Close

Page 28 of 38 FirstFirst ... 182627282930 ... LastLast
Results 676 to 700 of 933
  1. #676
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Valley Stream NY
    Posts
    3,327
    Rep Points
    2,780.2
    Mentioned
    85 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    28


    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    We should just all stop arguing with Sticky. Hes gonna debate til hes blue in the face and 6ft under. S65 4lyfer right here.we show facts and videos, he shows his facts and videos and says ours dont mean anything. Hes never lost one argument at anything, even when hes been 100% wrong in some cases.

  2. #677
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Home
    Posts
    142
    Rep Points
    200.4
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    3


    Yes Reputation No
    I had a nice chat with a guy I know who used to worked in the BMW Motorsport engine development.

    P65 and S65 do not have a single part in common.

    Just a FYI.

  3. #678
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Itsbrokeagain Click here to enlarge
    We should just all stop arguing with Sticky. Hes gonna debate til hes blue in the face and 6ft under. S65 4lyfer right here.we show facts and videos, he shows his facts and videos and says ours dont mean anything. Hes never lost one argument at anything, even when hes been 100% wrong in some cases.
    You haven't shown any facts and videos. The counter-argument has amounted to gains with bolt ons and youtube race videos.

    What facts?

  4. #679
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by S62R Click here to enlarge
    I had a nice chat with a guy I know who used to worked in the BMW Motorsport engine development.

    P65 and S65 do not have a single part in common.

    Just a FYI.
    Not a single part? BMW themselves, on their own Motorsport webpage, refutes this.

    Come on now, let's not reach.

    It's the same architecture obviously with different internals. Same bore x stroke. Seam head design. And the same block and material.

    Also, the block was made at the factory making the F1 blocks at the time, aluminum-silicon composite. F1 technology FTW Click here to enlarge

  5. #680
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Home
    Posts
    142
    Rep Points
    200.4
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    3


    Yes Reputation No
    I rely on my sources.

    All S-engine Alusil blocks are cast in Landshut since the S62 days...

  6. #681
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    711
    Rep Points
    569.1
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    6


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    Perfect example if why my logic dominates stickys.

    P65 is needed to he competive, does it well. Delivers power. S65, the public option, is down on power, not enough to be competitive.

    If its "basically" the same motor and only difference is power...aren't we, the public, robbed?

    All this time, the way to implode stickys brain has been right in front of us.. the P65 does what the s65 should have been able to do..

    P65, detuned, catted, etc.. in a public M3.. oh what a world it would have been..
    Please tell me why you own an m3. please.
    Honda CBR 1000RR, Superbike Supply, Arrow, HRC, BMC, Lee's Cycle, Galfer, EBC, Revzilla, AXO, Dainese, Scorpion Helmets

    Honda Grom, most fun you'll ever have on 2 wheels.

  7. #682
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    711
    Rep Points
    569.1
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    6


    2 out of 2 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Read. Both of you are right.

    A dry sumped racing version of the BMW P65, all aluminium, 90-degree V8 engine powers the M3 racecars. This has the same bore and stroke dimensions of 92mm and 75.2mm as the production power unit giving a swept volume of 3999cc. In its initial ALMS competition form, with two 30.1mm air inlet restrictors fitted, the engine generated 460bhp at 7500rpm with maximum torque of 500Nm at 5500rpm. For the engine’s 2010 configuration, BMW Motorsport quotes a peak power output of 500bhp at 8750rpm. In contrast, the production engine develops 420bhp at 8300rpm with a peak torque output of 400Nm at 3900rpm.
    Castings for the P65 engines are produced at BMW’s light alloy foundry in Landshut, the same facility at which its Formula 1 engine castings were produced. The aluminium alloy cylinder block incorporates a bed plate lower section, which carries the five main bearings that support a forged steel crankshaft driven by steel connecting rods and fully skirted forged aluminium pistons. Power for the aluminium alloy, double overhead camshaft cylinder heads is taken from the nose of the crankshaft and is transmitted to the four valves per cylinder via rocker arms and steel bucket tappets.

    http://www.racecar-engineering.com/cars/bmw-m3-gt2/
    Honda CBR 1000RR, Superbike Supply, Arrow, HRC, BMC, Lee's Cycle, Galfer, EBC, Revzilla, AXO, Dainese, Scorpion Helmets

    Honda Grom, most fun you'll ever have on 2 wheels.

  8. #683
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by S62R Click here to enlarge
    I rely on my sources.

    All S-engine Alusil blocks are cast in Landshut since the S62 days...
    Exactly. And they did the F1 blocks there too.

  9. #684
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    Read. Both of you are right.

    A dry sumped racing version of the BMW P65, all aluminium, 90-degree V8 engine powers the M3 racecars. This has the same bore and stroke dimensions of 92mm and 75.2mm as the production power unit giving a swept volume of 3999cc. In its initial ALMS competition form, with two 30.1mm air inlet restrictors fitted, the engine generated 460bhp at 7500rpm with maximum torque of 500Nm at 5500rpm. For the engine’s 2010 configuration, BMW Motorsport quotes a peak power output of 500bhp at 8750rpm. In contrast, the production engine develops 420bhp at 8300rpm with a peak torque output of 400Nm at 3900rpm.
    Castings for the P65 engines are produced at BMW’s light alloy foundry in Landshut, the same facility at which its Formula 1 engine castings were produced. The aluminium alloy cylinder block incorporates a bed plate lower section, which carries the five main bearings that support a forged steel crankshaft driven by steel connecting rods and fully skirted forged aluminium pistons. Power for the aluminium alloy, double overhead camshaft cylinder heads is taken from the nose of the crankshaft and is transmitted to the four valves per cylinder via rocker arms and steel bucket tappets.

    http://www.racecar-engineering.com/cars/bmw-m3-gt2/
    Ya I don't know my $#@! or anything... lol.

  10. #685
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    711
    Rep Points
    569.1
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    6


    Yes Reputation No
    I don't see the P65 being too much different externally than the S65. I'd imagine the internals are beefed and lightened to conform to the extremeties of racing. However, the same basic outly of the engine is the same. Essentially speaking, the dinan stroker kit or even a bolt on M3 makes more power than the actual racing engine used. I'm referencing the 460hp with restrictors here. Therefore, you can and are purchasing a racing engine. Just need to add some components and viola.
    Honda CBR 1000RR, Superbike Supply, Arrow, HRC, BMC, Lee's Cycle, Galfer, EBC, Revzilla, AXO, Dainese, Scorpion Helmets

    Honda Grom, most fun you'll ever have on 2 wheels.

  11. #686
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    However, the same basic outly of the engine is the same.
    Yep. It's obvious anyway.

    Plus what are we debating here? The N54 isn't raced competitively. It isn't an M motor. It isn't equal to an M motor. It never will be.

    I don't care how much air you pump into it.

  12. #687
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    Therefore, you can and are purchasing a racing engine. Just need to add some components and viola.
    AMEN.

    I can't believe some people don't get it. The S65 is an amazing motor. Weak? LOL.

    Click here to enlarge

  13. #688
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    711
    Rep Points
    569.1
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    6


    Yes Reputation No
    I feel like stirring the pot up some more.
    Honda CBR 1000RR, Superbike Supply, Arrow, HRC, BMC, Lee's Cycle, Galfer, EBC, Revzilla, AXO, Dainese, Scorpion Helmets

    Honda Grom, most fun you'll ever have on 2 wheels.

  14. #689
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    www.bootmod3.com
    Posts
    6,693
    Rep Points
    3,352.2
    Mentioned
    227 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    34


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    Yep. It's obvious anyway.

    Plus what are we debating here? The N54 isn't raced competitively. It isn't an M motor. It isn't equal to an M motor. It never will be.

    I don't care how much air you pump into it.
    LOL so now a P65 running with an aftermarket standalone is ok but the Alpina motor in the B3 GT3 was a MAJOR redesign because of its 9.4 compression pistons and SAME everything else. Quiet laughable especially given how much is involved on both sides and given tuning potential on both motors. S65 is simply underwhelming OEM accept it especially given how well the S54 did and still does, simply an inadequate upgrade
    Click here to enlarge

  15. #690
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    292
    Rep Points
    372.9
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    4


    Yes Reputation No
    @Sticky . If the S65 is the best thing since sliced bread, then why are you getting rid of yours after you beat all the records? By the sound of this thread you would just be downgrading with your next project.

  16. #691
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by justohigh Click here to enlarge
    @Sticky . If the S65 is the best thing since sliced bread, then why are you getting rid of yours after you beat all the records? By the sound of this thread you would just be downgrading with your next project.
    You don't know my next project.

    The reason I would sell it is because it would be time for a new project as a promotional piece for my websites. Once I'm done there is nothing else left to accomplish.

  17. #692
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    711
    Rep Points
    569.1
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    6


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    LOL so now a P65 running with an aftermarket standalone is ok but the Alpina motor in the B3 GT3 was a MAJOR redesign because of its 9.4 compression pistons and SAME everything else. Quiet laughable especially given how much is involved on both sides and given tuning potential on both motors. S65 is simply underwhelming OEM accept it especially given how well the S54 did and still does, simply an inadequate upgrade

    You want to be realistic. The S54 was a let down. The S54 is a gutless and torqueless wonder powering a heavy car. My E46 has every option including the competition package and weighs 3420. At the time of its release you had the 01 Cobra that was faster, 01 C5 would walk one stock for stock, S4 was right there, 01 C32 was faster, the 996 was about to enter a refresh in 2002, which it did and it was a hair bit quicker with the 3.6, etc etc and these are just <400 hp cars. The S65 has done an incredible job now that it has to fight off 500 hp cars. It will outdo a GT500 at the track, a C5 Z06 at the track, a Mustang GT 5.0 is still behind in lap times, and you're all saying it's weak?

    The S65 was a godsend from BMW. Comparing the competition from back then to now, it's insane. The S65 is more impressive than the S54 because of the competition it has been able to fend off using a mere 4.0 liters or .8 more displacement than the outgoing S54. It's impressive hands down. If you don't believe me, how impressive is Audi's 4.2 in their chassis? The RS5 is brand new. How long has it taken Audi to finally develop a chassis comparable to the outgoing model? 5 years. Mercedes has built an excellent 6.2 or 6.3 whatever the hell it is. Very impressive engine as well. But, it's not as impressive as the S65 because of the displacement cap. Still an impressive engine nonethless.
    Honda CBR 1000RR, Superbike Supply, Arrow, HRC, BMC, Lee's Cycle, Galfer, EBC, Revzilla, AXO, Dainese, Scorpion Helmets

    Honda Grom, most fun you'll ever have on 2 wheels.

  18. #693
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    LOL so now a P65 running with an aftermarket standalone is ok but the Alpina motor in the B3 GT3 was a MAJOR redesign because of its 9.4 compression pistons and SAME everything else. Quiet laughable especially given how much is involved on both sides and given tuning potential on both motors. S65 is simply underwhelming OEM accept it especially given how well the S54 did and still does, simply an inadequate upgrade
    We compared the Alpina to the M3 GTS, not a P65 base race car. The Alpina needed new internals, not the S65. And the S65 is faster.

    Ya super underwhelming:

    Mark Gillies of Car and Driver magazine says: "A car has got to be pretty spectacular to win over the curmudgeons here at 1585 Eisenhower Place, especially when familiarity sets in over the course of 40,000 miles. But our Sparkling Graphite Metallic M3 did indeed win us over.", and "Based on our experience, the current M3 is the world's all-around best car for the money, although several staffers would have preferred to trade some of the coupe's looks for the added practicality of the sedan.", and "This is the finest car on the market, period."
    Sure sounds like it needs a bunch more power to be a better car eh?

  19. #694
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    01 C32 was faster
    I proved this wrong actually, the M3 is faster stock for stock.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    01 Cobra that was faster
    Actually they were about even. The Cobra trapped 106 just like the S54.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    01 C5 would walk one stock for stock
    Not the automatic.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    996 was about to enter a refresh in 2002
    The S54 was even with the 3.6 and faster than the 3.4

    Just want to point out the S54 was pretty impressive as well although obviously much less powerful than the S65.

  20. #695
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    But, it's not as impressive as the S65 because of the displacement cap.
    This.

    I really can't process how the motors are not even evaluated in context but solely in terms of "bolt ons" and horsepower figures. It's elementary school level analysis.

  21. #696
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    711
    Rep Points
    569.1
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    6


    Yes Reputation No
    Some people don't understand that there's no replacement for displacement. None whatsoever. Adding turbos helps, but does not solve the problem. The ones talking here about bolt ons are either N54 owners expecting the S65 to produce the same gains or S65 owners expecting big displacement bolt on gains. It will not happen like you would like. It's exactly like what the GT3RS guys are going through. You know the only way to make more power from one of them is? You want to talk about how maxxed out their engines are? The only way to make power with the old GT3 RS 3.8 is to do the 4.0 build. An exhaust is yielding incredibly minimal numbers. There's a max of 15 rwhp to be found with bolt ons. After that there is no cam, there is no intake, nothing. It's an all out build. At least with the S65 you can go up another 20-30 rwhp with bolt ons and another 20-30 on top of that with an all out build.
    Honda CBR 1000RR, Superbike Supply, Arrow, HRC, BMC, Lee's Cycle, Galfer, EBC, Revzilla, AXO, Dainese, Scorpion Helmets

    Honda Grom, most fun you'll ever have on 2 wheels.

  22. #697
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    The ones talking here about bolt ons are either N54 owners expecting the S65 to produce the same gains or S65 owners expecting big displacement bolt on gains.
    You nailed it.

  23. #698
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    It's an all out build. At least with the S65 you can go up another 20-30 rwhp with bolt ons and another 20-30 on top of that with an all out build.
    Actually you can take the S65 to about 500 whp. Bolt ons are worth 50, displacement increase another 50, then you have the heads and cams. Much more room than the GT3 RS obviously.

    I mean BMW could deliver that stock but at what cost? I really don't understand how people are struggling with the concepts here.

  24. #699
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    711
    Rep Points
    569.1
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    6


    Yes Reputation No
    lol at what the m3 gts cost. $150000+.
    Honda CBR 1000RR, Superbike Supply, Arrow, HRC, BMC, Lee's Cycle, Galfer, EBC, Revzilla, AXO, Dainese, Scorpion Helmets

    Honda Grom, most fun you'll ever have on 2 wheels.

  25. #700
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    120,267
    Rep Points
    32,722.2
    Mentioned
    2131 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    328


    Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by StinkyM Click here to enlarge
    lol at what the m3 gts cost. $150000+.
    Apparently that is what they want and then there would be no complaints.

Page 28 of 38 FirstFirst ... 182627282930 ... LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •