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  1. #1
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    n54 potential and why hasn't anyone tapped it yet? most powerful n54s out there?

    Alright, so I'm pretty new to the n54 scene, had my car for a month now (09' e92, le mans blue or w/e they call it, 39k miles 6at) and finishing off FBO this weekend (thank you ETS!). I did a lot of research before purchasing, and am still researching turbo upgrade kits and what issues/weaknesses the car might have that I may need to upgrade (fuel delivery for example, clutch in 6MT I know, but I have AT so no worries there). Or is there? That is one of my questions.

    1) approximately what kind of power can one expect to push through the n54 motor and trans before needing any upgrades? I've heard 700? If so, how come only a handful pushing close to that seem to exist?

    2) what kind of motor upgrades would be needed to push say 800,900, or even a 1000 HP through this car? (Please include trans)

    3) I have only seen a couple people ever use nitrous on the n54, how come? Isn't this motor capable of holding extreme temperatures? Or at least higher than average running temps?

    4) what is the current most powerful n54? I believe Vargas holds record for most powerful stock motor at 723hp or something like that, what about non stock motor?

    5) other parts of concern even launching FBO with 400hp, what about drive/half shaft?

    Thanks in advance, I feel like n54 has huge potential, and many seem to say it does, but if most powerful n54 is only 700hp, I'm not that impressed, for about $9k, yeah impressed, but if thats all its got, then what? Click here to enlarge

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    It's Friday I'm off the clock.

    Welcome but if you do some reading in this section you'll have your answers.
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    No one knows how much power stock motor can take yet. Only a few people because it's not simple or cheap.

    Stating necessary motor upgrades would be all speculation at this point because no one has broken anything due to power. Your trans is going to be your limiting factor hands down. AT on this car just can't handle power over 450-500ft lbs with what's available at this point.

    No answer for you about nitrous.

    Vargas VTT3 and Shiv's 6466 on CaptainInsano's car are highest hp N54's so far. Doesn't seem like anyone is pushing a non stock motor.

    Launching high tq you will need axles and want an LSD.

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    Sticky, I'm trying to find some answers, searching on three forums I have joined, here, e90, and n54 tech. I was talking with a friend who owned a Whipple built 03 cobra, we were just talking how it's odd we haven't seen some higher powered n54 yet.

    My coupé, what are guys doing to the trans? Haven't seen anything listed that anyone running more power has done anything more than an LSD.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mycoupe Click here to enlarge
    Stating necessary motor upgrades would be all speculation at this point because no one has broken anything due to power.
    Um ya people have.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    Sticky, I'm trying to find some answers, searching on three forums I have joined, here, e90, and n54 tech. I was talking with a friend who owned a Whipple built 03 cobra, we were just talking how it's odd we haven't seen some higher powered n54 yet.

    My coupé, what are guys doing to the trans? Haven't seen anything listed that anyone running more power has done anything more than an LSD.
    Powerful N54 dicussion takes place here daily your questions are covered in incredible depth.

    That said, fueling is a major problem. As is the hardware which has made turbo upgrades somewhat difficult and of course the tuning although the software aspect continues to progress. By hardware I also mean the build of the motor to begin with as it was never designed with huge power in mind. People need to start building the motors and that topic is covered just a few threads down.
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    Right, that's really the end game, it seems no one is re building, I don't understand why not. I mean I've seen crazy money spent building it seems every other car but the n54, in which most don't even seem to be pushing the stock motor that hard. I get issues with peaking out upgraded turbos with cause of back pressure, but what about complete replacement? ( going to look for that thread now) thx again for input. Still not seeing all these threads you mention answering my questions, but then again, I'm not sure what I'm looking for has been answered yet...lol

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    Right, that's really the end game, it seems no one is re building, I don't understand why not.
    Because there hasn't been a reason to until recently. And the fuel isn't even there yet depending on who you want to believe.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    in which most don't even seem to be pushing the stock motor that hard. I get issues with peaking out upgraded turbos with cause of back pressure, but what about complete replacement? ( going to look for that thread now) thx again for input. Still not seeing all these threads you mention answering my questions, but then again, I'm not sure what I'm looking for has been answered yet...lol
    Well they're there read I guess. But I mean the N54 just cracked 700 whp recently and just recently there are more turbo options. It's going to progress it just takes time. It's not like selecting a turbo upgrade in Gran Turismo. Really.
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    4 out of 4 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Hold up a quick second? Did this person just make a post asking some pretty basic questions and at the end state. That a bone stock 3.0 I6 motor with stock fuel lines, stock injectors, stock intake manifold, stock head, stock cams, etc etc etc making 725 WHP is not impressive. The ease at which power comes these days honestly breeds just this type of person. They have no idea what it actually takes to make 700 WHP and just see numbers. Show me more then one or possibly two I6 motors under 3.5 liters that can make anything close to that in STOCK form and you have your answer if its impressive or not.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    but I have AT so no worries there). Or is there? That is one of my questions.
    well yes, there is your first road block

