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  1. #476
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Linracing Click here to enlarge
    facts:
    FBO M3 91 octane will put down 400whp
    FBO 335 91 octane will put down 400whp
    FBO M3 aggressive tune meth and race gas 417whp
    FBO 335 aggressive tune meth and E85 480whp
    This is I can agree with it.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    I still believe the N54 can take 800 WHP and keep on ticking, just not sure for how long, and you are one ball hair from it blowing up if anything slightly goes south, ie: 1 psi too much boost, octane variance, degree of timing, etc. Guess we will find out in the next few months.
    So I'm gonna guess you haven't looked at the rods and are just gonna go til yea break.... Obviously my "concern" would be that we're already at rod bending power and have no idea.


    Then again, anyone that's thinking of pushing close to triple stock power levels and is spending big money on a turbo kit should be "smart" enough to consider upgrading the internals
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  3. #478
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    I trapped 119 with no meth, stock exhaust and 50/50 93+100 Oct and went 11.9 the first time out with my at 335. Testing the backend flash before it was big.
    09 6AT 335i Coupe M-Sport - SOLD
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    Looking for a n54 project e90/e82

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    And so what? Go build an N54 and try to keep up, you won't.
    Honestly, I wouldn't waste my time building a high power N54.... Great motor, but there's still too many "unknowns" with DI and the tunes aren't at the level we need them to be, your options are:
    1. Tune Stacking --> Combine a flash base map with a Piggyback; meaning you're limited to support/development with the JB4 or PROcede. If a feature isn't there, you're screwed.
    2. Boost Controller --> Side note, has anyone even done this on the N54?? Obviously for a boost controller, this is a more proven solution then the Piggybacks, but AFAIK no one has done this so who knows if it'd even cooperate with the DME.


    With both of these options, you're still stuck with the factory Traction Control strategy, which sucks and isn't high power friendly. Ideally, something like the ProEFI, that takes control of ALL the engine parameters, is the ultimate solution for high power N54s.


    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    I don't care. It's an old pile of crap. If I want a good turbo platform I'll go pick up a Gallardo or R8 V10. If I want a Porsche it will be a 997 or newer. What you can or can't hit HP wise changes absolutely nothing.

    I don't know why you keep listing 996tt's as if it even matters. Nobody here with an M3 cares.
    (For the sake of debating) If you decided to get a Gallardo/R8 V10 and TT it, you're gonna go down the same path you're on now -- A high revving V10 that wasn't designed for boost, and after spending ~$30k on just the kit you're gonna be limited by the exact same thing that makes it such a weapon: the motor. Everyone forgets that these YouTube famous TT-Gs have almost $125k invested in them between the engine rebuild (~$70k), turbo kit (~$30k), and supporting drivetrain mods (~$25k for Upgraded Axles, Gears, Clutch, etc).

    The modded 996 Turbo owners probably don't care about your $100k+ M3. I just keep mentioning the 996 because it's in the same price range as E9x M3s, and the motor is virtually the same in the 996 and 997. It's the same 3.6L GT1/Mezger motor; yea different turbos, turbo inlet piping, intercoolers, etc, but the motors are virtually the exact same thing.
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    But Sticky if you're serious about a TT-R8 V10, you could be different and hit up AMS

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  6. #481
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    As much as these twinturbo UGRs are youtube heroes for being fast in a straight line, I actually wonder how the drivability is. Turbo lag must be HUGE. Of course if a one trick pony is your thing it doesn't matter.
    E92 335i SB / Black Leather / 6AT / Navi Prof / Sunroof / Active Steering
    Mods: Performance Seats / Performance Exhaust / RB Turbos / M3 CF Roof / Brembo GT BBK 355/345 / Rollcage / M3 Mirrors / Forge FMIC / QUAIFE LSD / Ohlins R&T / M3 Suspension Parts / Vorshlag Camberplates / Megan Toe Links / LeatherZ Gauges / Extended M3 DCT Paddles / ER Sports OC / AR OC / Aux Radiator / AR catted DP / COBB Pro-Tune
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  7. #482
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    CAN WE GET THIS THREAD BACK ON TOPIC AND FIND SOMEONE TO TAKE OVER MY STAGE 3 SPOT!

