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  1. #1
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    Engine and Transmission mounts

    Hey guys,

    My mechanic has recommended I replace my engine mounts to solve a vibration due to downpipes hitting the sub-frame on left hand turns while accelerating.

    Would like to know the communities thoughts on engine and transmission mounts.

    As far as the engine mounts I was wondering if anyone can confirm if the right 335IS mount is direct fitment on the 335i and for the left side if the Coretco engine mount is the OEM supplier. I don't mind paying extra for OEM quality but don't want to be a sucker when the part comes and I paid an extra $30 for the OEM BMW and it comes stamped Corteco on the part.

    Does anyone have any experience or recommendations for transmission mounts? OEM, UUC. I've heard the e46 M3 mounts are a good option as well. The car is drag raced a couple times a month in the summer and is daily driven otherwise.

    Link

    http://www.ecstuning.com/BMW-E92-335.../Engine/Mount/

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    I personally purchased ecs trans mounts, did so after seeing they worked out well for others, for engine mounts couldn't tell ya, if you want less movement you probably don't want genuine BMW OEM as most mounts are padded or softer to improve a quiet smooth ride
    2009 335i coupe back to stock...for now

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    From what I've read, engine and tranny mounts followed by diff mounts are the major sources of NVH. Go stiffer than stock and you should notice some increases immediately.

    I haven't really seen much about upgraded engine mounts for our platform other than something that Dzenno posted in another thread but definitely there are a few options for the transmission mounts. Stiffer transmission mounts will reduce the twisting force on the gearbox whilst accelerating and allow for easier and smoother shifts, most noticeable in the 1->2 shift.

    E46 M3 ones are rubber and can definitely be used. I have a set on order myself. They are the exactly same profile and shape as the OEM ones except they're made of a harder rubber. Reviews indicate minor increases in NVH but improved shift feel. UUC black ones are urethane and a more cylindrical shape and will therefore be stiffer. This means they will introduce more NVH still but also further improved shift feel. There have however been reports of them splitting in half. Another option are Rogue Engineering ones. They're made of a harder rubber then OEM but also the profile is similar to the UUC ones which means they won't compress as much. I've read that they introduce little to no NVH but improve the shift feel. Probably similar or better than E46 M3 mounts.

    The most harsh mounts would probably be UUC blue and then red ones which are recommended for the track vehicles only.

    If your priority is minimal NVH then the order of transmission mounts would be:

    OEM -> E46 M3 -> Rogue Engineering -> UUC Black -> UUC Blue -> UUC Red

    It would obviously be vice versa if you're looking for improved shift feel and reduced movement of the transmission. I would recommend trying one of these options first and seeing if it improves your issue. It's an easy and cheap install.

    Also, are your DPs aftermarket? Have you considered a faulty product or install job causing the clearance to be too close to the subframe?
    Stuff

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    I went from 80k old oem mounts to the 335is right and new oem 335i left as well as UUC black tranny mounts. The shift feel from 1st to 2nd definitely improved and I didn't really feel a significant increase in NVH. However that was until I changed to the Spec steel SMF and gear chatter was crazy at a certain point and vibrated through the transmission tunnel. I've now gone back to Meyle replacement mounts and the noise has reduced massively.

    Not sure what brand was stamped on the new mounts I bought but I'd bet that they are manufactured by Corteco so that shouldn't be much of a problem.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by froop Click here to enlarge
    Also, are your DPs aftermarket? Have you considered a faulty product or install job causing the clearance to be too close to the subframe?
    I think your vibration might be due to one of the points mentioned above
    Alpine White 2008 6MT 335i - Cobb AP - PTF Tuned - RB Turbos - AR DPs - VRSF 3.5" exhaust - Custom FMIC - 380mm BBK F&R - BMS DCI - M3 DCT LSD - Whiteline subframe bushes - M3 Sways and rear arms - M3 wishbones - ER CP - Spec Stage 3+ clutch and steel SMFW - AST 4100 Coilovers - UUC DSSR -UUC Black tranny mounts - TMS Alu diff bushes - Forge DVs - Aquamist HFS-4 meth - Alufelgen CS7s - BMWP V1 Steering Wheel

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    I bought the IS ones . One of them is beefier.
    07 335i AT - MOTIV 750 - MHD BMS E85 - BMS PI - JB4G5 - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - Helix IC - Stett CP - Custom midpipes with 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - LUX H8 - Level 10 AT upgrade
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    Btw, here's the iS mount (right side). There isn't a non oem variant like the left side.
    http://www.ecstuning.com/BMW-E92-335...unt/ES1897640/
    [02/07 E92 335i 6MT] - Under Construction

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    I just went with the UUC blues with the upgraded cups, installed them with the spec 3+ clutch and SMFW. Um, the car sounded like a diesel truck, the gearbox chatter was so loud I could not talk in the car, I thought something was wrong with the flywheel, I did the installation exactly how UUC describes, even called them, I actually uninstalled and reinstalled them 4 times to try to fix it, nothing worked. Went back to stock, perfectly smooth and quiet, it was prob my fault for going blue, Dzenno has the black ones and says he didnt notice any difference in noise or vibration. My .02 cents.

