Close

Page 11 of 24 FirstFirst ... 91011121321 ... LastLast
Results 251 to 275 of 589
  1. #251
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Toronto, Canada
    Posts
    6,684
    Rep Points
    3,343.8
    Mentioned
    226 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    34


    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    Weird how that's exactly the opposite of what you was arguing a couple a couple weeks ago when I said 93 + meth was what I was interested in seeing. Ohh and the DME pulls timing in response to CATs without it being corrections, you can easily lose several degrees of timing advance in response to CATs and not have a single correction. That's how the DME can compensate for a fairly aggressive tune and it still be safe in hot weather.
    This.

    To clarify though, we made 582whp once meth was turned on for the same map that made 572whp on just 91 octane. The 602whp pull where Tony lifted had a new map with just 2deg extra timing on top of 91 and smoothing changes to boost control to lift the bump you saw at 4500-5k rpm.

    Its just work in progress and lots more to follow. Don't be too hard on us for showing you preliminary results guys. Its easy not to show anything until its all perfect but that'd mean no fun on the forums Click here to enlarge I know how much I anticipate seeing results out there but let's try not to nitpick just yet. Once we say that's all we can do then we can all nitpick heh
    Click here to enlarge

  2. #252
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    937
    Rep Points
    562.7
    Mentioned
    52 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    6


    0 out of 2 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Given you ever so sneakly wrote PMs directly to Tony about me never being able to do this I doubt I'd like to provide you with data on request like this anymore. To do that without even giving the courtesy and waiting for some preliminary results is/was very low.

    Going forward, I'm sorry, but you'll just have to sign a cheque for one of these and get your own data for discussion purposes. I won't entertain your keyboard battles/curiosity further. Hope you understand.
    HA, sneaky... I wrote one PM cause he asked me to... giving my thoughts on setup with NO mention of PTF not being able to do it. I try helping where I can.

  3. #253
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    The world...
    Posts
    1,331
    Rep Points
    1,202.2
    Mentioned
    8 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    13


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    This.

    To clarify though, we made 582whp once meth was turned on for the same map that made 572whp on just 91 octane. The 602whp pull where Tony lifted had a new map with just 2deg extra timing on top of 91 and smoothing changes to boost control to lift the bump you saw at 4500-5k rpm.

    Its just work in progress and lots more to follow. Don't be too hard on us for showing you preliminary results guys. Its easy not to show anything until its all perfect but that'd mean no fun on the forums Click here to enlarge I know how much I anticipate seeing results out there but let's try not to nitpick just yet. Once we say that's all we can do then we can all nitpick heh
    how large are the balls in your entire crew? large enough to turn things up to 700 whp on stock internals? just curious at what point you won't feel safe to go any further?
    2007 335i (100% stock with mods)

    N54 is not a German 2JZ lol

  4. #254
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Toronto, Canada
    Posts
    6,684
    Rep Points
    3,343.8
    Mentioned
    226 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    34


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    HA, sneaky... I wrote one PM cause he asked me to... giving my thoughts on setup with NO mention of PTF not being able to do it. I try helping where I can.
    I have the PM..water under the bridge for me but that was not cool...anyways, its a car forum, let's stay on topic
    Click here to enlarge

  5. #255
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Toronto, Canada
    Posts
    6,684
    Rep Points
    3,343.8
    Mentioned
    226 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    34


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    how large are the balls in your entire crew? large enough to turn things up to 700 whp on stock internals? just curious at what point you won't feel safe to go any further?
    LOL great question..on someone else's car (such as in this case) as long as the car isn't knocking and there's enough fuel to support the power if the owner is willing to push the limits and sign liability waivers we're game...on my own car limits are always pushed but again provided knock is in check and fuel is there...pushing past previously well known limits on any hardware is exploring the unexplored and everyone should be understand the risks
    Click here to enlarge

  6. #256
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Roanoke VA
    Posts
    1,632
    Rep Points
    2,248.3
    Mentioned
    54 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    23


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    we start here and move on... no need to jump the ship a'la another tuner...
    What?
    Click here to enlarge
    MOTIV750, MOTIV P-1000 PI, MOTIV/FUEL-IT! low pressure fuel system, AEM EMS/COBB AP, Aquamist HFS-3, ETS FMIC, SPEC stage 3+ clutch/SS flywheel, BC Racing coilovers and VMR wheels wrapped in Hankook RS3s.

  7. #257
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    The world...
    Posts
    1,331
    Rep Points
    1,202.2
    Mentioned
    8 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    13


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    LOL great question..on someone else's car (such as in this case) as long as the car isn't knocking and there's enough fuel to support the power if the owner is willing to push the limits and sign liability waivers we're game...on my own car limits are always pushed but again provided knock is in check and fuel is there...pushing past previously well known limits on any hardware is exploring the unexplored and everyone should be understand the risks
    kool, really curious as to what you guys can do here...

