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  1. #251
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Mike@VAC Click here to enlarge
    That seemed to be a popular theory, but when we opened up an '06 build we proved that wrong. Well partially. Aug 2006 build - forged cracked cap rod, cast piston.

    Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge
    In the second photo showing the underside/inside of the N54 piston, you can clearly see the cast markings from when the liquid metal solidified in the mold.


    THE BEST PART is that Mike directly responded to Turkeybaster that all of the N54 pistons VAC has looked at are ALL cast.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Mike@VAC Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Turkeybaster115 Click here to enlarge
    Mike, not calling you a liar, or nothing, but you guys are selling Forged aftermarket pistons for the N54, right? Could that maybe have something to do with the results of your investigation?
    No.
    If you want, it starts on Page 3 in this thread and continues: http://www.bimmerboost.com/showthrea...y-forged/page3
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

  2. #252
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    THE BEST PART is that Mike directly responded to Turkeybaster that all of the N54 pistons VAC has looked at are ALL cast.
    So what is still not clicking?

  3. #253
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    That's that.
    Click here to enlarge

  4. #254
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    I don't think either forged or cast has been confirmed by a legitimate source and I'll pass on that assumption. There's also no reason why a cast piston wouldn't be able to make 650whp. Peak power and piston material have very little to do in direct relation to each other. Drop compression, run more boost and you'll make even more power on that same cast piston, generally speaking and not going into any other details
    This. And I'd like to add, increase VE and lower flame speed/combustion temps, pistons usually break from problems not so related to power and more related to tune or mechanical issue. If anything goes I predict rods. In a well tuned engine they usually have a pretty set breaking point.

  5. #255
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    So what is still not clicking?
    Ignorance... Stupidity.... Mental incapacity... Take your pick, unfortunately none of them can be "cured" or forcibly corrected
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
    Akrapovic DP | Helix FMIC | Alpina TCM Flash | Walbro 450LPH Fuel Pump


    "The moment money becomes your motivation, you are immediately not as good as someone who is motivated by passion and internal will." -A. Senna

  6. #256
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    how about instead of doing pistons first, why dont we just knock off a tiny bit of compression with dzennos setup (thicker headgasket/slightly milled head). It seemed that made a world of difference in the timing department, things should look better as well once the stage 3s go on.

  7. #257
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Itsbrokeagain Click here to enlarge
    how about instead of doing pistons first, why dont we just knock off a tiny bit of compression with dzennos setup (thicker headgasket/slightly milled head). It seemed that made a world of difference in the timing department, things should look better as well once the stage 3s go on.
    Sure, that's one way lower compression, run more boost, and it works well. But if I am going to pull the head to have it done, I am just going to pull the pan and get forged lower compression pistons, possibly rods at the same time. A bit more money, but in my opinion worth it in the long run as the platform reaches higher and higher HP numbers.

  8. #258
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    Eh, lowering compression is not neccessary with DI (especially on E85)... 10.5:1 is like PI 8.5:1. Cyl temps are much lower.

  9. #259
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    Eh, lowering compression is not neccessary with DI (especially on E85)... 10.5:1 is like PI 8.5:1. Cyl temps are much lower.
    I am going to disagree, sure if you want to run meth and E85 all day long, which by the way MANY people have no easy access to, fine. But MANY people want more then 500 HP on just pump gas, MANY platforms accomplish with ease. They do it by lowering compression slightly and running more boost and fuel. I love DI but on $#@!ty 91 the knock threshold is not high enough

  10. #260
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    I am going to disagree, sure if you want to run meth and E85 all day long, which by the way MANY people have no easy access to, fine. But MANY people want more then 500 HP on just pump gas, MANY platforms accomplish with ease. They do it by lowering compression slightly and running more boost and fuel. I love DI but on $#@!ty 91 the knock threshold is not high enough
    This.

  11. #261
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    I am going to disagree, sure if you want to run meth and E85 all day long, which by the way MANY people have no easy access to, fine. But MANY people want more then 500 HP on just pump gas, MANY platforms accomplish with ease. They do it by lowering compression slightly and running more boost and fuel. I love DI but on $#@!ty 91 the knock threshold is not high enough
    So you think that on E85 with meth 10.5:1 IS ACCEPTABLE for higher power numbers?




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    Stock is 10.2 and I like it. Quick spool and good off-boost performance.

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    0 out of 4 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Ignorance... Stupidity.... Mental incapacity... Take your pick, unfortunately none of them can be "cured" or forcibly corrected
    Thanks for the classy response. Go drink E85, and choke and crash your alpina flashed car.

  14. #264
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    So what is still not clicking?
    Why is no one discussing upgraded piston, when calling out vishnu for not pushing the car past 654whp? Yeah, you all hate the guy, but why not do it on your own cars first?, before basically calling him a pussy?

  15. #265
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    But you're statement wasn't very intelligent to begin with...
    I've read your ideas on American foreign policy, coming from some dude, who has more than likely not been outside the united states his whole life. That was enough for me.

  16. #266
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge


    In the second photo showing the underside/inside of the N54 piston, you can clearly see the cast markings from when the liquid metal solidified in the mold.


    THE BEST PART is that Mike directly responded to Turkeybaster that all of the N54 pistons VAC has looked at are ALL cast.



    If you want, it starts on Page 3 in this thread and continues: http://www.bimmerboost.com/showthrea...y-forged/page3
    Good ole' uncle mike didn't respond to my questions on the differential sticky, 2 months ago. Maybe he should start by addressing the errors on his website.

  17. #267
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    I am going to disagree, sure if you want to run meth and E85 all day long, which by the way MANY people have no easy access to, fine. But MANY people want more then 500 HP on just pump gas, MANY platforms accomplish with ease. They do it by lowering compression slightly and running more boost and fuel. I love DI but on $#@!ty 91 the knock threshold is not high enough
    I understand your goal, but you may end up with less enjoyment off the track. If 91 is the only option run meth... you won't be breaking HP records with solely 91 with any engine design. There's good and not so good ways of integrating meth/failsafes.

    When you decrease CR (change CC design)there are some negatives related to detonation like burn rate and reduced quench.

    I'll be interested in whatever you all build... doing a great job!

  18. #268
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    I understand your goal, but you may end up with less enjoyment off the track. If 91 is the only option run meth... you won't be breaking HP records with solely 91 with any engine design. There's good and not so good ways of integrating meth/failsafes.
    Josh, I don't think anyone is looking to break any hp records without all the octane they can get, let alone on really poor ACN 91 octane. Tuning however will cover ACN 91, 93, MS109 to see where/what the kit can do on each of these levels of octane. There also won't be special 94 octane blends based on 91 and race gas that some do as that clearly won't be what you get at the 93 pump. Once that's all done we'll see what can be done with E85 blends and possibly pure E85 with Tony's dual LPFP setup that has the OEM and Walbro in a parallel configuration. Once we're done with fuel from the fuel tank we'll see what's available on pump gas and meth as the last step for those that don't have E85 available and others who find race gas expensive to run on a daily basis.

    Tony's running the widely accepted industry workhorse Aquamist HFS-4 with their integrated failsafe. No worries there at all.
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Josh, I don't think anyone is looking to break any hp records without all the octane they can get, let alone on really poor ACN 91 octane. Tuning however will cover ACN 91, 93, MS109 to see where/what the kit can do on each of these levels of octane. There also won't be special 94 octane blends based on 91 and race gas that some do as that clearly won't be what you get at the 93 pump. Once that's all done we'll see what can be done with E85 blends and possibly pure E85 with Tony's dual LPFP setup that has the OEM and Walbro in a parallel configuration. Once we're done with fuel from the fuel tank we'll see what's available on pump gas and meth as the last step for those that don't have E85 available and others who find race gas expensive to run on a daily basis.
    I was replying to lowering the static compression… your tuning approach is fine.


    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Tony's running the widely accepted industry workhorse Aquamist HFS-4 with their integrated failsafe. No worries there at all.
    I know I’ll get flak on this… BUT this is not the “best” approach. Good system, but lacking in integration and tuning resolution. And WG dump failsafe, not optimal and potentially kinda useless… DME is the real failsafe with this setup.

  20. #270
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    I know I’ll get flak on this… BUT this is not the “best” approach. Good system, but lacking in integration and tuning resolution. And WG dump failsafe, not optimal and potentially kinda useless… DME is the real failsafe with this setup.
    No flak, just disagree Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge

  21. #271
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    I was replying to lowering the static compression… your tuning approach is fine.


    I know I’ll get flak on this… BUT this is not the “best” approach. Good system, but lacking in integration and tuning resolution. And WG dump failsafe, not optimal and potentially kinda useless… DME is the real failsafe with this setup.
    procede pwm setup is best; then? just curious...
    2007 335i (100% stock with mods)

    N54 is not a German 2JZ lol

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    Another note on tuning the Vargas twins while I'm thinking about it. Your approach as far as roadmap with the tools you will be using is good, BUT I have some thoughts on the outcome. Although it will be a working combination (larger turbos tuned via DME only), it will be lacking in multiple areas. Max boost will be controlled by limiting WGDC, but hitting any part throttle boost target will be a challenge and this will translate into sub-par throttle control. And if you have the same tools as ATR, torque targeting will be a limiting factor in smooth power delivery. Hopefully the public will be kept up to date and informed of the progress, driving impressions, etc... just as Tony has been transparent with everything else.

    Good luck!

  23. #273
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    Another note on tuning the Vargas twins while I'm thinking about it. Your approach as far as roadmap with the tools you will be using is good, BUT I have some thoughts on the outcome. Although it will be a working combination (larger turbos tuned via DME only), it will be lacking in multiple areas. Max boost will be controlled by limiting WGDC, but hitting any part throttle boost target will be a challenge and this will translate into sub-par throttle control. And if you have the same tools as ATR, torque targeting will be a limiting factor in smooth power delivery. Hopefully the public will be kept up to date and informed of the progress, driving impressions, etc... just as Tony has been transparent with everything else.

    Good luck!
    Hey I was wondering what happend with the sudden seemingly "friendly" Josh Click here to enlarge Appreciate the helpful insight as always. Stay t00ned.
    Click here to enlarge

  24. #274
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    Once the hardware is out if it works well anyone can tune it as they please. Click here to enlarge
    Burger Motorsports
    Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, N63s, S55s, and S63s!

    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  25. #275
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    I know I’ll get flak on this… BUT this is not the “best” approach. Good system, but lacking in integration and tuning resolution. And WG dump failsafe, not optimal and potentially kinda useless… DME is the real failsafe with this setup.
    It's borderline the worst tuning (not integrated) and definitely the worst failsafe when not integrated with a piggyback, also don't like the tank options, but it has the best compression fittings included. And the best flow sensor. All considered it's a good option but must be integrated with a piggyback to be "safe" IMHO.
    Burger Motorsports
    Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, N63s, S55s, and S63s!

    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

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