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  1. #176
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135Hoser Click here to enlarge
    So, Whats the reason behind partnering specifically with BT for the cables?

    I'm probably over simplifying things, but once you open the port for comms, aren't you always going to be talking the same protocol to the DME regardless of the cable?
    People already have BT cables, they work, they do logging, clear codes, etc. Essentially they are the best option right now.

  2. #177
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Matt, you always were one to speak up about people not paying you what they should for your work and how 'cheap' people are these days. I'm surprised to see you advocating a hack to essentially circumvent BT's desire for their product and their work. It's hypocritical to say the least.

    I won't be hosting anything regarding hacking BT cables for unlimited VIN's, that is not what this project is about. BT's decisions are theirs and if someone doesn't like it they should buy something else.
    Does this mean no discussion of it, or you just won't host software relating to the circumvention of it? If the former, whether or not any of us agree with the ethics behind this activity shouldn't matter. That's why you have the rep system in place. While it would be naive to assume everyone would participate in the discussion only for educational purposes, disallowing it all together seems like censorship to me.
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  3. #178
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    Does this mean no discussion of it, or you just won't host software relating to the circumvention of it? If the former, whether or not any of us agree with the ethics behind this activity shouldn't matter. That's why you have the rep system in place. While it would be naive to assume everyone would participate in the discussion only for educational purposes, disallowing it all together seems like censorship to me.
    He brought it up and it isn't removed so what censorship? I'm not hosting a hack a BT DIY.

    If one wants a cheap cable try the software with a cheap cable, get it working with a cheap cable, or buy a used BT.

  4. #179
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    He brought it up and it isn't removed so what censorship? I'm not hosting a hack a BT DIY.

    If one wants a cheap cable try the software with a cheap cable, get it working with a cheap cable, or buy a used BT.
    Well, there isn't exactly much to censor... yet.

    If someone posted up an unlimited vin DIY or began a discussion toward working in that direction, you would delete it as opposed to letting the community decide with negative or positive reps?
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  5. #180
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    Really exciting to see a TRUE open source alternative come out for the N54. To everyone involved in making this happen from scratch rather than stealing others work you have our full support on this project. For those on a budget and not looking for what is IMHO the top shelf in hardware/software quality/refinement/support that comes with Cobb's AccessPort, once the project is stable and production ready, we'll be happy to offer our tuning expertise and offer our support that way.

    Looks like partial write is a win which is really important when you're on the dyno and time is of the essence. Proper datalogging also sounds like is coming along nicely. Keep up the great work!
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  6. #181
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    If someone posted up an unlimited vin DIY or began a discussion toward working in that direction, you would delete it as opposed to letting the community decide with negative or positive reps?
    Hiding behind the community to hack and essentially steal aftermarket companies products/profits has never been something this website or network has actively engaged in or promoted.

    If someone comes on here wanting to trade ripped off Cobb maps I won't be hosting that either. Why something that would make me liable would be a community decision in your mind I have no clue.

  7. #182
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Hiding behind the community to hack and essentially steal aftermarket companies products/profits has never been something this website or network has actively engaged in or promoted.

    If someone comes on here wanting to trade ripped off Cobb maps I won't be hosting that either. Why something that would make me liable would be a community decision in your mind I have no clue.
    So hacking/stealing from BMW/Siemens has less legal ramifications than hacking Bavarian Technic's cable? I understand not wanting to host the tools needed to perform such circumvention on the BT cable (despite your plan to host several hacked BMW files), but what legal prosecution could you incur for the mere educational discussion of it?

    Did you not also host a several hundred post long thread about basically pirating alpina's TCU software, detailing where to acquire it and how to apply it to the car?
    Last edited by tofu; 08-06-2013 at 01:03 PM.
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  8. #183
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    lol easy on the legal stuff guys. Plausible deniability is our best friend at this point.
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  9. #184
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    lol easy on the legal stuff guys. Plausible deniability is our best friend at this point.
    he brought up liability as a reason for censoring future discussions about "unlocking" the BT cable, so i'm trying to understand the logic behind his statement.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    he brought up liability as a reason for censoring future discussions about "unlocking" the BT cable, so i'm trying to understand the logic behind his statement.
    C'mon man, logic and sticky go together like tuna fish and lamb. Have you ever read one of his M3 vs xxxxx discussions?
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  11. #186
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    Oh man...
    Eppur si muove.

  12. #187
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    So hacking/stealing from BMW/Siemens has less legal ramifications than hacking Bavarian Technic's cable? I understand not wanting to host the tools needed to perform such circumvention on the BT cable (despite your plan to host several hacked BMW files), but what legal prosecution could you incur for the mere educational discussion of it?

    Did you not also host a several hundred post long thread about basically pirating alpina's TCU software, detailing where to acquire it and how to apply it to the car?
    How is it stealing from Siemens to read/flash hardware you own?

    I am not hosting ANY Alpina software you might have noticed.

    I really don't see the problem here.

  13. #188
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    he brought up liability as a reason for censoring future discussions about "unlocking" the BT cable, so i'm trying to understand the logic behind his statement.
    I don't even have to explain my logic if I don't want to. BimmerBoost won't be hacking BT cables simple as that move on.

    If you want a cheaper solution edit the software to work with some cheap ebay cable.

  14. #189
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    How is it stealing from Siemens to read/flash hardware you own?

    I am not hosting ANY Alpina software you might have noticed.

    I really don't see the problem here.
    Well that just brings us 'round full circle, doesn't it? You'll host/discuss hacked BMW files, and you'll support a discussion on how to pirate and use Alpina software, but you won't allow a discussion on how to hack the BT cable?

    What if i own a COBB device? By your logic, I can then discuss how to rip and modify maps, and allow others to download them via your file depository? If i own a BT cable, am i not allowed to modify it to suit my needs, as you are doing with BMW's software?

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    I don't even have to explain my logic if I don't want to. BimmerBoost won't be hacking BT cables simple as that move on.

    If you want a cheaper solution edit the software to work with some cheap ebay cable.
    So you are in essence selectively censoring topics based on your feelings with no explanation. This is completely against what you advertise this forum to be.
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  15. #190
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    Well that just brings us 'round full circle, doesn't it? You'll host/discuss hacked BMW files, and you'll support a discussion on how to pirate and use Alpina software, but you won't allow a discussion on how to hack the BT cable?
    What hacked BMW files?

    I'm not hosting any Alpina software one again.

    Yes, I will not host instructions on how to hack a BT cable because I'm not in the business of trying to hurt BT. The fact you seem to want to is downright shameful.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    So you are in essence selectively censoring topics based on your feelings with no explanation. This is completely against what you advertise this forum to be.
    Where does it say in the rules I have to explain every decision I make on my forum on a daily basis to you? Where was that advertised as what this forum is?

    You are essentially $#@!ing and complaining you can't steal BT cables. Pony up money for a cable and quit whining or edit the FREE software to work with whatever cable you want.

    I have no desire to steal, hurt, destroy, or host anything negatively impacting Bavarian Technic. If you have a problem with that, too bad.

  16. #191
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    What hacked BMW files?

    I'm not hosting any Alpina software one again.

    Yes, I will not host instructions on how to hack a BT cable because I'm not in the business of trying to hurt BT. The fact you seem to want to is downright shameful.



    Where does it say in the rules I have to explain every decision I make on my forum on a daily basis to you? Where was that advertised as what this forum is?

    You are essentially $#@!ing and complaining you can't steal BT cables. Pony up money for a cable and quit whining or edit the FREE software to work with whatever cable you want.

    I have no desire to steal, hurt, destroy, or host anything negatively impacting Bavarian Technic. If you have a problem with that, too bad.


    I never said you hosted any Alpina files. I said you hosted a thread discussing how to acquire the pirated files and apply them to the vehicle. Please do not put words into my mouth.

    Shameful or not, you are being a hypocrite. You are also making a huge assumption that i'm somehow looking to screw BT over. The forum is touted as censorship free, and you are pulling a 180.

    You don't have to explain anything to anyone, but I figured you'd at least like to clear up the air considering how vocal you are on your own forum.

    My problem isn't with ponying up money for a BT cable, it is with your hypocrisy.
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  17. #192
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    I never said you hosted any Alpina files. I said you hosted a thread discussing how to acquire the pirated files and apply them to the vehicle. Please do not put words into my mouth.

    Shameful or not, you are being a hypocrite. You are also making a huge assumption that i'm somehow looking to screw BT over. The forum is touted as censorship free, and you are pulling a 180.

    You don't have to explain anything to anyone, but I figured you'd at least like to clear up the air considering how vocal you are on your own forum.

    My problem isn't with ponying up money for a BT cable, it is with your hypocrisy.
    Exactly, no Alpina files being hosted here.

    I'm not being a hypocrite you're crying about me not letting you hurt Bavarian Technic who Terry is trying to make a deal with. Really dude? Spoiled brats.