    Click here to enlarge
    2010 e92 M3 Jet Black | DCT | ESS Tuned | Akrapovic Slip-on | Challenge X-pipe | AFE Intake | 18" Volk TE37SL | KW V3 Coilovers | RPI Scoops | Under Drive Pulley

    2007 e92 Mont. Blue 335i | 6MT | COBB Tuned | Quaife 3.46 LSD | Helix FMIC | AA DPs | HKS Exhaust | DCI | Stett CP w/ Forged DVs | KWv2 Coilovers | UUC Sway Bars & SSK | HPF Stg 2 Clutch | HFS-4 | M3 Suspension Bits | DEFIVfab Diff Lockdown Kit | Stoptech Trophy BBK

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    The S55 isn't the new 2JZ just stop with that crap.
    Agreed, the N54 hold the spot as the german 2JZ Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge
    997.1 tt
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  9. #484
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by xbox_fan Click here to enlarge
    Agreed, the N54 hold the spot as the german 2JZ Click here to enlarge

    Depending on goals...IMO it's better than the 2jz
    2009 335i coupe back to stock...for now

    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Linracing Click here to enlarge
    facts:
    FBO M3 91 octane will put down 400whp
    FBO 335 91 octane will put down 400whp
    FBO M3 aggressive tune meth and race gas 417whp
    FBO 335 aggressive tune meth and E85 480whp
    And the M3 does it all motor Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    Depending on goals...IMO it's better than the 2jz
    Maybe for a DD. For power, nowhere close.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    I just keep mentioning the 996 because it's in the same price range as E9x M3s, and the motor is virtually the same in the 996 and 997. It's the same 3.6L GT1/Mezger motor; yea different turbos, turbo inlet piping, intercoolers, etc, but the motors are virtually the exact same thing.
    The only reason you keep mentioning the 996 is because you ran out of arguments in support of the N54 to try and bash the S65 which is what you were first ranting on about.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by xbox_fan Click here to enlarge
    Agreed, the N54 hold the spot as the german 2JZ Click here to enlarge
    Personally I don't see ANY german I6 worth comparing against a 2J. Completely different.
    Last edited by E90Company; 10-23-2013 at 04:49 PM.

  11. #486
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
    Personally I don't see ANY german I6 worth comparing against a 2J. Completely different.
    I dont really care was just bored at work and wanted to see if I could anoy Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge
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  12. #487
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by xbox_fan Click here to enlarge
    I dont really care was just bored at work and wanted to see if I could anoy Sticky Click here to enlarge
    just tell him the s65 doesnt have TQ

  13. #488
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    just tell him the s65 doesnt have TQ
    Lol every s65 owner is a expert on gearing and tq multiplication ....
    Click here to enlarge
    ESS 6XX kit

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
    The only reason you keep mentioning the 996 is because you ran out of arguments in support of the N54 to try and bash the S65 which is what you were first ranting on about.
    Please tell me you read the 1st part of what I wrote from where you commented; if you haven't noticed I've spent the majority of time in this thread going with the $$$/Performance Argument.

    FACTS:

    • Stock motor capability (which makes up a significant majority of both aftermarket communities), the N54 > S65 **This is the camp I fall into; completely content with a Stock Motor/Stock Turbo 335 that I DD.
    • For high HP setups, NEITHER of them are ideal -- The N54 is held back by DI fueling (unless you want to constantly run meth), while the S65 requires a stupid amount of money to go above 650 WHP. If you want a high HP BMW, buy an E46 M3.
    • For relatively the same amount of money you can pick up an E9x M3 & mod the stock motor, you can buy a 996 Turbo (slightly dated, but that's why it's in the same price range) AND with the same "mod money" get a 700-800 WHP car that's going to give an all around better driving experience.


    AND if you go through the thread, you'll realize that Dzenno introduced the 996 as an alternative option, who's another N54 > S65 supporter.... But I don't see you saying $#@! to him
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  15. #490
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Honestly, I wouldn't waste my time building a high power N54....
    Yep, it's a waste of time once you want big power. The entire point I've made since the very beginning but glad it is sinking in for some.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    For the sake of debating) If you decided to get a Gallardo/R8 V10 and TT it, you're gonna go down the same path you're on now -- A high revving V10 that wasn't designed for boost, and after spending ~$30k on just the kit you're gonna be limited by the exact same thing that makes it such a weapon: the motor. Everyone forgets that these YouTube famous TT-Gs have almost $125k invested in them between the engine rebuild (~$70k), turbo kit (~$30k), and supporting drivetrain mods (~$25k for Upgraded Axles, Gears, Clutch, etc).
    Um the whole point of the Gallardo V10 is that it revs high so high and makes such good power NA that when you pair it with turbos it flat out annihilates everything. That's why the M3 is strong, that's why the Gallardo is strong, etc.