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    Hmmmm I got the red ones...hope I don't regret it.
    2009 335i coupe back to stock...for now

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    Hmmmm I got the red ones...hope I don't regret it.
    If you are serious send them back bffote you install them. They are absolutely not street able, maybe with a dmfw they sing be as bad, after trying blue, I suggest nothing over black for a street car.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    If you are serious send them back bffote you install them. They are absolutely not street able, maybe with a dmfw they sing be as bad, after trying blue, I suggest nothing over black for a street car.
    yeah, I'm serious, you said you got cups though as well? Do you think they caused some of the noise? Maybe the bushing itself won't be so bad? I can live with some noise and vibration if it means helping my tranny hold up to the new torque levels of the Stage 2's. If there's not much to gain in that department then I guess I'm wasting my time. My thought was between mounts and alpina flash maybe it will be ok, and possibly do something to help cooling too.

    EDIT: I just don't see there being a night and day difference in vibration and noise between black to blue and blue to red. Unless you have those cups they are selling with the $70 set.
    2009 335i coupe back to stock...for now

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  11. #11
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    yeah, I'm serious, you said you got cups though as well? Do you think they caused some of the noise? Maybe the bushing itself won't be so bad? I can live with some noise and vibration if it means helping my tranny hold up to the new torque levels of the Stage 2's. If there's not much to gain in that department then I guess I'm wasting my time. My thought was between mounts and alpina flash maybe it will be ok, and possibly do something to help cooling too.

    EDIT: I just don't see there being a night and day difference in vibration and noise between black to blue and blue to red. Unless you have those cups they are selling with the $70 set.
    Well I thought the same thing, until I installed them, so do as you will, but red is no vibration dampening at all. You are running a bolt straight through clamping them together, your car is not going to be street able at that point as far as engine gearbox noise and vibration, but that is just my opinion, and experience with blue. The car was literally unbearable and I have a high tolerance for cars with no manners, it would shake your fillings out and even with the radio blasting you could hear the gear box unless you had the clutch in.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Well I thought the same thing, until I installed them, so do as you will, but red is no vibration dampening at all. You are running a bolt straight through clamping them together, your car is not going to be street able at that point as far as engine gearbox noise and vibration, but that is just my opinion, and experience with blue. The car was literally unbearable and I have a high tolerance for cars with no manners, it would shake your fillings out and even with the radio blasting you could hear the gear box unless you had the clutch in.
    Hmmm this is troubling...black is now ordered. Good thing these mounts are cheap.
    2009 335i coupe back to stock...for now

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Well I thought the same thing, until I installed them, so do as you will, but red is no vibration dampening at all. You are running a bolt straight through clamping them together, your car is not going to be street able at that point as far as engine gearbox noise and vibration, but that is just my opinion, and experience with blue. The car was literally unbearable and I have a high tolerance for cars with no manners, it would shake your fillings out and even with the radio blasting you could hear the gear box unless you had the clutch in.
    I have reds, they're loud but not 'unstreetable' with SMFW.

    Dzenno broke his UUC black mounts.
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    I have reds, they're loud but not 'unstreetable' with SMFW.

    Dzenno broke his UUC black mounts.
    I couldn't stand the blue ones, he broke his stock mounts and went to blacks if I understood what he told me correctly. He hasn't broken the black mounts. It could have very well been the cups, but I am too deep in doing other things to give that a try, we were making 609 tq and has zero problems with stock 60,xxx milage stock mounts.

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    Thanks for the input guys.

    As far as my downpipes they are Macht Snell and they were installed by myself about 2 years ago. After a couple attempts I got them clocked so they didn't hit the sub frame or each other pretty much a credit card thickness in between them and the sub frame. Though not exactly as vibration free as OEM DP's they were pretty good and not really noticeable.

    After my mechanic did the wavetrac install and lots of drag racing I've a developed rubbing / vibration issues on left hand turns that seems to be originating from the DP's hitting the subframe. I had him re adjust the down pipes twice and re check the diff install and we still can't rid of the vibration. He's suggested I do the engine mounts and I'm at 115KM + 5year old car and I do feel a bit of slack during sudden breaking so i figure I'd give it a shot.

    While I'm at I figure I'll do the trans mounts as well. I'm currently leaning toward the M3 mounts but wonder if i should try the next level stiffer ones and see how they fair with the 6AT vs 6 manual in terms of NVH.

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    I'm confused your DP's are hitting on turns and accelerating? I would expect an issue like this to be happening at WOT shifts when the engine is actually rocking back and forth at it's most, unless you just can't hear it at that moment.

