do a fogger/wet setup, you end up with uneven fuel distribution due to wall wetting effects.

    Of course, there are 1000's of people who get fogger/wet systems to work well. There are also 1000's of them who blow up their motors trying to get the to work well.



    Well, ya never asked, didya?

    In the past I worked on M50's that competed in Speed World Challenge, NASA & SCCA. Done them in all sorts of configurations - B20's, TU's, S50B30's.



    Just go to our webpage, find any of our customers or anyone here. They'll vouch for me. We've tuned some of the top BMW's in the world, period.

    As far as proving my humanity goes, my 9 month pregnant wife may have something to say about that - by the way its treating here she's wondering if I implanted some spiteful alien up in there.

    Don't do AEM. We're AEM dealers; I like some of the directly-supported plug & plays, but the failure rates are too high and some of their features are too limited. We've gone away from them. For a nitrous E30, we could easily do a plug & play kit that will plug right into your motor and the stock E30 harness, giving you full dash compatibility and more.

    Let me know how we can help! And thanks to everyone on this forum for all the kind words!

    -Neel
    would you happen to have dyno sheets from any Nos powered or other FI tuned cars you have done? Good luck with the coming child. Its good that you took the time to post here.
    Click here to enlargeClick here to enlarge

  9. #34
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Chistakoff Click here to enlarge
    My thread turned into a crazy session...what about a WAR chip..I am looking for the best bang for my buck..I know my chances on frying the rings and damaging a lot more inside..

    You said your friends runs a 75 with no turn? Is he monitoring his a/f ratio...walbro fuel pump?
    With a relatively small shot you are usually ok as you are just counting on the ECU to adjust.

    It really depends on what you are goals are, what you want to spend, etc.

    Best bang for your buck? That is definitely nitrous but stay conservative.
    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale: http://www.boostaddict.com/showthrea...r-kit-for-sale

  10. #35
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    I want to do a 100 shot and I AM staying conservative by all means. Apex I am looking for a good contact number that I could get to you directly to talk more on the process this is going to take. I am at a conference right now but will get to you as soon as I can.

    Thanks Sticky and Apex for all your help. I appreciate everything that will take me that extra mile.

  11. #36
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    would you happen to have dyno sheets from any Nos powered or other FI tuned cars you have done? Good luck with the coming child. Its good that you took the time to post here.
    As I've said before, we cannot and will not post customer dyno sheets. Also, I can't post customer names unless they explicitly allow it. If you have any questions about our ability or the quality of our work, please feel free to call our customers directly. Some of our better known BMW customers include Turner Motorsports, Dinan Cars USA, Sunbelt Racing Engines, Fletcher-made horsepower, EVOSport and Piper Motorsports.

    With a relatively small shot you are usually ok as you are just counting on the ECU to adjust.
    what about a WAR chip..I am looking for the best bang for my buck
    These solutions aren't very good because they cannot sense load and retard timing. You have no failsafe. You should see the failure rates for nitrous motors - you might think twice.

    -Neel
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

  12. #37
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Chistakoff Click here to enlarge
    I want to do a 100 shot and I AM staying conservative by all means
    I would not personally advise a 100 or want take responsibility for that without a dedicated nitrous tune of some sort.

    I don't know if it will apply to you but on the S54 going to 100 or higher ran the danger of the 6th cylinder running lean. If you are set on doing it, start much smaller.
    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale: http://www.boostaddict.com/showthrea...r-kit-for-sale

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    Well I am just saying this right now. I am not willing to spray nitrous of some sort at all without a tune. Maybe I should look at my other options and go with a used blower system? It will come out to about the same amount of money. What do you guys suggest hence I already have the whole nitrous kit, bottle warmer along with a purge kit also.

  14. #39
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    Well I am just saying this right now. I am not willing to spray nitrous of some sort at all without a tune. Maybe I should look at my other options and go with a used blower system? It will come out to about the same amount of money. What do you guys suggest hence I already have the whole nitrous kit, bottle warmer along with a purge kit also.

    I say do nitrous, but be one of the very few that do it right. Nitrous can be absolutely awesome in the proper application. A progressive setup with proper ignition retard is really the way to go. Put together something with a standalone and the right tuning, and that's all you'll need. Nitrous is in some ways brilliant - you don't have any charge cooling issues as you do with forced-induction. If you control it well, you can have great results without a lot of mechanical installation.

    The problem is people aren't willing to spend the same kind of money for an ECU and tune as they will on turbochargers, superchargers, manifolds, installation, tuning, etc. Of course I'm biased; its my business. But I don't see a lot of evidence that I'm wrong.

    -Neel
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GG///M3 Click here to enlarge
    would you happen to have dyno sheets from any Nos powered or other FI tuned cars you have done? Good luck with the coming child. Its good that you took the time to post here.
    I can vouch for Neel and Apex they did my custom turbo set up tuning using their Pectel sq6! I am the only m52tu e46 323i in the entire world that is a dd. I think there are two other cars out there irish mikes racing has one and a drag team in australia! But obviously they are not fair as they are race cars! THEY DID SUCH A GOOD JOB THE FIRST TIME THAT I AM HAVING NEEL COME BACK! To retune my car now that the motor is built and i put in a zionsville radiator and aquamist hfs-6 meth unit.

  16. #41
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    I would say that not only are they capable but dare i say the best, and trust me i searched two years to find some one to even touch my car!

  17. #42
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Thanks for all the praise, but seriously I'm starting to like this idea. We like challenges and nitrous is a good one. We've done a few pretty kick-ass nitrous setups on bikes (one of our nitrous bikes got a record in the 200 MPH club at Bonneville this year) and I have done an S54 with nitrous before. There's some newer control strategies out there now that really allow us to tune the power curve and really integrate nitrous into the cars power curve.
    Neel Vasavada
    Apex Speed Technology
    2947 S Sepulveda Blvd
    Los Angeles, CA 90064
    310.314.2005 (p)
    310.496.0951 (f)
    www.apexspeedtech.com
    info@apexspeedtech.com

  18. #43
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    OP, try PMing Adam (pei330ci). He has always helped me with my nitrous based questions. He is very knowledge man.

    Im pretty sure he is on here.
    This is my signature... Click here to enlarge

  19. #44
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BadBoostedBmwM3 Click here to enlarge
    OP, try PMing Adam (pei330ci). He has always helped me with my nitrous based questions. He is very knowledge man.

    Im pretty sure he is on here.
    Yes he is, knowledgeable and here.
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  20. #45
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Yes he is, knowledgeable and here.
    Great. Every BMW forum needs adam. Click here to enlarge
    This is my signature... Click here to enlarge

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