    .. 500tq~ odd and you'll have a dead transmission, and there's no current proven reliable upgrade for it.
    boop

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Hold up a quick second? Did this person just make a post asking some pretty basic questions and at the end state. That a bone stock 3.0 I6 motor with stock fuel lines, stock injectors, stock intake manifold, stock head, stock cams, etc etc etc making 725 WHP is not impressive. The ease at which power comes these days honestly breeds just this type of person. They have no idea what it actually takes to make 700 WHP and just see numbers. Show me more then one or possibly two I6 motors under 3.5 liters that can make anything close to that in STOCK form and you have your answer if its impressive or not.
    1jz 2jz

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    Sticky, I'm trying to find some answers, searching on three forums I have joined, here, e90, and n54 tech. I was talking with a friend who owned a Whipple built 03 cobra, we were just talking how it's odd we haven't seen some higher powered n54 yet.

    My coupé, what are guys doing to the trans? Haven't seen anything listed that anyone running more power has done anything more than an LSD.
    wheel hop at high power/torque means you need stronger halfshaft/driveshaft so they don't snap (has happened to a good number of people)

    i know what you mean though, the fact they can hit 500whp odd with barely any effort/expense

    but that's it, 500whp is enough for 99% of owners, even TOO much.

    on other platforms that struggle to hit it so easily, it breeds more of a need to create something new.. and when you're already creating something new why not make it as good/big/powerful as you can?

    also due to the fact they're only JUST becoming really cheap to get in the hands of people who want to modify without a big capital (like meee haha)

    the only reason to upgrade the turbos/fuel system, is to hit 700whp, 800,900 etc.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    Right, that's really the end game, it seems no one is re building, I don't understand why not. I mean I've seen crazy money spent building it seems every other car but the n54, in which most don't even seem to be pushing the stock motor that hard. I get issues with peaking out upgraded turbos with cause of back pressure, but what about complete replacement? ( going to look for that thread now) thx again for input. Still not seeing all these threads you mention answering my questions, but then again, I'm not sure what I'm looking for has been answered yet...lol
    there is a LOT of built bottom ends.. i mean a LOT... there's a shop here that has 3 for their race cars (stock compression, carillo rods, CP pistons) all done... but there's not many people doing built bottom ends for POWER... and there's even less with a built head (only dzenno that i know of with larger exhaust valves... no one with both intake and exhaust, let alone keepers/guides/springs which really is something that will probably become available within the next 6-12 months. which i'm also trying to help along with my limited resources)
    boop

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
    1jz 2jz
    i think the T6 can too?

    really the jz motors are the same thing

    also a few of the RB's can hit those power levels.

    there's almost none in the year 2000~+ that can do it though sadly.
    boop

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
    i think the T6 can too?

    really the jz motors are the same thing

    also a few of the RB's can hit those power levels.

    there's almost none in the year 2000~+ that can do it though sadly.
    Yeah those are the ones that came off the top of my head as I was reading, lol.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Hold up a quick second? Did this person just make a post asking some pretty basic questions and at the end state. That a bone stock 3.0 I6 motor with stock fuel lines, stock injectors, stock intake manifold, stock head, stock cams, etc etc etc making 725 WHP is not impressive. The ease at which power comes these days honestly breeds just this type of person. They have no idea what it actually takes to make 700 WHP and just see numbers. Show me more then one or possibly two I6 motors under 3.5 liters that can make anything close to that in STOCK form and you have your answer if its impressive or not.
    It's very impressive, didn't say it wasn't for STOCK (BTW Vargas has caught my eye and the results actually impressed me enough to make my final decision to go with a 335i.) Only thing I said isn't impressive is if that's where this car is tapping out. And yes e90company the jz motors are exactly what I had in mind. I am trying to figure out what it would take to go to the next level. I guess what I'm finding is that the answer just isn't there yet. And don't give "this type of person" and ease of power yadda yadda yadda, and not sure what you mean by ease of power these days, not too many cars out there can do what the n54 can with limited investment. Let's also keep in mind, this is a very expensive motor in a not so cheap car, so excuse me if I expect the stock parts to handle more than your average grocery getter. Did you even read my ENTIRE post or just highlight not impressive and stop there. What you have done is absolutely amazing, no one is saying it's not, my question is is it reliable at those power levels? What needs to be done to take it further? Don't be so defensive man, seriously I'll say it again for you, your company's work and statement about choosing the n54 to replant your Vargas name in performance helped me choose the car, to know I'd be entering a group and car culture with people like you enthused, so I apologize if I insult you by asking questions I don't feel have been answered clearly or specifically from my searches.