    Who cares if you have to build the motor? Do you want to play or not? Here's what it actually costs:

    Click here to enlarge

    If you don't have the money don't try to play with the big boys. Go talk about value modding or whatever.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    The modded 996 Turbo owners probably don't care about your $100k+ M3. I just keep mentioning the 996 because it's in the same price range as E9x M3s, and the motor is virtually the same in the 996 and 997. It's the same 3.6L GT1/Mezger motor; yea different turbos, turbo inlet piping, intercoolers, etc, but the motors are virtually the exact same thing.
    Oh gosh thank you so much for telling me about the 996 Turbo motor as if I don't know what it is. 996 turbos have fallen into the 30's, do I care? Does anyone buying an M3 care? NO, so you can stop trying to defend some old Porsche now kthxbye:

    Click here to enlarge

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    But Sticky if you're serious about a TT-R8 V10, you could be different and hit up AMS

    http://youtu.be/4YGsy8dsMgQ
    Why would I do that? I should get a used 996TT and be OMGSOFASTOMGOMGOMBONER. I could post on BB while sitting in my car waiting for the turbos to spool.

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
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  17. #492
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Autobahn335i Click here to enlarge
    As much as these twinturbo UGRs are youtube heroes for being fast in a straight line, I actually wonder how the drivability is. Turbo lag must be HUGE. Of course if a one trick pony is your thing it doesn't matter.
    It's a 5.2 liter V10 that makes great NA power... it's going to spool better than smaller motors especially at the same power levels.

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
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  18. #493
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
    The only reason you keep mentioning the 996 is because you ran out of arguments in support of the N54 to try and bash the S65 which is what you were first ranting on about.
    If he has to use other cars to try and defend a point about another motor nothing else needs to be said.

    If we're now comparing the S65 to a car that has been on the market and tuned for over a decade it seems to me the S65 just keeps on getting stronger.

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
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  19. #494
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bobS Click here to enlarge
    Lol every s65 owner is a expert on gearing and tq multiplication ....
    Not really.

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
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  20. #495
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Please tell me you read the 1st part of what I wrote from where you commented; if you haven't noticed I've spent the majority of time in this thread going with the $$$/Performance Argument.

    FACTS:

    • Stock motor capability (which makes up a significant majority of both aftermarket communities), the N54 > S65 **This is the camp I fall into; completely content with a Stock Motor/Stock Turbo 335 that I DD.
    • For high HP setups, NEITHER of them are ideal -- The N54 is held back by DI fueling (unless you want to constantly run meth), while the S65 requires a stupid amount of money to go above 650 WHP. If you want a high HP BMW, buy an E46 M3.
    • For relatively the same amount of money you can pick up an E9x M3 & mod the stock motor, you can buy a 996 Turbo (slightly dated, but that's why it's in the same price range) AND with the same "mod money" get a 700-800 WHP car that's going to give an all around better driving experience.


    AND if you go through the thread, you'll realize that Dzenno introduced the 996 as an alternative option, who's another N54 > S65 supporter.... But I don't see you saying $#@! to him
    Your stock motor talk is just completely idiotic. It's so stupid it borders on bizarre and I wonder about your ability to think critically. I don't understand why you can't comprehend there is a major design difference in building a motor for naturally aspirated or forced induction performance. The aspects that make a motor breathe well when on natural aspiration BENEFIT it once going to forced induction. You have to then tailor the motor to that application if you want to maximize potential.

    I mean do you really think you're bright because you mention a factory forced induction motor can gain more power on the stock internals? It's boosted from the factory. It was built with boost in mind. It has the appropriate compression ratio. Once you take a motor like an S54 or S65 and do the same it freaking WALKS AWAY. Same thing like a Gallardo once it is built for boost. It's a stronger platform and always will be, period.

    Nobody freaking cares about what horsepower level you can reach with a 996TT dollar per dollar. NOBODY CARES. You can buy a Mustang 5.0 for less and go faster for less. Do Porsche 991 Turbo buyers give a flying rats ass they could modifiy a Nissan GTR to be faster for less money? THEY DON'T CARE. You're argument is idiotic and invalid.

    Dzenno introduced the 996 because he had nothing to say in the face of the S65 smacking the N54 around like a red-headed step child. So he has to bring up other cars to fight his battles for him because this has gotten so one-sided it's an absolute joke. Here's reality: My car $#@! slaps both your cars. Deal with it.

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
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    Arguing with you is pointless since your S65 love drunk. ALL of your arguments come down to needing to building the motor and "pay to play". The realistic problem that you fail to realize is that people who chase big power and pay to play know that the E9x M3 is not the right car (if it was, built motors would be a lot more common). Congratulations, you have the Worlds Highest Power E9x M3, but 1) after all the time & money invested it better $#@!ing be the World's Most Powerful E9x M3 and 2) unless you're only gonna line up with E9x M3s, nobody's gonna give a $#@! how much power it's got when it loses to old ass 996 Turbo (in case you didn't figure it out, that's the irony behind Eddie Bello's Porsche beating the UGR Lambos).