    This forum isn't advertised anywhere as censorship free you seem to have something else built in your mind. It offers far more freedom than any other forum and more power for the users but at no point is chaos, theft, or anything goes advocated. That might be why we do have certain rules? So what's the 180?

    I have cleared the air and said I won't be hosting anything regarding hacking BT's cables. I stated it's hypocritical of Matt to complain about how cheap people are yet he is doing the exact same thing he complains about.

    So sorry, I don't see any hypocrisy on my part whatsoever. This 'open' forum won't host child porn, pirated software, and it won't host how to circumvent BT's encryption. Certain things are on a case by case basis and I'm not sure what more you need to know about my stance on this.

  18. #193
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 135Hoser Click here to enlarge
    So, Whats the reason behind partnering specifically with BT for the cables?

    I'm probably over simplifying things, but once you open the port for comms, aren't you always going to be talking the same protocol to the DME regardless of the cable?
    There are many reasons actually. I just had a discussion about this with someone, but opening the device for comms is a driver/operating system problem. Getting the cable interface configured to communicate with the DME is an cable interface API and firmware problem. With the BT cable, we already have both of those figured out, so I'm not going to beat my head over one or both of them trying to use the inpa cable or other cables. Unless someone feels like rewriting the firmware on a cable and provide the API.

    INPA cables for example, getting them to communicate with the computer is not possible at the moment without using the ediabas protocol, which there is little to no information on, and I also don't know the api to configure it for can or k-line communications.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Exactly, no Alpina files being hosted here.

    I'm not being a hypocrite you're crying about me not letting you hurt Bavarian Technic who Terry is trying to make a deal with. Really dude? Spoiled brats.

    This forum isn't advertised anywhere as censorship free you seem to have something else built in your mind. It offers far more freedom than any other forum and more power for the users but at no point is chaos, theft, or anything goes advocated. That might be why we do have certain rules? So what's the 180?

    I have cleared the air and said I won't be hosting anything regarding hacking BT's cables. I stated it's hypocritical of Matt to complain about how cheap people are yet he is doing the exact same thing he complains about.

    So sorry, I don't see any hypocrisy on my part whatsoever. This 'open' forum won't host child porn, pirated software, and it won't host how to circumvent BT's encryption. Certain things are on a case by case basis and I'm not sure what more you need to know about my stance on this.
    Look, you need to cut the nonsense. Comparing this to child pornography is absurd.

    If you can't see the hypocrisy in the fact that you'll host discussions related to alpina piracy and bmw hacks on the basis that we already "own the hardware", but won't allow people to discuss (NOT UPLOAD FILES) bt cable hacking, you're a schmuck. Plain and simple. Stop trying to paint me as some kind of BT terrorist out to destroy the company.

    Let's not hide behind a freedom cloak when in fact your practices are just as bad as Jason's, just targeted differently. I dislike the guy, but at least he's consistent.


    This is veering way off topic since you're choosing to go out on tangents about porn and chaos, as opposed to bmw DME related tools and modifications (such as the BT cable), so this will be my last statement on the matter.
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  20. #195
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    Look, you need to cut the nonsense. Comparing this to child pornography is absurd.

    If you can't see the hypocrisy in the fact that you'll host discussions related to alpina piracy and bmw hacks on the basis that we already "own the hardware", but won't allow people to discuss (NOT UPLOAD FILES) bt cable hacking, you're a schmuck. Plain and simple. Stop trying to paint me as some kind of BT terrorist out to destroy the company.

    Let's not hide behind a freedom cloak when in fact your practices are just as bad as Jason's, just targeted differently. I dislike the guy, but at least he's consistent.


    This is veering way off topic since you're choosing to go out on tangents about porn and chaos, as opposed to bmw DME related tools and modifications (such as the BT cable), so this will be my last statement on the matter.
    I'm not saying its equivelant I'm telling you there are things this site won't host thereby obviously showing you that there ARE things that you expect to be censored.

    I don't see the hypocrisy at all in hosting discussion about modifying Alpina's software which I do not host and hosting discussion to modify someone's locked out hardware. This isn't an all or nothing thing and each case is unique and different. I won't be promoting, hosting, or helping someone hack a BT cable and have no desire to cause BT any business.

    Modifying Alpina's software as many of you done is done because you can't just buy the trans flash alone from Alpina now can you? So this isn't apples to apples by any means.

