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  1. #26
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bryce Click here to enlarge
    when the cobb maps first came out, the boost occilations were pretty bad and some members reported hitting 17+ psi in the low-midrange. that was circa 2011 i believe. any more questions?

    17 psi down low with like 4 degrees of timing. safe but slow to respond.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    17 psi down low with like 4 degrees of timing. safe but slow to respond.
    right. that post was more for torgas' education

  3. #28
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    17 psi down low with like 4 degrees of timing. safe but slow to respond.
    "smooth and drivable" Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge

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    "slow to respond" and "smooth and driveable" can be similar Click here to enlarge

  5. #30
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    People just seriously need to realize tuning on a platform will ALWAYS be a learning game. Fundamentals are the same of course. However, no one knows everything and there are no tuning "Gods" so to speak. Almost everyone changes their approaches as they go. Shiv just does it in the most disgusting manner known to man with very little sense for morale, ethics and respect. That is all. There will always be those choosing to ignore and still deal with people/businesses like that. People have also ignored MUCH larger and way more serious things throughout history. Didn't turn out so well for a while but then again, its easy to compete with Shiv. All you have to do really is just say the truth and do your best.
    Click here to enlarge

  6. #31
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@PTF Click here to enlarge
    People just seriously need to realize tuning on a platform will ALWAYS be a learning game. Fundamentals are the same of course. However, no one knows everything and there are no tuning "Gods" so to speak. Almost everyone changes their approaches as they go. Shiv just does it in the most disgusting manner known to man with very little sense for morale, ethics and respect. That is all. There will always be those choosing to ignore and still deal with people/businesses like that. People have also ignored MUCH larger and way more serious things throughout history. Didn't turn out so well for a while but then again, its easy to compete with Shiv. All you have to do really is just say the truth and do your best.


    yep. also, this post was directed at you i assume:


    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jippii ensio Click here to enlarge
    I think you just compared Cobb maps to the Shiv's OpenFlash maps. So the comparison makes some sense to you. Moreover, it makes sense to someone who does not want to pay extra for tuning, but wants to have a flashing device with off the shelf maps. So, the natural options would be Cobb vs OpenFlash both with the respective OTS maps.


    Do you think it makes more sense to compare Protune maps with Off the shelf maps? Protune maps are extra $. Moreover, they are custom tuned to the car. Its totally different and unfair. For me, it makes more sense to compare free of charge, off the shelf maps against each other. Also, comparing different custom tunes at extra charge against each other makes sense to me.


    I don't agree that having an access to same tables means that the numbers are the same. Now you have the access to the same tables, so your tune would have the same numbers as Shiv's or PTF's? I don't have any idea of your tuning capabilities, and you might not have either Click here to enlarge but considering the in practice infinite number of possible combinations you can enter the values in the tables, there is no chance that the values would be the same for all of you three tuners. There will be a difference in how the car is tuned by someone who has been tuning cars for his full professional life and with someone who decides last year, that he can tune cars in the evenings after work and get some additional income.


    Basically, having the same boost, ignition advance and fueling results in the same performance. But the only way to have exactly the same boost, ignition and fueling across the whole rev range in all the ambient circumstances is impossible by any other means than copying all the figures from all of the tables from one tune to another. That is called copying though, not tuning.

  7. #32
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    LOL yea there is a difference for sure. I do a better job and my work started out of frustration with Shiv..he inspires people..jippi ensio is just another shiv account..lol
    Click here to enlarge

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    oh for real? i thought i'd talked to jippi before and he wasn't shiv. could be wrong...

  9. #34
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    Heh just kidding, no idea
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    First to bash, NLS, and 2 step as uneeded then adopt as his own, first to bash flash tuning, then offers back end flash as his own. Now this. See any pattern emerging. Shiv is fun to drink with, but he just pretends to be the king of everything while really just waiting for other people to make progress and adopt it as his own.
    like he stole my 6466 idea? nah that didnt happen lol
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  11. #36
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JStang Click here to enlarge
    So people on e90post are drooling over the numbers made on stock hardware. The numbers are impressive but they are running 18 psi which to me seems very aggressive on stock hardware. Of course we would need to see logs to determine how the car is reacting to it but it seems to me that there is a reason that the other tunes are hitting much less boost with stock hardware.

    I have pointed this out on e90post but of course Shiv defended his tune and indirectly bashed Cobb for having a conservative OTS tune.

    Our OTS tune runs 18psi briefly right around 4000rpm (see below). Which means just for a second at a time when WOT on the road. Turbo is efficient at that rpm/airflow and intake temps are low. Much above and below that engine speed, its in the 13-14psi range. At 6700rpm, its down to 12psi Definitely seems to be a few who are making excuses for underperforming tunes. Perhaps their efforts should be on making their tune work better and not on suggesting a well performing tune is unsafe and should be brought down to their level for some perceived safety reason. I encourage those who believe this to drive both tunes. The biggest difference, IMHO, is not even power. But rather drivability and response to throttle (immediate and consistent vs delayed and irregular). There is a reason for this and if people can focus on things constructively instead of destructively, perhaps it will benefit them and the community as a whole
    My thought is to show off numbers and get buzz going as to how powerful it is and whatnot they will post an inflated graph pushing hardware so the peak figures look great in comparison. People will see X is higher than Y and not put any further thought into it. It's marketed to sheep, that's how you round them up.
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  12. #37
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    How come Shiv is never on this forum? I'm still pretty fresh to the n54, or even bimmer scene, but didn't take long to realize here and n54tech seem to easily be most informative and well managed...Oh, did I mention knowledgeable posters too?
    The hell you talking about? He practically lives here.

    Of course this place has the most knowledgeable posters. It starts with the administration I hear.
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  13. #38
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    My thought is to show off numbers and get buzz going as to how powerful it is and whatnot they will post an inflated graph pushing hardware so the peak figures look great in comparison. People will see X is higher than Y and not put any further thought into it. It's marketed to sheep, that's how you round them up.
    It's cheaper than COBB.
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  14. #39
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    It's cheaper than COBB.
    This is not news.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    This is not news.
    So is paying 300$ more for an equivalent product -not- being a sheep?
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

  16. #41
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    So is paying 300$ more for an equivalent product -not- being a sheep?
    The determination that it is equivalent is based on what? Marketing perception? You're comparing Cobb and their resources to.... what exactly?
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  17. #42
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    So is paying 300$ more for an equivalent product -not- being a sheep?
    It's not equivalent. Should be "close" soon, but nowhere near it right now. Just the fact that OF cant datalog is a huge deal breaker.
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  18. #43
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    Just the fact that OF cant datalog is a huge deal breaker.
    So people proclaiming equivalency without equivalency... I see.
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  19. #44
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    The determination that it is equivalent is based on what? Marketing perception? You're comparing Cobb and their resources to.... what exactly?
    Just playing devils advocate here guys. There's a reason COBB's involvement in nearly every platform brings maturation.

    I think you're jumping the gun here.
    You're looking at a new product, COBBs only competitor and it's cheaper.

    This will drive everyone involved to step up their game.
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  20. #45
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    Just playing devils advocate here guys. There's a reason COBB's involvement in nearly every platform brings maturation.

    I think you're jumping the gun here.
    You're looking at a new product, COBBs only competitor and it's cheaper.

    This will drive everyone involved to step up their game.
    absolutely agree

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    The hell you talking about? He practically lives here.

    Of course this place has the most knowledgeable posters. It starts with the administration I hear.
    Seriously? What's his screen name? Maybe I just don't recognize it. I would think he'd be chiming in when his name comes up. I personally don't know much about him, but it seems lots of other posters don't think too highly of him. Sorry OP for being OT.I just notice what seems to be every other big name in n54 performance on here but him.
    2009 335i coupe back to stock...for now

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    3 out of 3 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    So is paying 300$ more for an equivalent product -not- being a sheep?
    Cobb is obligated to provide support for their customers, Shiv isn't. His product is marketed as "open" and "community driven". Once the boat sails, I have a feeling his customers won't hear much from him anymore. Of course he is playing nice guy for now to get sales.

    At face value, yes, it's a cheaper cobb (assuming they make good on their promise for data logging). But you have to be a real schmuck to buy into the $#@! Shiv is shoveling. You can have your own reasons for buying it, but it is quite clear that he is marketing this toward fools, not tuners.
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    Just playing devils advocate here guys. There's a reason COBB's involvement in nearly every platform brings maturation.

    I think you're jumping the gun here.
    You're looking at a new product, COBBs only competitor and it's cheaper.

    This will drive everyone involved to step up their game.
    A product possibly possible due to Cobb in the first place. It's always easier to come later and cheaper.

    This is overrated personally and not open source. It be over before it even begun...
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  24. #49
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    Seriously? What's his screen name? Maybe I just don't recognize it. I would think he'd be chiming in when his name comes up. I personally don't know much about him, but it seems lots of other posters don't think too highly of him.
    It's Shiv@Vishnu and it was explained to you why he doesn't chime in frequently, he can't, not like he used to.

    I guess you missed you this?

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  25. #50
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tofu Click here to enlarge
    Cobb is obligated to provide support for their customers, Shiv isn't. His product is marketed as "open" and "community driven". Once the boat sails, I have a feeling his customers won't hear much from him anymore. Of course he is playing nice guy for now to get sales.

    At face value, yes, it's a cheaper cobb (assuming they make good on their promise for data logging). But you have to be a real schmuck to buy into the $#@! Shiv is shoveling. You can have your own reasons for buying it, but it is quite clear that he is marketing this toward fools, not tuners.
    Can't say it better.
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