    Yea it's great and all to be unique & do something different, but is it really worth it if after all the time & money spent that when you run against some other high power cars and it turns out that it's not that fast? I mean, look at the traditional selection of cars you see at the Texas Invitational/Texas Mile, Street Racing at Tx2K or on DragTimes -- Lots of GTRs, Supras, Porsches, and Turbo Lambos with Race Spec Motors (cars that you can justify spending $xxx,xxx on because there's a real performance return).

    After all this, it's kinda ironic that BMW stopped making the E9x M3 before your car is even running 100%. Between all the $#@! talking and bragging about how powerful it's going to be, if your car doesn't run a mid-5 sec 60-130 (Drew's VT3 fastest is a 6.64) or a sub-10.5 1/4 mile with a 140+ trap (current E9x M3 record is 10.65 @ 131.79 MPH with an ESS-625 DCT), this build bombed out.
    Last edited by benzy89; 10-24-2013 at 12:01 AM.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Arguing with you is pointless since your S65 love drunk. ALL of your arguments come down to needing to building the motor and "pay to play". The realistic problem that you fail to realize is that people who chase big power and pay to play know that the E9x M3 is not the right car (if it was, built motors would be a lot more common). Congratulations, you have the Worlds Highest Power E9x M3, but 1) after all the time & money invested it better $#@!ing be the World's Most Powerful E9x M3 and 2) unless you're only gonna line up with E9x M3s, nobody's gonna give a $#@! how much power it's got when it loses to old ass 996 Turbo (in case you didn't figure it out, that's the irony behind Eddie Bello's Porsche beating the UGR Lambos).

    Yea it's great and all to be unique & do something different, but is it really worth it if after all the time & money spent that when you run against some other high power cars and it turns out that it's not that fast? I mean, look at the traditional selection of cars you see at the Texas Invitational/Texas Mile, Street Racing at Tx2K or on DragTimes -- Lots of GTRs, Supras, Porsches, and Turbo Lambos with Race Spec Motors (cars that you can justify spending $xxx,xxx on because there's a real performance return).

    After all this, it's kinda ironic that BMW stopped making the E9x M3 before your car is even running 100%. Between all the $#@! talking and bragging about how powerful it's going to be, if your car doesn't run a mid-5 sec 60-130 (Drew's VT3 fastest is a 6.64) or a sub-10.5 1/4 mile with a 140+ trap (current E9x M3 record is 10.65 @ 131.79 MPH with an ESS-625 DCT), this build bombed out.
    i might like to do 133 in the quarter mile in the next week or two... maybe not though. ill try to get a 700whp with meth run down the strip and see if the auto trans holds up for the last hoo rah
    - Proven Power Tampa built 6466 ST -
    - N54 6AT WR 711whp 637wtq-
    -N54 WR 1/4mile trap: 133.57mph- -

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    And somewhere in Russia or Dubai some guy is reading this and laughing at us budget modding peasants while while he revs up one of his many jets. Real HP right there.
    jb4+fbo+meth

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Arguing with you is pointless since your S65 love drunk. ALL of your arguments come down to needing to building the motor and "pay to play". The realistic problem that you fail to realize is that people who chase big power and pay to play know that the E9x M3 is not the right car (if it was, built motors would be a lot more common). Congratulations, you have the Worlds Highest Power E9x M3, but 1) after all the time & money invested it better $#@!ing be the World's Most Powerful E9x M3 and 2) unless you're only gonna line up with E9x M3s, nobody's gonna give a $#@! how much power it's got when it loses to old ass 996 Turbo (in case you didn't figure it out, that's the irony behind Eddie Bello's Porsche beating the UGR Lambos).

    Yea it's great and all to be unique & do something different, but is it really worth it if after all the time & money spent that when you run against some other high power cars and it turns out that it's not that fast? I mean, look at the traditional selection of cars you see at the Texas Invitational/Texas Mile, Street Racing at Tx2K or on DragTimes -- Lots of GTRs, Supras, Porsches, and Turbo Lambos with Race Spec Motors (cars that you can justify spending $xxx,xxx on because there's a real performance return).

    After all this, it's kinda ironic that BMW stopped making the E9x M3 before your car is even running 100%. Between all the $#@! talking and bragging about how powerful it's going to be, if your car doesn't run a mid-5 sec 60-130 (Drew's VT3 fastest is a 6.64) or a sub-10.5 1/4 mile with a 140+ trap (current E9x M3 record is 10.65 @ 131.79 MPH with an ESS-625 DCT), this build bombed out.
    The E92 M3 is not the right, car why not? You want to talk about a 996TT? Since when is the 3-Series and 911 ever compared? Fit four adults with luggage in a 911 and come talk to me. Secondly, not everyone wants an all wheel drive car. I prefer a rear wheel drive with a dual clutch and I prefer a high revving V8. Sounds like I have the right car.

    I'm going to lose to what exactly? The M3 even on stock internals with a bolt on blower runs 130 traps. That is enough to beat 99.9% of cars out there as is. It's way faster than anything you own. All on stock internals, pump gas, with four seats offering excellent daily usability and fun factor. What exactly are all these cars beating it? You're bringing up UGR Lambos and the fastest Porsche's as your examples? That makes the car look strong, not weak.

    Not that fast? I just won a damn roll on event against all the other AMG's and M's. What are you smoking? You wouldn't even be able to show up at the event without tucking your tail between your legs and you're trying to talk down to me? I'm going to making more than double your wheel horsepower. You need to stop talking. It's your ride that's weak, not mine. It's a joke.

    Is it ironic BMW stopped making the E46 M3 before it could be tuned for a turbo kit on the stock DME? Does it matter? People are still modding them. The E92 M3 is still the strongest E9X. People still mod N54's. Maybe you should stop being such a pathetic hater already and just appreciate people doing things you aren't. You're on a BMW Performance forum so appreciate people pushing the BMW performance envelope since you aren't and can't.

    I don't care what you think about how powerful my car is or isn't. All we can be certain of is you can't play with it or any single car you have mentioned so stop telling the people at the top what they should have or should be doing when you're at the bottom looking up.

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
    : http://www.boostaddict.com/showthrea...r-kit-for-sale

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    The E92 M3 is not the right car why not? You want to talk about a 996TT? Since when is the 3-Series and 911 ever compared? Fit four adults with luggage in a 911 and come talk to me. Secondly, not everyone wants an all wheel drive car. I prefer a rear wheel drive with a dual cluthc and I prefer a high revving V8. Sounds like I have the right car.
    It's not right for HIGH POWER. Room for 4 adults and luggage aren't a priority or relevant here.


    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky
    I'm going to lose to what exactly? The M3 even on stock internals with a bolt on blower runs 130 traps. That is enough to beat 99.9% of cars out there as is.
    And a stock 997.2 with a PDK runs 10.7 @ 127, a tune only GTR can run 11 @ 129.... Both pretty common cars

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky
    Not that fast? I just won a damn roll on event against all the other AMG's and M's. What are you smoking? You wouldn't even be able to show up at the event without tucking your tail between your legs and your trying to talk down to me? I'm going to making more than double your wheel horsepower. You need to stop talking. It's your ride that's weak, not mine.
    What we know (Because the recent Shift S3ctor's coverage was $#@!; here's the best I found):
    • You won the Mercedes/BMW category, not the RWD class or the Top Event Trap (Comparison sake, an N/A C6 Z06 trapped 168)
    • That Drew's VT3 (should beat) and LAB22 Turbo E46 M3s (should be interesting) were both having problems. I already posted all the specs/dynos/60-130 times/etc on the LAB car vs. your projected numbers, and like I said the LAB cars should win (more area under the curve/better gearing/post-shift for powerband), but it depends on the driver.
    • Weistec didn't bring any M156 Stage 3s. A CLS M157 with Weistec's Upgraded Turbos, Downpipes, Cooling Mods & Ice Tank was there and trapped 164.5. It dyno'd at 707 WHP/816 WTQ (DJ) running a 91/MS109 blend. For those interested, an E92 M3 curb weight is ~3600 lbs while the CLS AMG is ~4300 lbs (I know, the CLS has significantly more WTQ than the M3 has).
    • JR's CLK63 (900 WHP @ 15psi on 3L blower when it ran / setup up 1,000 WHP now) previously trapped 182 and his C63-BS (790 WHP @ 12psi on 3L blower) stock motor/stock trans/pump gas tune Stage 3 trapped 166 (when it beat Drew's VT3) at the April Shift S3ctor.


    This is so people can see the difference between a car that traps 166 and one that traps 182



    I'm not bragging about how fast my stock turbo N54 is. For someone who's car has run ONCE against a bunch of other cars that weren't 100% (and neither was your car with the slipping DCT), you're doing a lot of bragging about how it's going to beat all this $#@!.
    Last edited by benzy89; 10-24-2013 at 02:25 AM.
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