    Most cars I've dealt with you typically want to do most mounts as a set. Meaning you wouldn't put solid mounts on the tranny and leave old used OEM mounts on the engine when they work together. For the street you would normally either replace them with new or upgrade to the next +1 or +2 harder and only run solid or near solid for ridiculous power levels or all out race cars where you don't care about NVH.
    2008 135i - Cobb AP, JB4 G5 w/2Step&FSB, MS DP's, Berk street exhaust, AMS IC, VTT Inlets, UR Intake, ER CP w/Tial BOV, Spec 3+ & Steel FW, CDV delete, Quaife LSD, DSS Axles, M3 control arms, M3 rear SF bushings, M3 Trans bushings, SS brake lines. Pics

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    The vibration is strictly left turns under power, coasting through a left turn no vibration. The theory is inertia of the turn plus torque through the drive train causes the interference between sub frame and DP's. Straight line acceleration no issues, strangely...

    All of this was after the wavetrac install, right hand turns + straight line no issues.

    I plan on doing the left mount OEM 335i which is the same as the 335is mounts and the upgraded 335is right mount and the e46 m3 trans mount.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bv1 Click here to enlarge
    I've a developed rubbing / vibration issues on left hand turns that seems to be originating from the DP's hitting the subframe.
    What's your milage? Have you ever replaced your front tension struts?

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    how do you know when your mounts are broken or need replacing?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Tzu Click here to enlarge
    What's your milage? Have you ever replaced your front tension struts?
    115km on the car, front tension struts have not been replaced. I'll ask my mechanic to check them.

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    FWIW, my mechanic gave my car a once over when he did my diff, and nothing was visably in distress. about a month later, the front tension strut hydraulic bearings started leaking. They just wear out and it comes out of no where and can cause vibration and steering slop. Upgraded to M3 ones, probably the best $/happiness mod I've done; should have done it sooner.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Tzu Click here to enlarge
    FWIW, my mechanic gave my car a once over when he did my diff, and nothing was visably in distress. about a month later, the front tension strut hydraulic bearings started leaking. They just wear out and it comes out of no where and can cause vibration and steering slop. Upgraded to M3 ones, probably the best $/happiness mod I've done; should have done it sooner.
    Honestly after comparing the tension strut from an M3 to the one I removed from my 335, I don't think there is any difference besides the bushing. And even in the M3 tension strut, the bushing is still a rubber one which binds the suspension movement. If the stock tension strut bushings are leaking and do need replaced (very common as Tzu stated) I would use something like the Whiteline W83391 which is polyurethane and allows for the suspension to move freely. The lower control arm in the front is definitely different between the M and non-M cars. It is shaped differently and uses a spherical bearing again to allow the suspension to move freely.

    There is almost no additional NVH with the polyurethane tension strut (radius arm) bushings as they do not support the vehicle's weight. You may notice bumps a little more when cornering, but in my opinion that is better than the tire deflecting some strange way when you are trying to turn.
    Eppur si muove.

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    The stock mounts seem to be pretty firm without transferring too much vibration. Not sure how well they will hold up under extreme power levels; but it seems like BMW did a pretty good job with them.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ajm8127 Click here to enlarge
    Honestly after comparing the tension strut from an M3 to the one I removed from my 335, I don't think there is any difference besides the bushing. And even in the M3 tension strut, the bushing is still a rubber one which binds the suspension movement. If the stock tension strut bushings are leaking and do need replaced (very common as Tzu stated) I would use something like the Whiteline W83391 which is polyurethane and allows for the suspension to move freely. The lower control arm in the front is definitely different between the M and non-M cars. It is shaped differently and uses a spherical bearing again to allow the suspension to move freely.

    There is almost no additional NVH with the polyurethane tension strut (radius arm) bushings as they do not support the vehicle's weight. You may notice bumps a little more when cornering, but in my opinion that is better than the tire deflecting some strange way when you are trying to turn.
    I've tried both the M3 'tension strut' and 'lower control arms' (or upper/lower control arms if you'd prefer) and the 335i ones with poly bushings.
    I can say that the geometry change provided by the M3 LCA was of a huge benefit and while the poly bushings definitely did a lot to stiffen the OEM 335i LCA and UCAs the feeling wasn't as pronounced as the M3 bits.
    Now IIRC the M3's 'Tension Strut' has a beefier bushing but nearly identical geometries. Those considering M3 bits versus poly bits will be better served with M3 bits.
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    I've tried both the M3 'tension strut' and 'lower control arms' (or upper/lower control arms if you'd prefer) and the 335i ones with poly bushings.
    I can say that the geometry change provided by the M3 LCA was of a huge benefit and while the poly bushings definitely did a lot to stiffen the OEM 335i LCA and UCAs the feeling wasn't as pronounced as the M3 bits.
    Now IIRC the M3's 'Tension Strut' has a beefier bushing but nearly identical geometries. Those considering M3 bits versus poly bits will be better served with M3 bits.
    What I'm suggesting is to replace the rubber bushing in the 335 tension strut with a poly one to free up suspension movement because it seems the M3 tension strut is not different geometrically than the 335 one. Also, buy the M3 LCA because of the added negative camber and spherical bearing.
    Eppur si muove.

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