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    OP, if this was a standard 90s ECU and fuel system somebody would have made big power a long time ago. It can be tricky working around the new technology, though. The ECU really wants to work with twin turbos and there's not a lot of room in there...

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
    1jz 2jz
    S54...
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    S54...
    Yes. But I was trying to keep it non-BMW for an example lol.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
    1jz 2jz
    Who there friend ya might need to slow down...700+whp in stock form? sure about that? Pretty sure you would need at least cams and port job...
    Last edited by Ak335i; 06-29-2013 at 07:17 PM.
    - Proven Power Tampa built 6466 ST -
    - N54 6AT WR 711whp 637wtq-
    -N54 WR 1/4mile trap: 133.57mph- -

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Ak335i Click here to enlarge
    700+whp in stock form? sure about that? Pretty sure you would need at least cams and port job...
    Yes sir. I've seen 1000+ on a completely stock motor never opened. Let me find the thread....

    http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/136499-st...47-80-e85.html

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90Company Click here to enlarge
    Yes sir. I've seen 1000+ on a completely stock motor never opened. Let me find the thread....

    http://www.gtr.co.uk/forum/136499-st...47-80-e85.html
    Fair enough, but that's rare. Most of them need to be opened up once you are around the 600+ Whp range at least for cams at a minimum
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi Click here to enlarge
    1) approximately what kind of power can one expect to push through the n54 motor and trans before needing any upgrades? I've heard 700? If so, how come only a handful pushing close to that seem to exist?
    Well the 725 WHP Vargas Stage 3 was done on a 6MT car. On the 6ATs, people have experienced trans slip on stock turbos with some aggressive driving while running FBO tunes with Meth/E85. There currently is no proven 6AT upgrade, so if you plan going big HP (550 WHP+), be prepared to sink lots of money into 6AT replacements/rebuilds.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi
    2) what kind of motor upgrades would be needed to push say 800,900, or even a 1000 HP through this car? (Please include trans)
    I don't believe anyone has done a built N54 motor yet because there still hasn't been a need. But after seeing the Vargas Stage 3 car hit 725 WHP on a completely stock motor, 800+ wouldn't be out of reach with upgraded internals.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi
    3) I have only seen a couple people ever use nitrous on the n54, how come? Isn't this motor capable of holding extreme temperatures? Or at least higher than average running temps?
    Personal preference. There are def people who run nitrous on the N54, but it's not remotely as common (or easy/inexpensive) as a Meth setup.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi
    4) what is the current most powerful n54? I believe Vargas holds record for most powerful stock motor at 723hp or something like that, what about non stock motor?
    The most powerful known & confirmed N54 is the Vargas Stage 3 car with 725 WHP.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mjmarovi
    5) other parts of concern even launching FBO with 400hp, what about drive/half shaft?
    Yes, if you're FBO & considering more power you should immediately look at an LSD upgrade before adding more power. DSS (Drive Shaft Shop) builds aftermarket driveshafts & axles.
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  23. #23
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    I don't believe anyone has done a built N54 motor yet because there still hasn't been a need.
    Based on what?
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    i think when the N54 reach its warranty deadline there will be some crazy mod.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Based on what?
    I'm strictly focusing on built motors for power; but because there aren't any customer cars there yet or any forum known built N54s. Also the Vargas Stage 3 kit that powered the most powerful N54 still hasn't been released to the public. Chances are Shiv's car will probably be the 1st to have a build motor for their twin scroll setup.

    Bottom line, the N54 still hasn'thit the limitations of the stock motor components or stock compression, so why (besides peace of mind) change anything?
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