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  1. #1
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    Question ESS625 Motor failure?

    Should be interesting to see final diagnosis. Owner is reporting excessive valvetrain noise prior to it letting go.

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    Very interesting. Sometimes I think it would have been better to get a S/C M3 for the racetrack, but with the amount of S65 failures I'm glad I sticked to the N54.
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    Read the rest of the thread. This dumbass not only didn't run 93 octane as stressed by Biglare (seller) and ESS, but ran 89 at times!!! Sounds like 91 was his norm with occasional 89. I feel bad that it happened to him but if you are that dumb should you be even driving these kind of cars? This may very well be the stupidest thing I have heard in the FI M3 community.

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    Nothing ESS-related, 100% Driver Error / $#@! Up Click here to enlarge Perfect example of someone that shouldn't be allowed to own a modded car because they even follow a simple direction like running the appropriate octane (after it had been stressed by the previous owner & the vendor).
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Nothing ESS-related, 100% Driver Error / $#@! Up Click here to enlarge Perfect example of someone that shouldn't be allowed to own a modded car because they even follow a simple direction like running the appropriate octane (after it had been stressed by the previous owner & the vendor).
    Wow. I don't even know what to say. Way to ruin a well sorted out car. I just realized this was Biglare's old sedan. I drooled over that E90.

    I would wager that many of this motor failures are predominantly user error related.

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    Yea, from reading the thread & referencing ESS's website, the ESS VT2-625 can receive two separate tunes:
    1. A 91 Octane Tune -- 6.5psi (and what I imagine, lowered timing, slightly richer AFR to protect the internals)
    2. A 93 Octane Tune - 7.0psi (slightly more aggressive timing that is still safe with the higher octane)


    It sounds like BigLare's car was setup on the 93 tune, which was stressed to the new owner, who then went & ran the car (driven aggressively) on 91 and sometimes 89 (which I don't even put in my mom's stock X3). So is it really a surprise that after ~2 weeks of ownership, the engine $#@! the bed? If anything, it illustrates the owners lack of understanding (and appreciation) of the S65 for running the motor on less than the top pump gas available. IF he was responsible, he could've easily asked ESS for the 91 octane tune to make sure the car ran happy.
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    Yeah man Im in shock. This idiot is talking about going for a stroker or supercharged v10 transplant next LMAO. He should probably stick to cars that can run on piss.

    It was a beautiful car - I actually had an offer on it as it was up for sale around the same time the one I bought was. He was asking a little too much and go figure the guy that ended up buying it paid less than my offer. Maybe e buyer ran out of money and couldn't afford premium fuel? Click here to enlarge

    I'm very happy it didn't work out though...I definitely prefer the coupe. His was so nicely done though that it was the only sedan that made me want to buy it.
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    intersting thing they are arguing about, is the sounds the car makes. with the blower strapped on, my car sounded like it was on its last breathe, lots of odd ticks and tones. the wife even asked me if its supposed to sound like that... I think its just side effect of having the blower on it. Car sound healthy as ever now N/A though, so im not too worried about it

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    2 out of 2 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by NikB316 Click here to enlarge
    Yeah man Im in shock. This idiot is talking about going for a stroker or supercharged v10 transplant next LMAO. He should probably stick to cars that can run on piss.
    I feel bad for whatever motor he inevitably destroys next Click here to enlarge Especially if it's another S65 or a S85
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  10. #10
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by NikB316 Click here to enlarge
    supercharged v10 transplant next
    That's pointless.

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    This isn't the first motor failure and won't be the last but there are several reasons for motor failures. Let me just put it this way, if it was a Gintani car everyone would be claiming a poor tune that couldn't adjust to fuel qualities, too much boost, or a poor install.

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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    BTW he didn't run 89 he said he needed some gas to make it to another gas station so he used 89 as that is all they had.

    And in Cali he ran 91 as that is what we have. The guy who sold him the car claimed he was setup for 91 for when he was posting graphs but now all of a sudden the car is tuned for 93 when things go wrong?

    The guy isn't stupid like you guys are making him out to be. Additionally, he says it was making noise when he already bought it. There have been other ESS cars making noises that were sold before things went boom...

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    Somebody get this guy on here and let's get the truth.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Somebody get this guy on here and let's get the truth.
    See, now that's what I like about this forum.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    BTW he didn't run 89 he said he needed some gas to make it to another gas station so he used 89 as that is all they had.

    And in Cali he ran 91 as that is what we have. The guy who sold him the car claimed he was setup for 91 for when he was posting graphs but now all of a sudden the car is tuned for 93 when things go wrong?

    The guy isn't stupid like you guys are making him out to be. Additionally, he says it was making noise when he already bought it. There have been other ESS cars making noises that were sold before things went boom...
    Good post.
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  16. #16
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    BTW he didn't run 89 he said he needed some gas to make it to another gas station so he used 89 as that is all they had.

    And in Cali he ran 91 as that is what we have. The guy who sold him the car claimed he was setup for 91 for when he was posting graphs but now all of a sudden the car is tuned for 93 when things go wrong?

    The guy isn't stupid like you guys are making him out to be. Additionally, he says it was making noise when he already bought it. There have been other ESS cars making noises that were sold before things went boom...


    This guy knew not to run 91, only 93. Roman & Biglare both told him this on numerous occasions. I contacted Biglare when his car was for sale and he was very open and clear about only running 93. Maybe his car was previously running 91 on a different tune?