    Yep, now throw out the Jason defense because God forbid we have certain limits. Next you'll say I'm worse than Hitler. Once again, spoiled brats. You seem to forget how good you have it.

    I'm not veering off topic at all I'm making a very distinct point that this forum has rules and certain things are expected to be deleted. Do you expect me to leave spam up? Not ban spammer accounts? So the precedent for deletion and censoring certain things for the benefit of the forum has always existed this is nothing new. If you don't see the difference between Jason and I then there is nothing I can do to help you.

  21. #196
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Matt, you always were one to speak up about people not paying you what they should for your work and how 'cheap' people are these days. I'm surprised to see you advocating a hack to essentially circumvent BT's desire for their product and their work. It's hypocritical to say the least.

    I won't be hosting anything regarding hacking BT cables for unlimited VIN's, that is not what this project is about. BT's decisions are theirs and if someone doesn't like it they should buy something else.
    First off, it was given to me free and in that condition. I dont know how it was hacked or even if it truly does work. I was told that you can scan each control module separatley but if you do a full scan it will lock up.

    So before you get all bent out of shape about me being a hypocrite and being a cheapass myself, im not. Hell if i can even find where i put it ill give it away for all i care. all i wanted to do was see if it would even work in its given state and do a read/write/flash whatever you call it.

    And even so, isnt this whole thread about bypassing tuners and just doing your own maps? Saves you the $ of having to buy a cobb flashloader, isnt that taking money out of their pocket?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Itsbrokeagain Click here to enlarge
    First off, it was given to me free and in that condition. I dont know how it was hacked or even if it truly does work. I was told that you can scan each control module separatley but if you do a full scan it will lock up.

    So before you get all bent out of shape about me being a hypocrite and being a cheapass myself, im not. Hell if i can even find where i put it ill give it away for all i care. all i wanted to do was see if it would even work in its given state and do a read/write/flash whatever you call it.

    And even so, isnt this whole thread about bypassing tuners and just doing your own maps? Saves you the $ of having to buy a cobb flashloader, isnt that taking money out of their pocket?
    What's funny is I have tried to look all over for a BT "hack", but I can't anything even close to it. I wonder what was done to your cable, just out of curiosity and ingenuity.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 1chanc3 Click here to enlarge
    What's funny is I have tried to look all over for a BT "hack", but I can't anything even close to it. I wonder what was done to your cable, just out of curiosity and ingenuity.
    There is no DIY. It was done by a computer programmer who knows his way around a file. Thats about all the info I have.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    Well that just brings us 'round full circle, doesn't it? You'll host/discuss hacked BMW files, and you'll support a discussion on how to pirate and use Alpina software, but you won't allow a discussion on how to hack the BT cable?

    What if i own a COBB device? By your logic, I can then discuss how to rip and modify maps, and allow others to download them via your file depository? If i own a BT cable, am i not allowed to modify it to suit my needs, as you are doing with BMW's software?



    So you are in essence selectively censoring topics based on your feelings with no explanation. This is completely against what you advertise this forum to be.
    Listen, you're going too far on the censorship bit.

    All hacks are not equal. Modifying a software that you have a license to use, like the Siemens VDO firmware is one thing. Hacking a piece of software to circumvent paying for it is another thing. I doubt sticky has a track record of hosting discussion of software IP theft, the alpina flash does fall into this category and perhaps he should rethink his position on allowing that thread. But honestly censorship is pretty much the opposite of what he's known for. if there are other threads or posts which fit this unacceptable criteria, perhaps they should be brought to his attention where he will need to make a decision on what his policy is and how he is going to enforce it. Personally as a software developer I do not like to see my work be stolen in front of my face and I doubt there are many who would disagree with this statement. So if we are here to debate anything, it should be regarding his enforcement of policies, not whether or not he is censoring because we all know what that is.
    Last edited by klipseracer; 08-07-2013 at 12:51 AM.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Itsbrokeagain Click here to enlarge
    First off, it was given to me free and in that condition. I dont know how it was hacked or even if it truly does work. I was told that you can scan each control module separatley but if you do a full scan it will lock up.

    So before you get all bent out of shape about me being a hypocrite and being a cheapass myself, im not. Hell if i can even find where i put it ill give it away for all i care. all i wanted to do was see if it would even work in its given state and do a read/write/flash whatever you call it.

    And even so, isnt this whole thread about bypassing tuners and just doing your own maps? Saves you the $ of having to buy a cobb flashloader, isnt that taking money out of their pocket?
    If this was about money why isn't anyone making any?

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