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  1. #401
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DallasBoosted Click here to enlarge
    Right but I get 93-94 octane (and E85) here so I'm wondering how different it would look with less boost and more timing. Less torque falloff on the high end, less boost so it would plateau earlier, etc.

    Thanks Click here to enlarge
    The beauty of larger lungs is you can target whatever shape of the curve you want with enough octane in the tank. PEAK power/torque for the moment are limited by the HPFP past a certain point without supplementing with meth. "Hopefully" this will be history soon too and the N54 platfrom will be able to not depend on meth delivered through the charge piping for high hp fueling soon as much as it does today. Fingers crossed..

    If I were to use meth to fuel 700whp today it wouldn't be the typical nozzles in the charge pipe setup. It'd most likely be direct port with nozzles on the intake manifold runners with a distribution block in front, new Aquamist checkvalved nozzles and PWM.
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by nafoo Click here to enlarge
    My stock turbos kick in hard at around 3100 rpm.
    Yeah not sure if its due to my 7" ETS intercooler causing more lag or if I have a sticking wastegate actuater. Either way full boost around 4k is fine by me.

  3. #403
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    DZ, you know you're going to get the 67R, who are you kidding. Get to work, you have some records to break Click here to enlarge

  4. #404
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    If I were to use meth to fuel 700whp today it wouldn't be the typical nozzles in the charge pipe setup. It'd most likely be direct port with nozzles on the intake manifold runners with a distribution block in front, new Aquamist checkvalved nozzles and PWM.
    totally agree with this!
    JB4 G5, 455 LPFP, HFS-4 meth kit, BMS OCC, VM 6466 ST, RB valve, BMS DCI, 3" AR Dps, Custom OC W/ SS lines, ER FMIC, ER CP W/HKS BOV, M3 control arms, M3 guide rods, M3 upper links, M3 front & rear sway-bars, HPA rear toe arms, Wavetrac LSD, HPF Gen 2 exhaust DEFIV kit, KW clubsport, Delrin solid subframe bushings, stoptech rotors, Rogue Tranny Mounts, 1M bumper, M3 CF hood, MORR VS8.2 rims 245/295

  5. #405
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    Pulled the trigger and switched from stage 2's to stage 3's!!! Going for the gt28rs setup ,unless I change my mind. I'm pretty sure my 6at wouldn't want anymore power than those on pump. But they still leave me with headroom after a legit tranny upgrade comes along.
    E92 FBO Cobb stage 2+

  6. #406
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Animal29 Click here to enlarge
    Pulled the trigger and switched from stage 2's to stage 3's!!!
    Better fix that sig then
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

  7. #407
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bmw335iguy Click here to enlarge
    Yeah not sure if its due to my 7" ETS intercooler causing more lag or if I have a sticking wastegate actuater. Either way full boost around 4k is fine by me.
    Even before you get to full boost, you're already flowing more than the stockers could anyway Click here to enlarge

  8. #408
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    What's the estimated install time difference between this and replacement turbos? How much permenant modification to the car does it require?
    2015 - Cayman GTS - Stock
    2011 - 335is e92 - Cobb PTF E40/Rob Beck/AR/Helix (458 rwtq and 479 rwhp) - Retired
    2007 - 911 Turbo - EP1/AMS (617 awtq and 500 awhp) - Retired
    2008 - 335i e92 - Cobb/AR/Helix/OSS (384 rwtq and 356 rwhp) - Retired
    2003 and 2005 330i/ci zhp - Stock - Retired

  9. #409
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    when's the next dyno session?
    BSM 340xi M-Sport
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    @dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks:
    Did you use an EGT Sensor?
    What temps did it run?
    BMW 335i xDrive MT
    COBB Stage2+|Wagner FMIC|CPe-Downpipes|BMW Performance Exhaust

  11. #411
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jpsimon Click here to enlarge
    when's the next dyno session?
    when ever you want. let us know Click here to enlarge
    - Proven Power Tampa built 6466 ST -
    - N54 6AT WR 711whp 637wtq-
    -N54 WR 1/4mile trap: 133.57mph- -

  12. #412
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jpsimon Click here to enlarge
    when's the next dyno session?
    I don't think there are gonna be any more tune revisions/updates until Dzenno & Jake fly out (IIRC they're both going) to tune the car in person. Only so much you can do with eTuning
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

  13. #413
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Animal29 Click here to enlarge
    Pulled the trigger and switched from stage 2's to stage 3's!!! Going for the gt28rs setup ,unless I change my mind. I'm pretty sure my 6at wouldn't want anymore power than those on pump. But they still leave me with headroom after a legit tranny upgrade comes along.
    Good decision.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lorddrinkalot Click here to enlarge
    @dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks :
    Did you use an EGT Sensor?
    What temps did it run?
    No, we don't have one hooked up "yet". I'd love to monitor EGTs as well but so far we've only gone with what we can get through the AP. On the next round of tuning we may have some additional/external sensors put in, we'll see.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    I don't think there are gonna be any more tune revisions/updates until Dzenno & Jake fly out (IIRC they're both going) to tune the car in person. Only so much you can do with eTuning
    At the moment it looks like its just Jake going. I've got some contract things to sort out in my regular day job/career end of this month beginning of next.

    In terms of eTuning, it isn't limiting us in any way whatsoever. We are going to basically meet Tony and possibly some people from Cobb. We had an agreement with Tony while the kit was being produced that we'd come down and we're simply holding to our promise. Another 2-3 hours on the dyno and we'd most likely have an ACN91 tune at a state where we'd say its done for what the current HPFP can provide.
    Click here to enlarge

  14. #414
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    In terms of eTuning, it isn't limiting us in any way whatsoever
    eTuning was the wrong word, street tuning is what I meant (since you'll never be able to recreate the conditions experienced on a dyno on the street). Obviously the whole tuning process goes a lot faster if the tuner is there in person & the cars on a dyno, but it's awesome that the current tune is nearly done & just needs a final "polishing"
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

  15. #415
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mithiral67 Click here to enlarge
    What's the estimated install time difference between this and replacement turbos? How much permenant modification to the car does it require?
    Should bolt on similarly unless there are some custom bits outside of standard install. You can add an hour to the expected time for stock turbos simply due to familiarity issues.

  16. #416
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    eTuning was the wrong word, street tuning is what I meant (since you'll never be able to recreate the conditions experienced on a dyno on the street). Obviously the whole tuning process goes a lot faster if the tuner is there in person & the cars on a dyno, but it's awesome that the current tune is nearly done & just needs a final "polishing"
    Street tuning on this setup got us very far tbh Given this is such a different setup hardware wise (yet so similar control systems wise) dyno tuning is also a must to create a solid "base" tune. Once you've got a good base (sort of like an OTS map) street tuning works really well again.

    In terms of the overall tuning process/delays given that changes need to be reflashed to the car (about a min and car needs to be restarted) the reduction in time (speed up in tuning) would basically involve Tony not having to download a new map from the dropbox and us just flashing it directly on the car from ATP Click here to enlarge honestly, that is simply it

    However, if there are some odd "drivability" issues that simply can't be visualized through logs (e.g. maybe a 6AT transmission complaining like it was pre-Alpina TCU flashes) then being there in person may/may not help solve them. At the moment we are happy to not have such problems and according to Tony the car drives smooth both part throttle and WOT. We'll see how/if any of that changes once a 6AT car is ready to be tuned. More electronics, more fuss Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge

  17. #417
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Street tuning on this setup got us very far tbh Given this is such a different setup hardware wise (yet so similar control systems wise) dyno tuning is also a must to create a solid "base" tune. Once you've got a good base (sort of like an OTS map) street tuning works really well again.
    Hey Dzenno, sorry if this has been asked but I don't recall seeing any detail on it. What did you end up using for boost control? I saw boost was set to 24-25psi. Wasn't there talk of a ceiling in the rom? Or was that overcome by cobb?

  18. #418
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 2000max Click here to enlarge
    Hey Dzenno, sorry if this has been asked but I don't recall seeing any detail on it. What did you end up using for boost control? I saw boost was set to 24-25psi. Wasn't there talk of a ceiling in the rom? Or was that overcome by cobb?
    Boost control is done entirely through the DME at the moment. There is still a ceiling at 22.5psi but we're getting around it with some "cheating". Cobb is working raising the actual boost limit and hopefully we'll have the ability to use that soon as well.
    Click here to enlarge

  19. #419
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Street tuning on this setup got us very far tbh Given this is such a different setup hardware wise (yet so similar control systems wise) dyno tuning is also a must to create a solid "base" tune. Once you've got a good base (sort of like an OTS map) street tuning works really well again.

    In terms of the overall tuning process/delays given that changes need to be reflashed to the car (about a min and car needs to be restarted) the reduction in time (speed up in tuning) would basically involve Tony not having to download a new map from the dropbox and us just flashing it directly on the car from ATP Click here to enlarge honestly, that is simply it

    However, if there are some odd "drivability" issues that simply can't be visualized through logs (e.g. maybe a 6AT transmission complaining like it was pre-Alpina TCU flashes) then being there in person may/may not help solve them. At the moment we are happy to not have such problems and according to Tony the car drives smooth both part throttle and WOT. We'll see how/if any of that changes once a 6AT car is ready to be tuned. More electronics, more fuss Click here to enlarge
    Dzenno just a heads up but you all(or Jake at least) will be tuning my 6AT when I get my stage 3's. I am the winner of the free etune you guys gave away on Facebook a few months ago but Jake said it was fine to hold off till my stage 2's but now I'm going stage 3's lol.i I understand these stage 3's will require more work so I will gladly pay a difference if tuning these is more than the value of the tune I had won. Thanks in advance to you and Jake
    E92 FBO Cobb stage 2+

  20. #420
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Animal29 Click here to enlarge
    Dzenno just a heads up but you all(or Jake at least) will be tuning my 6AT when I get my stage 3's. I am the winner of the free etune you guys gave away on Facebook a few months ago but Jake said it was fine to hold off till my stage 2's but now I'm going stage 3's lol.i I understand these stage 3's will require more work so I will gladly pay a difference if tuning these is more than the value of the tune I had won. Thanks in advance to you and Jake
    Click here to enlarge LOL no worries, we'll take care of you...win is a win
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge LOL no worries, we'll take care of you...win is a win
    Awesome thanks!!
    E92 FBO Cobb stage 2+

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    4 out of 9 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No

    This post by Sikh335 is hidden due to excessive negative ratings. Click expand to view the post.



  23. #423
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sikh335 Click here to enlarge
    Animal I hope you have money saved up for a Trans Upgrade. You will need it with Stage 3 or any kit with Power over 600whp, the Alpina Flash will only get you so far. My Trans is on a truck headed from NJ to CA, should be exactly what the 6AT needs.
    You are also running a piggyback that doesnt report actual load and tq targets to the DME which affects the control of the transmission as the trans will only expect to see a certain amount of power/tq and you are seeing far more. Whether or not other people will say that isn't an issue - plain and simple it is. While running a flash tune so that the DME sees EVERYTHING (and using a flash and piggyback does not allow this) the transmission will simply not react as well. I can not say at all how an auto will hold up with even just a flash because we haven't had experience with an Auto pushing 600 yet. I can however say that if it is strong enough to hold - a flash tune ONLY will be able to do a better job because the DME and TCU will know how much power to expect.

    The way I explain the situation is as follows. If you have a tug of war contest and you are going 1v1 and you see a 500lb guy on teh other end of the rope you are going to grip alot tighter and prepare to hold more than if the competitor on the other end was an 8 year old girl. When using a piggy back and flash (stacked) the car is being told its happy at lower load/tq targets than it is actually seeing. Therefor the car thinks its an 8 year old girl on the other end of the rope when its actually a 500lb man and well - your losing that fight.

    If you think about it - we are making great power on 91 octane with the Cobb AP and PTF Tune running on Tony Vargas' twin turbo kit. Boost control is on point, the car is smooth, powerful and consistant, and we aren't using a piggyback to control a thing. If you take a piggyback and try to do the same thing without the use of a flash it simply won't work. The piggyback needs the flash for proper fueling and other tuning areas to control the car reliably/safely and then allow the piggyback to do a few things on top. Why use a piggyback and a flash when its proven the flash can do it alone (whereas the piggyback requires the flash in addition...seems like an easy answer to me).

    Now there are the bells and whistles that always get discussed like meth integration and gauges on your dash etc. The aquamist HFS-4 is a great setup and has a GREAT failsafe. I simply use my AP as my gauge (but I also have some others). You can monitor all data through your AP since no signals are modified or recreated by a piggyback. In no way am I saying any one elses tuning solutions don't work. They clearly work. I just take the most elegant, functional, and efficient solution and support it. And well I could go on but this is an old debated topic and not the point of the thread. GOING FAST IS Click here to enlarge Got off on a tangent and had a lot more to say on it but i'll keep that private if you ever want to discuss it sometime.

  24. #424
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jhershorin Click here to enlarge
    You are also running a piggyback that doesnt report actual load and tq targets to the DME which affects the control of the transmission as the trans will only expect to see a certain amount of power/tq and you are seeing far more.
    Right on. This is a great observation.

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    0 out of 3 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Jake I'm not quite sure where I started debating Piggy VS Flash. I would rather leave that debate for you and the piggy tuners. I'm stating from experience that the automatic transmission mechanically can not reliably handle 600whp plus and will need to be rebuilt. The theory provided above is great if both ends of the string are able to handle the load that they can see coming.

    Many of the forums members were telling Vishnu the same thing we now know that the Trans won't hold and now we have data to show It mechanically is not built for it. This is not a software fix its hardware and not a debate over tuning methodology.

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