    Running a couple gallons of 89 especially if it is they are the only few gallons in your car is very stupid in my book. Get the car towed to a different station.

    His more recent post says that the car wasn't making that noise when he bought it but a bit later.

    Could there have been an issue before he bought the car? Sure. Is he stupid for knowingly putting 91 in a car built for 93? Yep.

    I don't think ESS can be blamed for this...
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  17. #17
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by NikB316 Click here to enlarge
    This guy knew not to run 91, only 93. Roman & Biglare both told him this on numerous occasions. I contacted Biglare when his car was for sale and he was very open and clear about only running 93. Maybe his car was previously running 91 on a different tune?

    Running a couple gallons of 89 especially if it is they are the only few gallons in your car is very stupid in my book. Get the car towed to a different station.

    His more recent post says that the car wasn't making that noise when he bought it but a bit later.

    Could there have been an issue before he bought the car? Sure. Is he stupid for knowingly putting 91 in a car built for 93? Yep.

    I don't think ESS can be blamed for this...
    uhhh he can run 89 all day long if he keeps it out of boost right? If he drove under 3k to the next gas station he should of been fine.

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    Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't there some boost being made basically right away? From my understanding with a centrifugal supercharger the boost is just linear throughout? I am relatively new to this so I could be wrong but that is my interpretation of the graph below which is a dyno of my car. All the e92 m3 blowers work the same from my knowledge.
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  19. #19
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    Not quite, if you baby the car, you won't build boost at least not much, and by that I mean less than 2psi. Not that its still all good, but it shouldn't blow the motor from a few miles like that.
    I do find biglares comments concerning though, this whole time he has had us want to believe its basic kit on pumpgas, but now its 93 octane only, which isnt available, then ess says hes tuned only for and only runs racefuel... Interesting developments..

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    Thanks for the insight LM. So boost is made but isn't very harmful at such low levels. I only know what Biglare told me about the car and I'm not familiar with any of his older posts. He did not advertise the car as being 93 octane only when he listed it - that I am quite sure of. There may be something fishy but running regardless to what he said about his dynos being on 91, if he specifically told the buyer to use 93 one can really only blame the buyer. I was looking through my old messages (thank you iphone for being able to search through texts) and after I bought my car I was talking to someone locally about how I almost bought BigLare's car. He did say good thing you didn't as the car has only been running race fuel. I don't want to mention names obviously but this individual has a totally impartial position. I don't know exactly what he was hinting at as at the time I had assumed he meant that the car was driven quite hard hence the race fuel. Lets say his car was tuned for something higher than 93 and ran that consistently. Would switching the tune to 93 and running 93 after potentially cause a problem?
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  21. #21
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by NikB316 Click here to enlarge
    Lets say his car was tuned for something higher than 93 and ran that consistently. Would switching the tune to 93 and running 93 after potentially cause a problem?
    It shouldn't if the 93 tune was done correctly.

    Just what I have read in this thread makes me think something fishy is going on with all the different versions of the same story...

    I do kind of blame the owner for not doing more research and possibly contacting the company or learning how to verify what tune was uploaded. But then again if the person is well known and you trust them why believe they are saying anything but the truth.

    Maybe this is stupid but shouldn't the knock sensor have saved the engine?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Torgus Click here to enlarge
    Maybe this is stupid but shouldn't the knock sensor have saved the engine?
    Yes & No. S65 (and the knock sensors) didn't come FI'd from BMW (simple comparison, N54 came turbo'd, that's why the DME can protect the motor from a $#@! tune & bad gas), so the knock sensors were never designed to work with anything beyond the motor itself. The S/C kit is obviously going to make the motor more prone to knock (serious performance increase on a stock motor), and low octane is only going to further increase the potential for knock/detonation.

    For all we know, the owner picked up the car, ran $#@! gas & ripped on the car while the dash was lighting up like a Christmas tree. BUT at the same time, the car couldn't been setup on a much more aggressive setup (strictly Race Gas tune + pulley combo), and running the car on any pump gas (even 93) would've eventually killed the motor.
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  23. #23
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by NikB316 Click here to enlarge
    This guy knew not to run 91, only 93. Roman & Biglare both told him this on numerous occasions. I contacted Biglare when his car was for sale and he was very open and clear about only running 93. Maybe his car was previously running 91 on a different tune?

    Running a couple gallons of 89 especially if it is they are the only few gallons in your car is very stupid in my book. Get the car towed to a different station.

    His more recent post says that the car wasn't making that noise when he bought it but a bit later.

    Could there have been an issue before he bought the car? Sure. Is he stupid for knowingly putting 91 in a car built for 93? Yep.

    I don't think ESS can be blamed for this...
    I'm not blaming anyone things happen. People are blaming this guy for it simply to shift blame from possibly going toward ESS. Everyone has blown motors, it happens.

    ESS has been known to ship the wrong pulleys and files... maybe they should pay more attention to what their customers are doing to spare them any problems and so they don't have to go into damage control mode as well?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Torgus Click here to enlarge
    uhhh he can run 89 all day long if he keeps it out of boost right? If he drove under 3k to the next gas station he should of been fine.
    Ya exactly not like he's driving it like he stole it just wants to get to a gas station. Max boost is made at redline so what's the problem?

  25. #25
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    I do find biglares comments concerning though, this whole time he has had us want to believe its basic kit on pumpgas, but now its 93 octane only, which isnt available, then ess says hes tuned only for and only runs racefuel... Interesting developments..
    Exactly. Story now changes.

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