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  1. #1
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    JB4 factory turbo E85 dyno testing: 450whp

    Hey guys,

    Took our E92 over to the dyno for some E85 testing today. It's running a JB4, BMS E85 flash, our downpipes, DCI, and the $95 "Option2" inline fuel pump upgrade. It's a manual transmission, has the factory intercooler, and factory midcats & catback. Fuel mix was E50.

    Overall, was very pleased with the results. The first couple of runs we had pretty bad clutch slippage which seemed to go away after it heated up a bit. So there will likely be a clutch in its near future. But other than that everything performed flawlessly. The factory intercooler was picking up almost 50 degrees during these short 4th gear pulls so that definitely has to go soon. Click here to enlarge

    The new budget fuel pump upgrade worked flawlessly. We'll see how it does with a few weeks of driving and if that looks good will post up a DIY for it as well.

    This is the same dyno we've always used. Running a "stock like" boost curve of 8psi across the board (no taper), along with 13 degrees of advance on the E85, it did 310rw. Our flash has lower than factory load targets so it would not be a fair comparison to run it on the flash alone. Would probably only do 265rw. Another factory stock car recently did 280rw on the same dyno. Anyway, delta was solid and the car hauls ass.
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  2. #2
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    Very nice
    PTF PROTuned | RB's | AMS FMIC | AR DP's | HPF Exhaust | CP-E DCI | Apex Arc 8's | 235/275 Star Specs |

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    awesome.. im so glad you guys got a MT car.. thats huge for us MT guys
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    FBO's. Spec S2+. E85.

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    Jon is going to try to drag race it this weekend on street tires. It's his first try so we're not expecting too much. Click here to enlarge But having the car around will help sort out any lingering drivability issues on the MT side of things.
    Burger Motorsports
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Jon is going to try to drag race it this weekend on street tires. It's his first try so we're not expecting too much. Click here to enlarge But having the car around will help sort out any lingering drivability issues on the MT side of things.
    My guess is 12.7 @ 118 lol. IF he doesn't snap his driveshaft or an axle first.
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    it would be nice to have a more dialed in 2step for the MT guys.. i still havent had a chance to use it at the strip but i know it could be very helpful
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    FBO's. Spec S2+. E85.

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    Great numbers.

    The 50 degree temp jump, is that normal degrees or that fancy non-american scale?
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    My goal is 450whp with FOB stock turbos on a mix of E85. Hopefully my fuel pumps with 5k miles on them are up to the effort without some help.
    2015 - Cayman GTS - Stock
    2011 - 335is e92 - Cobb PTF E40/Rob Beck/AR/Helix (458 rwtq and 479 rwhp) - Retired
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rdeterman Click here to enlarge
    it would be nice to have a more dialed in 2step for the MT guys.. i still havent had a chance to use it at the strip but i know it could be very helpful
    In my experience, at these power levels its worthless. Tires are boiled from a dead stop in first or 2nd gear. If you have a diff lockdown kit and some sticky drag radials or slicks, it would be very helpful so that you could actually come out of the hole like a bat out of hell. I honestly get better 60ft times NOT using my 2 step - just revving up to 2k and slowly letting the clutch out and shifting to 2nd gear asap, usually around 4.5k. Only problem is that if i NLS into 2nd gear that low, i just boil the tires all the way through 2nd gear.

    TLDR; Manual transmissions $#@!ing suck at the strip
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    ive got a set of drag radials ive been running, ive been cutting consistant 1.8 sec 60' times but there is more to be had.. an LSD and or Diff lockdown kit is in my future
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    FBO's. Spec S2+. E85.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Jon is going to try to drag race it this weekend on street tires. It's his first try so we're not expecting too much. Click here to enlarge But having the car around will help sort out any lingering drivability issues on the MT side of things.
    Yes yes yes!!! The drivability isn't bad as is, I just think the MT exposes a lot you don't get on the AT. When you replace the clutch, I recommend the Spec 3+ with Steel SMF. Just finished breaking mine in a little while ago. TBH If I take it to the strip, I wouldn't mind potentially launching it in second. I have been doing that on the street and its pretty easy to modulate and seem to be taking the beating just fine.

    My car is sort of the opposite of yours (FMIC, 50% E85 - no flash or DPs) and has logged 430whp on virtual dyno with a 295whp base for a long time. Glad you got around to confirming it. I'd expect to pick up 15-20whp on the top of your run with a good FMIC. But I am just speculating.

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    I think 450 with E85 and factory turbos is a very nice result and solid power.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    I think 450 with E85 and factory turbos is a very nice result and solid power.
    +1 I know you are not a big fan of the bang for the buck argument but its epic in that way!
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  14. #14
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by xbox_fan Click here to enlarge
    +1 I know you are not a big fan of the bang for the buck argument but its epic in that way!
    I'm not against bang for the buck my argument tends to be what ultimately is the best.

    Separate issue.

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    JB4- $479 $400 USED
    BMS DP- $379 $275 USED
    DCI- $95 $75 USED
    Flash- $895 NEW ~$650 USED
    FP- $95 $95 NEW


    $1,943 NEW/ $1495 approx or less USED


    With a ~265whp stock and 450whp modified for that kind of money is crazy! You could literally go buy the car, install all the parts in 1 day and have 185whp gain. And on top of it be very reliable and CHEAP! We are still in the early stages of development in these cars so it can only get better from here. I have the same setup minus the booster pump right now and my car hauls. Everyone that has drove it or road along has been very impressed!
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    FBO's. Spec S2+. E85.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    In my experience, at these power levels its worthless. Tires are boiled from a dead stop in first or 2nd gear. If you have a diff lockdown kit and some sticky drag radials or slicks, it would be very helpful so that you could actually come out of the hole like a bat out of hell. I honestly get better 60ft times NOT using my 2 step - just revving up to 2k and slowly letting the clutch out and shifting to 2nd gear asap, usually around 4.5k. Only problem is that if i NLS into 2nd gear that low, i just boil the tires all the way through 2nd gear.

    TLDR; Manual transmissions $#@!ing suck at the strip
    AWD is the key to making good use of a 2-step.

  17. #17
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rdeterman Click here to enlarge
    JB4- $479 $400 USED
    BMS DP- $379 $275 USED
    DCI- $95 $75 USED
    Flash- $895 NEW ~$650 USED
    FP- $95 $95 NEW


    $1,943 NEW/ $1495 approx or less USED


    With a ~265whp stock and 450whp modified for that kind of money is crazy! You could literally go buy the car, install all the parts in 1 day and have 185whp gain. And on top of it be very reliable and CHEAP! We are still in the early stages of development in these cars so it can only get better from here. I have the same setup minus the booster pump right now and my car hauls. Everyone that has drove it or road along has been very impressed!
    You're forgetting that the lack of an aftermarket FMIC will mean the car can't SUSTAIN that power output for any reasonable amount of time.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    My guess is 12.7 @ 118 lol. IF he doesn't snap his driveshaft or an axle first.
    Lol try 13.5@115 if hes lucky. Anyone who hasn't dragged a 6MT N54 is in for a rude awakening. 6AT is pretty straightforward though.

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    Terry,

    Seeing clutch slip at around 4 - 4.5k RPM? Also, did you guys test the Ethanol?


    As for those questioning the pass that said gentleman will make with the car, trap speed has very little to do with driver ability/experience. That is unless of course it takes him 2 seconds to switch gears and he short shifts at 5K. ET obviously is effected. I would guess mid to high 12's at 117 to 119. I've seen 430 wheel cars trap 118(and that's 3 series cars). 30 wheel should equal around 2 mph but it all depends.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    Lol try 13.5@115 if hes lucky. Anyone who hasn't dragged a 6MT N54 is in for a rude awakening. 6AT is pretty straightforward though.
    or snap a half shaft right at the launch. People need to bring there car to the strip a few times before you start modding it... Even more so if you have never lined up at the tree...tire pressure... an what not
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Notsafe335i Click here to enlarge
    Terry,

    Seeing clutch slip at around 4 - 4.5k RPM? Also, did you guys test the Ethanol?


    As for those questioning the pass that said gentleman will make with the car, trap speed has very little to do with driver ability/experience. That is unless of course it takes him 2 seconds to switch gears and he short shifts at 5K. ET obviously is effected. I would guess mid to high 12's at 117 to 119. I've seen 430 wheel cars trap 118(and that's 3 series cars). 30 wheel should equal around 2 mph but it all depends.
    Was slipping in the 3.5-4k range.

    So Jon@BMS has 450rw with the manual. Jeff@BMS is also coming out, he has 380rw in an N55 steptronic, and drag radials. Both of them are heavier and have heavy full weight cars. We've been joking with Jon that he doesn't stand a chance against the N55. Click here to enlarge Realistically both are probably looking at mid 12s. Maybe 114mph for Jeff, 118mph for Jon, assuming they do everything right. Famoso is not a fast track.

    I'm going to bring the RB turbo 135i and see if I can get a clean pass out of it. Still have been too lazy to rebuild trans. Click here to enlarge But did find a way to improve line pressure via the flash. Which may help.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    You're forgetting that the lack of an aftermarket FMIC will mean the car can't SUSTAIN that power output for any reasonable amount of time.

    Your right.. i have a VRSF 7", that will need to be addressed in the BMS car right away.. Even with the FMIC @ $450 its still cheap
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    FBO's. Spec S2+. E85.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    Lol try 13.5@115 if hes lucky. Anyone who hasn't dragged a 6MT N54 is in for a rude awakening. 6AT is pretty straightforward though.
    Yes the biggest problem will be the launches. We'll probably limit his boost in 1st gear to 10psi, and 13psi in 2nd. He has never tried the NLS either so we'll see how that goes at the track.
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    So how did you increase the line pressure through flash?

    I've been reading through some documents and it looks like the DME and TCU communicate quite a bit over CAN. Some of the documentation I've read states the TCU will adjust the firmness of the shifts, possibly through line pressure, depending on the load of the engine. I though it might be possible to intercept some of those CAN messages and send only messages to the TCU that would maximize the firmness of the shifts.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ajm8127 Click here to enlarge
    So how did you increase the line pressure through flash?

    I've been reading through some documents and it looks like the DME and TCU communicate quite a bit over CAN. Some of the documentation I've read states the TCU will adjust the firmness of the shifts, possibly through line pressure, depending on the load of the engine. I though it might be possible to intercept some of those CAN messages and send only messages to the TCU that would maximize the firmness of the shifts.

    Terry has done a great job getting line pressure up for the trans.
    Before his latest map my trans woul slip with 18psi in 2nd gear so I had to limit to 12psi.. Now it holds just fine.

    If only I could get more than 6deg of timing post shift would be the ultimate..!!
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