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    What?
    my point is simple... what was done here was appropriate. tony showed us max power on the worst quality pump gas as opposed to doing an all out meth run like Shiv from the beginning. No need to fault LM here for asking valid questions even though his eventual preference may be to run meth as well.
    2007 335i (100% stock with mods)

    N54 is not a German 2JZ lol

  8. #258
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    3,311
    Rep Points
    1,439.5
    Mentioned
    54 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    15


    Yes Reputation No
    cmooooon bent rods! Click here to enlarge

  9. #259
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Tallahassee
    Posts
    1,484
    Rep Points
    -25.8
    Mentioned
    34 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    0


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
    cmooooon bent rods! Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge

  10. #260
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    4,199
    Rep Points
    1,803.0
    Mentioned
    102 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    19


    1 out of 4 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    Weird how that's exactly the opposite of what you was arguing a couple a couple weeks ago when I said 93 + meth was what I was interested in seeing. Ohh and the DME pulls timing in response to CATs without it being corrections, you can easily lose several degrees of timing advance in response to CATs and not have a single correction. That's how the DME can compensate for a fairly aggressive tune and it still be safe in hot weather.
    Actually, not so much. What @LostMarine, myself & a few other people were asking for were for the results to not be dependent on 9x octane + meth runs, but instead for a combination of dynos, specifically strict Pump Gas numbers, Pump with Meth numbers, and finally Race Gas/E85 + Meth numbers. This way, it illustrated what the setup was capable of for people who don't run meth and/or how much power you have if you were out of meth.

    Here are the two most important quotes that illustrate WHY there was a substantial power increase when meth was added:

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    We were heat soaking pretty bad, and at that point running up against the HPFP limit. We ran the meth for 1 run, iat's plummeted and fuel trims went -20 DME still has some control to keep things safe, it saw more fuel and cooler charge and responded with some extra power, trust me I told the people there this is not going to add any power, we just want to see if it helps with the fuel issues. Ran it up lifted at 5900 looked up and was like wtf. I'll post the graph when I get home. Just kinda let us know how much more is in there with a few small changes. LM, that's really my only reasoning as to why because it made no sense to me either. Extra fuel when you are getting close to a ceiling, and a cooler intake charge go a long way.
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    This.

    To clarify though, we made 582whp once meth was turned on for the same map that made 572whp on just 91 octane. The 602whp pull where Tony lifted had a new map with just 2deg extra timing on top of 91 and smoothing changes to boost control to lift the bump you saw at 4500-5k rpm.
    SO big surprise, the 602 WHP pull (91 + Meth) was NOT the same tune that produced the 572 WHP (strict 91 pump gas). I have nothing against the ProTuning Freaks guys and Tony, but you can see how Tony's post was a little misleading. Myself included, some people could've read that post & been lead to believe that both runs were done on the same tune with meth being the only new variable added into the mix, thus being the only reason for the additional HP.
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

  11. #261
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    1,118
    Rep Points
    962.9
    Mentioned
    14 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    10


    Yes Reputation No
    So awesome that you are starting from piss 91 octane fuel an moving up steadily to see the gains in steps for different setups your customers will run great job not hiding behind glory runs .. But on that note I'd love to see a glory run on FTW E85 race gas screw the c16 run this has timing advantages even over c16 and is oxygenated to boot !

  12. #262
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Miami, FL
    Posts
    337
    Rep Points
    443.0
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    5


    2 out of 2 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    I am really interested to see what the pricing is going to end up being on this stage three kit. May end up keeping the 335 long term after all. I have several E85 stations within a mile of my house. Would be awesome.
    335i Coupe, JB4 (G4, map 5) DCI and 40% E85 blend: 2009 BMW 335i Coupe: 12.173 @ 109.490 MPH

  13. #263
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Houston under a book
    Posts
    1,404
    Rep Points
    2,677.5
    Mentioned
    65 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    27


    Yes Reputation No
    I got what I wanted out of this.... a power curve with a relatively flat said boost curve. And a nice $#@!storm at the post that I sadly missed watching. If you aren't starting a $#@!storm then you aren't doing it right on this platform.

    It's kinda like filling in the gaps of the stock VE curve to determing the effect of head, cams, intakes, and exhaust. You don't need everything, just enough. I've seen stock turbo's running X boost flat, stock frame turbo's (RB) run flat boost, ported head dyno's (D's car), man (ST) turbo's with ramping boost, and man (vargus) turbo's with flat boost. All that's needed now for a complete data set would be a non turbo dyno.

    I love complete data sets.

  14. #264
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    2,799
    Rep Points
    2,567.7
    Mentioned
    42 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    26


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by V8Bait Click here to enlarge
    I got what I wanted out of this.... a power curve with a relatively flat said boost curve. And a nice $#@!storm at the post that I sadly missed watching. If you aren't starting a $#@!storm then you aren't doing it right on this platform.

    It's kinda like filling in the gaps of the stock VE curve to determing the effect of head, cams, intakes, and exhaust. You don't need everything, just enough. I've seen stock turbo's running X boost flat, stock frame turbo's (RB) run flat boost, ported head dyno's (D's car), man (ST) turbo's with ramping boost, and man (vargus) turbo's with flat boost. All that's needed now for a complete data set would be a non turbo dyno.

    I love complete data sets.
    The N52.

    Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge
    Join the largest N5X Enthusiasts Group! 2300+ Members Strong!
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/n5xenthusiasts/
    Or the BX8 Enthusiast Group!
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/353105035077862/
    Cars: 2005 E46 330i - Sold | 2007 E90 335i - Crashed | 2009 E93 335i - Current | 1996 E36 328i Sedan

  15. #265
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    3,311
    Rep Points
    1,439.5
    Mentioned
    54 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    15


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by klipseracer Click here to enlarge
    The N52.

    Click here to enlarge
    not very useful as a comparison i wouldn't think?

  16. #266
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    2,799
    Rep Points
    2,567.7
    Mentioned
    42 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    26


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
    not very useful as a comparison i wouldn't think?
    Why not? He wanted a nonturbo dynobfor his dataset. Just about as close as he's gonna get unless I'm misunderstanding the request.
    Click here to enlarge
    Join the largest N5X Enthusiasts Group! 2300+ Members Strong!
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/n5xenthusiasts/
    Or the BX8 Enthusiast Group!
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/353105035077862/
    Cars: 2005 E46 330i - Sold | 2007 E90 335i - Crashed | 2009 E93 335i - Current | 1996 E36 328i Sedan

  17. #267
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    3,311
    Rep Points
    1,439.5
    Mentioned
    54 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    15


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by klipseracer Click here to enlarge
    Why not? He wanted a nonturbo dynobfor his dataset. Just about as close as he's gonna get unless I'm misunderstanding the request.
    totally different heads, 10.7:1 CR, valvetronic probably has an effect

  18. #268
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Hayward, CA
    Posts
    7,921
    Rep Points
    3,973.5
    Mentioned
    324 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    0



    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    This.

    To clarify though, we made 582whp once meth was turned on for the same map that made 572whp on just 91 octane. The 602whp pull where Tony lifted had a new map with just 2deg extra timing on top of 91 and smoothing changes to boost control to lift the bump you saw at 4500-5k rpm.

    Its just work in progress and lots more to follow. Don't be too hard on us for showing you preliminary results guys. Its easy not to show anything until its all perfect but that'd mean no fun on the forums Click here to enlarge I know how much I anticipate seeing results out there but let's try not to nitpick just yet. Once we say that's all we can do then we can all nitpick heh
    You know what D, you are right. I thought the one where I lifted was the first run as it was the first run where I had the dyno button, all those runs started blending together at the end when the Dyno op decided to take a phone call and handed me the button. So I was logging, starting and stoping the dyno, watching all the gauges, and trying to talk to you. Needless to say after that last hour. My brain was fried.

  19. #269
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Hayward, CA
    Posts
    7,921
    Rep Points
    3,973.5
    Mentioned
    324 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    0



    3 out of 3 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Actually, not so much. What @LostMarine , myself & a few other people were asking for were for the results to not be dependent on 9x octane + meth runs, but instead for a combination of dynos, specifically strict Pump Gas numbers, Pump with Meth numbers, and finally Race Gas/E85 + Meth numbers. This way, it illustrated what the setup was capable of for people who don't run meth and/or how much power you have if you were out of meth.

    Here are the two most important quotes that illustrate WHY there was a substantial power increase when meth was added:





    SO big surprise, the 602 WHP pull (91 + Meth) was NOT the same tune that produced the 572 WHP (strict 91 pump gas). I have nothing against the ProTuning Freaks guys and Tony, but you can see how Tony's post was a little misleading. Myself included, some people could've read that post & been lead to believe that both runs were done on the same tune with meth being the only new variable added into the mix, thus being the only reason for the additional HP.
    I got the runs mixed up, as at the end things were getting hetic as $#@! as we were running out of time. The runs were back to back and both numbers were up on the screen. Yes the person who has been the most transparent, and honest of just about any vendor in regards to what is going on with his products is going to mislead everyone for 17 hp. As the actaul run with no tune changes was 585, and something like 560 tq. I would have to look back to confirm tq. This, isn't a court case or trial. Your bolding of statements isn't evidence of anything, except you have too much time on your hands.

  20. #270
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    2,950
    Rep Points
    2,896.3
    Mentioned
    78 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    29


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    I got the runs mixed up, as at the end things were getting hetic as $#@! as we were running out of time. The runs were back to back and both numbers were up on the screen. Yes the person who has been the most transparent, and honest of just about any vendor in regards to what is going on with his products is going to mislead everyone for 17 hp. As the actaul run with no tune changes was 585, and something like 560 tq. I would have to look back to confirm tq. This, isn't a court case or trial. Your bolding of statements isn't evidence of anything, except you have too much time on your hands.
    QFT
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

    Click here to enlarge

  21. #271
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,190
    Rep Points
    1,457.0
    Mentioned
    31 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    15


    1 out of 2 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Why do people on this board auto-assume a conspiracy or someone being misleading when it's quite possible it's just a mistake? Holy $#@! people, at least give them a chance to address it before running off with your strawman.

    Tony has been up-front and the epitome of transparent since the beginning. He and DZ are pushing the platform forward while everyone kicks and screams like little babies (I'm guilty of it myself too). How about we just give Tony some slack eh?

  22. #272
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Naples, FL
    Posts
    2,086
    Rep Points
    2,205.2
    Mentioned
    72 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    23


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Actually, not so much. What @LostMarine , myself & a few other people were asking for were for the results to not be dependent on 9x octane + meth runs, but instead for a combination of dynos, specifically strict Pump Gas numbers, Pump with Meth numbers, and finally Race Gas/E85 + Meth numbers. This way, it illustrated what the setup was capable of for people who don't run meth and/or how much power you have if you were out of meth.

    Here are the two most important quotes that illustrate WHY there was a substantial power increase when meth was added:





    SO big surprise, the 602 WHP pull (91 + Meth) was NOT the same tune that produced the 572 WHP (strict 91 pump gas). I have nothing against the ProTuning Freaks guys and Tony, but you can see how Tony's post was a little misleading. Myself included, some people could've read that post & been lead to believe that both runs were done on the same tune with meth being the only new variable added into the mix, thus being the only reason for the additional HP.

    Are you seriously complaining about this? I can't believe this.

    Of course the meth run was a different tune! Look at the lack of "dip", that both Tony and Dzenno said that would be tuned out, and it shows in their last dyno.

    Buy your own set and test them however you please, or don't complain how the tuner and fabricator test them, everyone will get the numbers THEY THINK are the most useful, if thats No meth, or with meth, or with oxygenated e85 or with C16 or with E50 or whatever, just be patient.




  23. #273
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    5,173
    Rep Points
    526.1
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    6


    Yes Reputation No
    Any graphs with RPM's instead of MPH?
    Click here to enlargeClick here to enlarge

  24. #274
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    3,089
    Rep Points
    999.1
    Mentioned
    104 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    10


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Actually, not so much. What @LostMarine, myself & a few other people were asking for were for the results to not be dependent on 9x octane + meth runs, but instead for a combination of dynos, specifically strict Pump Gas numbers, Pump with Meth numbers, and finally Race Gas/E85 + Meth numbers. This way, it illustrated what the setup was capable of for people who don't run meth and/or how much power you have if you were out of meth.

    Here are the two most important quotes that illustrate WHY there was a substantial power increase when meth was added:





    SO big surprise, the 602 WHP pull (91 + Meth) was NOT the same tune that produced the 572 WHP (strict 91 pump gas). I have nothing against the ProTuning Freaks guys and Tony, but you can see how Tony's post was a little misleading. Myself included, some people could've read that post & been lead to believe that both runs were done on the same tune with meth being the only new variable added into the mix, thus being the only reason for the additional HP.
    What you're not getting is the 91 octane number is simply that, 91 octane. Takes time to properly dial everything in for different fuels, setups, etc.

    What I want to see is an E85+meth dyno sheet. 700 whp should come easy assuming you can crank the boost properly.

  25. #275
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Houston under a book
    Posts
    1,404
    Rep Points
    2,677.5
    Mentioned
    65 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    27


    Yes Reputation No
    Nope N52 is way too different from our engine, night and day really. From what I can tell the biggest killers of VE on this platform at high RPM are the stock turbo manfold and intake ports in the head. After that cams are the limiting factor, possibly equal to the intake ports in the head, but I can't say if the head or the cams are keeping the redline down yet since there is insufficient data (only the ST and Vargus would be capable of breathing that high to begin with, also assuming DI limitations are not exceeded with RPM). Exhaust ports don't seem like much of a concern for our VE, nor does the induction system for the most part (intake manifold). Not many surprises there but it's nicely backed up by real world examples now thanks to Vargus and others being open with their dyno's. Props for that.

    There has been a power vs rpm graph posted around somewhere in this thread or over on n54tech iirc. But on an interia dyno spool time (especially for big turbo's) isn't very accurate, probably off a few hundred RPM with slower ramp up.

Page 11 of 24 FirstFirst ... 91011121321 ... LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •