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  1. #1
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    2 out of 2 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No

    A word of warning regarding DMFWs for those considering clutch replacements

    Rick@defiv is working on a clutch replacement for my 09 335i coupe, (Clutchmasters dual disk) and found something a little unpleasant:

    Basically the OEM DMFW was shot, the springs were completely gone (you could rotate the assembly entirely by hand) and it had a 'wobble.' Not the kind of issues you want on the end of your crankshaft. This is at 46,000 miles; approximately 4-5k of those tuned...

    For those that don't know this is my 2nd 335i, my first one, an 07 335i had it's OEM DMFW explode (it flew apart in two pieces.)

    Here were the particulars:
    07 335i: DPs, Intercooler, DCI + Procede Agressive : Exploded Flywheel
    09 335i: DPs, Intercooler, DCI + Procede Agressive : Flywheel on its way to exploding.

    This isn't to say that everyone who goes with the DMFW with the same mods will see the same action, it's safe to say that I am an aggressive driver and might represent an outlier use case Click here to enlarge Those running meth + the above or e86 + the above, upgraded turbos etc and still relying on an DMFW are sitting on a ticking timebomb, do yourselves a favor and get it out of your car.

    Now the other little surprise is it looks like I have the unfortunate 6 bolt crank, CM is doing their best to machine one for me, they should have it shipped out on 2/14/2013. From looking at the 8 bolt version you can definitely tell this is the clutch to get and for competitors to beat.

    Once rick@defiv has the clutch and does the install he assures me he'll have pictures of the fail, as well as an update on a skunkworks special project he insisted on doing (the man loves a challenge).
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

  2. #2
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    6-bolt crank. Hmmmmm Did BMW change crankshafts on us as well?
    From all the things I've lost,
    I miss my mind the most!
    Click here to enlarge

  3. #3
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    BMW switched from 8 bolt to 6 bolt sometime after 2008.
    2010 e92 M3 Jet Black | DCT | ESS Tuned | Akrapovic Slip-on | Challenge X-pipe | AFE Intake | 18" Volk TE37SL | KW V3 Coilovers | RPI Scoops | Under Drive Pulley

    2007 e92 Mont. Blue 335i | 6MT | COBB Tuned | Quaife 3.46 LSD | Helix FMIC | AA DPs | HKS Exhaust | DCI | Stett CP w/ Forged DVs | KWv2 Coilovers | UUC Sway Bars & SSK | HPF Stg 2 Clutch | HFS-4 | M3 Suspension Bits | DEFIVfab Diff Lockdown Kit | Stoptech Trophy BBK

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    WTF. What happened to the earlier 07 car when the FW exploded? That must have been a sight if it was at any kind of RPM. You're lucky you kept your feet.

    Interested to see if it's a higher torque problem that kills the DMFW or just poor engineering. Subscribed.

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    Agreed. My experience has been shared in another thread, but I'm preparing for my third clutch install in 4 weeks and firmly believe the OEM flywheel is causing the issues and just not made to handle the power some are putting down now. Going with SPEC SMFW for the third install. I'm FBO and Cobb 2+ Aggressive.
    Click here to enlarge

    PTF Pro Tuned l BMS DCI l DP l ETS 5" Intercooler
    HAT L4SE Carbon l HAT L1V2 l Jehnert XE200 l Arc Audio Arc 12 l Arc Minis l Audison bit Ten

  6. #6
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BavarianBullet Click here to enlarge
    WTF. What happened to the earlier 07 car when the FW exploded? That must have been a sight if it was at any kind of RPM. You're lucky you kept your feet.

    Interested to see if it's a higher torque problem that kills the DMFW or just poor engineering. Subscribed.
    I got extremely lucky in the way that it flew apart... Others who run the DMFW with high HP cars without a blanket are playing russian roulette with their legs Click here to enlarge
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

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    I just ordered a Spec stage 3+ clutch and steel SMFW. No way in hell I would go back with a DMFW.
    Click here to enlarge
    MOTIV750, MOTIV P-1000 PI, MOTIV/FUEL-IT! low pressure fuel system, AEM EMS/COBB AP, Aquamist HFS-3, ETS FMIC, SPEC stage 3+ clutch/SS flywheel, BC Racing coilovers and VMR wheels wrapped in Hankook RS3s.

  8. #8
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by cadillacgrills Click here to enlarge
    Agreed. My experience has been shared in another thread, but I'm preparing for my third clutch install in 4 weeks and firmly believe the OEM flywheel is causing the issues and just not made to handle the power some are putting down now. Going with SPEC SMFW for the third install. I'm FBO and Cobb 2+ Aggressive.
    I saw your other thread. I had my issues with my 08 335xi's OEM trans not shifting great and the stock clutch was IMO woefully inadequate for even basic drag launching but nothing like what you went through.

    I put in more clutches than I care to remember back in my 20s when I raced 5.0s. Never had a problem myself when I did my own clutches. The N54 clutch scene is pretty scary in contrast. $1300 for a clutch and FW plus labor and some people's results are very disappointing.

    After reading what some people went though, if I get back into another 335, I'm going to have to think real hard about 6MT vs 6AT again. They both have their issues. 6MT is a possibility for me and I think I'd go the route you describe by going with a single mass flywheel. Seems safer IMO.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    I got extremely lucky in the way that it flew apart... Others who run the DMFW with high HP cars without a blanket are playing russian roulette with their legs Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge
    I'm with you on this one. The SMFW is looking better and better for so many reasons now. I like my legs and wouldn't have a problem with the price if I decide to get back into a 6MT N54/N55.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    Spec stage 3+ clutch and steel SMFW. No way in hell I would go back with a DMFW.
    Click here to enlarge
    PTF PROTuned | RB's | AMS FMIC | AR DP's | HPF Exhaust | CP-E DCI | Apex Arc 8's | 235/275 Star Specs |

    Click here to enlarge


  11. #11
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    So... let me get this straight: the failures of the DMFW that you are all referring to are related to mostly drag racing conditions, is that correct?
    From all the things I've lost,
    I miss my mind the most!
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by vasillalov Click here to enlarge
    So... let me get this straight: the failures of the DMFW that you are all referring to are related to mostly drag racing conditions, is that correct?
    I never once had my car to a dragstrip. Neither of them. Hard street driving, never dragged.
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

  13. #13
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uniter Click here to enlarge
    I never once had my car to a dragstrip. Neither of them. Hard street driving, never dragged.

    WOW! Now I am getting concerned....
    From all the things I've lost,
    I miss my mind the most!
    Click here to enlarge

  14. #14
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by vasillalov Click here to enlarge
    WOW! Now I am getting concerned....
    Why would you be getting concerned? Can you count how many people on these forums have these cars as modded or more heavily modded than his car running a DMFW and haven't had an issue, because if they did you can believe it would be all over the forums. Not saying a SM steel flywheel is not a better option. But saying the DMFW is a ticking time bomb when the number of cases is obviously extremely limited seems a little extreme to me.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Why would you be getting concerned? Can you count how many people on these forums have these cars as modded or more heavily modded than his car running a DMFW and haven't had an issue, because if they did you can believe it would be all over the forums. Not saying a SM steel flywheel is not a better option. But saying the DMFW is a ticking time bomb when the number of cases is obviously extremely limited seems a little extreme to me.

    Because of the following reasons:

    1. I have Stage 2+ car which I take to road courses regularly
    2. I have an ever increasing fly wheel chatter at idle (could be throw-out bearing)
    From all the things I've lost,
    I miss my mind the most!
    Click here to enlarge

  16. #16
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by vasillalov Click here to enlarge
    Because of the following reasons:

    1. I have Stage 2+ car which I take to road courses regularly
    2. I have an ever increasing fly wheel chatter at idle (could be throw-out bearing)
    Replace it. The Springs 'go' then the DMFW assy bangs until it explodes.
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Why would you be getting concerned? Can you count how many people on these forums have these cars as modded or more heavily modded than his car running a DMFW and haven't had an issue, because if they did you can believe it would be all over the forums. Not saying a SM steel flywheel is not a better option. But saying the DMFW is a ticking time bomb when the number of cases is obviously extremely limited seems a little extreme to me.
    Click here to enlarge Not everyone drives their modified cars with consistent 'excellence and love.'
    I'm not beholden to any company's products WRT flywheel systems. I've just seen one OEM DMFW that has exploded in a potentially leg-maiming fashion and a 2nd OEM DMFW well on its way to that outcome.

    It's alarming enough to present to the community and defend my assessment of it's severity.
    LEMANS BLUE M-TECH E92->PROCEDE REV3::ETS 7" FMIC::RACELAND DPS::WAVETRAC DIFF::DEFIV DIFF LOCKDOWN::DEFIV OCC::DEFIV INTAKE::RB PCV

  18. #18
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    I mean makes sense, all the people who drive their cars on the track with no issues posted, but you happened to have one and now the DMFW ticking time bomb. Again not saying the SW steel isn't an upgrade. But seems to be a pretty limited case to throw out a blanket statement like that. Many many people drive their cars hard with no issues. SM flywheels are noisy enough for people to not want them on a car they use as a DD and a weekend warrior track car

  19. #19
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    I just ordered a Spec stage 3+ clutch and steel SMFW. No way in hell I would go back with a DMFW.
    Thanks for the order @rader1.

    @uniter this is truly scary. Its honestly making me seriously think about pulling at least my dmfw out if not changing the hpf feramic out as well. I can see that one weld on me with my luck.
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Thanks for the order @rader1 .

    @uniter this is truly scary. Its honestly making me seriously think about pulling at least my dmfw out if not changing the hpf feramic out as well. I can see that one weld on me with my luck.
    Don't do it! Then you will make me worried about just putting one in. My posts are strictly for my own peace of mind....Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Don't do it! Then you will make me worried about just putting one in. My posts are strictly for my own peace of mind....Click here to enlarge
    Not easy on my end thinking about $2k+ i just spent on a new dmfw and the hpf clutch. Question is do I want to risk my feet for $2k. Risk is very real or so it seems. Wish we had the steel flywheel earlier Click here to enlargeClick here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge

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    I've been getting phantom misfires and read Shiv's experiences on the other site. I do have stock DMFW chatter and am wondering if it's shot and that's why I'm getting these high-RPM misfires when I've done almost everything to suppress it (injectors, coils, plugs, intake valve cleaning, E85). E85 does suppress it a little bit, but I still get "misfires" with E85 mix 30%. The only thing holding me back from getting an aftermarket flywheel is that I don't want constant chattering... I did recently see a youtube video of a Clutchmaster flywheel on a 335 without any chatter:



    Anyone have any suggestions on what kind of flywheel I should go for? Is the flywheel covered under BMW warranty since it's part of the drivetrain? I'd probably want to get an aftermarket one anyways, though, since I'm FBO with Cobb Stage 2+ and planning on getting meth at some point...

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    Where was this thread 2 weeks ago, $#@!! Lol

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Not easy on my end thinking about $2k+ i just spent on a new dmfw and the hpf clutch. Question is do I want to risk my feet for $2k. Risk is very real or so it seems. Wish we had the steel flywheel earlier Click here to enlargeClick here to enlarge
    Cant we just keep the hpf and swap out for the smfw?
    2010 e92 M3 Jet Black | DCT | ESS Tuned | Akrapovic Slip-on | Challenge X-pipe | AFE Intake | 18" Volk TE37SL | KW V3 Coilovers | RPI Scoops | Under Drive Pulley

    2007 e92 Mont. Blue 335i | 6MT | COBB Tuned | Quaife 3.46 LSD | Helix FMIC | AA DPs | HKS Exhaust | DCI | Stett CP w/ Forged DVs | KWv2 Coilovers | UUC Sway Bars & SSK | HPF Stg 2 Clutch | HFS-4 | M3 Suspension Bits | DEFIVfab Diff Lockdown Kit | Stoptech Trophy BBK

  25. #25
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Not easy on my end thinking about $2k+ i just spent on a new dmfw and the hpf clutch. Question is do I want to risk my feet for $2k. Risk is very real or so it seems. Wish we had the steel flywheel earlier Click here to enlargeClick here to enlarge
    Its all good. I just put one in. We will see how it goes. I am honestly not worried at all.

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