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  1. #26
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by S62R Click here to enlarge
    I am building at the moment another Evolve n/a S54,same setup as above plus cams and head work.

    We will see how much this one puts down...
    WOW! Sal will be tuning ANOTHER cam'd S54?!?!?!

    Make a build thread here ASAP!

    Do you have any baseline dynos or data?
    2002 E46 M3 6MT | Jet Black . Black Nappa | My GermanBoost Build Thread
    2009 E90 M3 DCT | Melbourne Red . Speed Cloth

  2. #27
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    Is a customer car that has worn cams and rockers,no baseline.

    Disassembled it this week and today the customer gave green light for the build.


    Build thread like on my n/a S62 monsters follows,Flip...Click here to enlarge

  3. #28
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by S62R Click here to enlarge
    I am building at the moment another Evolve n/a S54,same setup as above plus cams and head work.

    We will see how much this one puts down...
    Really want to see this...

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
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  4. #29
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    There will be several built head and camm'ed S54's with @evolve tunes in 2013. Mine will be safe for repeated trips to 8,500+. @normcaldwell and I delivered the Cams, Supertech valvetrain parts, and DLC followers to the machine shop during the holidays. The head is already hot-tanked and disassembled. And the OEM head/valvetrain have already been flow benched for baseline data. Should be a fun year for S54's. Click here to enlarge

  5. #30
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MisterEm Click here to enlarge
    There will be several built head and camm'ed S54's with @evolve tunes in 2013. Mine will be safe for repeated trips to 8,500+. @normcaldwell and I delivered the Cams, Supertech valvetrain parts, and DLC followers to the machine shop during the holidays. The head is already hot-tanked and disassembled. And the OEM head/valvetrain have already been flow benched for baseline data. Should be a fun year for S54's. Click here to enlarge
    SO. MUCH. WIN.

    I wonder what NA numbers we will see....

    Stage 2 or 2.5 E9X M3 S65 V8 supercharger kit for sale
    : http://www.boostaddict.com/showthrea...r-kit-for-sale

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    VERY nice results guys! I'm such a S54 fanboy....

  7. #32
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Mike@VAC Click here to enlarge
    VERY nice results guys! I'm such a S54 fanboy....
    LOL You and me both buddy.
    Click here to enlarge



    EURO 04 M3 Current Mods:GC DAs, Eibach Sways, PF RTAB's, RE RCAs, INTRAVEE II, Black Roundels, ///MFEST Badges, Depo's, Screen protector for NAV display, VCSL Bumper + Race Lip & CF Trunk & CF Rear Diffusor, DIETZ TV in Motion, SS= V1 Headers + catless pipes + X-Pipe + SS Sport Exhaust, Z8 Starter Button, Lamin-X, OEM CSL interior, OEM CSL Steering, OEM CSL Intake, OEM CSL Roof, MSS54HP + OEM CSL Tune, BBS CH's, LIGHTWERKZ, 355mm ST40 BBK, BW Oil Cooler....

  8. #33
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Mike@VAC Click here to enlarge
    VERY nice results guys! I'm such a S54 fanboy....
    Thanks Mike!

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    This is probably a stupid question. What is the advantage of Alpha-N...especially in a car that sees mostly track time?

  10. #35
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bigjae1976 Click here to enlarge
    This is probably a stupid question. What is the advantage of Alpha-N...especially in a car that sees mostly track time?
    Well, everything. You target tuning based on expected airflow.

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    So is Alpha N a more precise means of measuring airflow? I know it ditches the MAF but how often do MAFs fail in an NA engine? Its not something I feel is a necessity to delete.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bigjae1976 Click here to enlarge
    So is Alpha N a more precise means of measuring airflow? I know it ditches the MAF but how often do MAFs fail in an NA engine? Its not something I feel is a necessity to delete.
    I had a great post somewhere explaining this but I can't find it. I would recommend searching.

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    Nothing really came up on here that answered the why. Or at least I did not see it.

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    2 out of 2 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bigjae1976 Click here to enlarge
    This is probably a stupid question. What is the advantage of Alpha-N...especially in a car that sees mostly track time?
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bigjae1976 Click here to enlarge
    So is Alpha N a more precise means of measuring airflow? I know it ditches the MAF but how often do MAFs fail in an NA engine? Its not something I feel is a necessity to delete.
    I wish I could give you a more technical explanation, but I just don't think I know the concept well enough to suffice. What I can do is tell you the benefits that I've personally had after having, stock tune, Evolve MAF Tune, and Evolve AlphaN Tune.

    First thing is that I am now able to use an Airbox that has much more massive air flow that the stock MAF is not capable of metering. The nice perk is that I get to use a sexy CF Airbox that sounds out of this world when paired with the S54B32.

    Second thing I noticed is the feel of the throttle. Evolve has done a pretty darn good job with their throttle mapping for both MAF and AlphaN. With AlphaN, it took what I felt with the MAF tune to another level. This is the only car I've ever driven that is as close to throttle-cable setup. It feel as if the amount of throttle input I induce is in a 1:1 relationship with what the throttle bodies do. So what I noticed on the street is much more predictable, manageable, and natural throttle control. Whether it be heal-toe, holding throttle around a turn, on-off throttle transitions....it's just instantaneous, yet smooth and predictable.

    With the MSS54, there is an integrated barometric sensor. So despite the extremes in weather condition and slight deviation in elevation that I confront, my car has never skipped a beat. It has driven 100% reliable and predictable in literally all four season with a drastically wide range of temperature.

    Another nice perk of deleting the MAF is that now I can relocate the IAT sensor to somewhere that is more accurate and consistent in reading. In the stock S54B32 MAF, the IAT is integrated within the MAF sensor. The problem is that the MAF has a tendency to heat soak, tricking the IAT into thinking that the temps are higher than they really are. This is not very ideal for power output and consistency. With the MAF delete, I now use a IAT relocation sensor. Evolve has scaled the IAT within the DME maps to read 100% accurate and precise. With my own data logging and when up to speed, my IATs are always within a few degrees of ambient. In my opinion, this just shows how reliable and consistent both Evolve's Intake is and their choice of IAT location.

    So AlphaN as a whole gives you the opportunity to experience a few small things here and there, that overall can have a nice change in the driving experience.

    Hopefully that helps share one side of the story. If you have any specific questions, I'd definitely be willing to be as helpful as I can.
    2002 E46 M3 6MT | Jet Black . Black Nappa | My GermanBoost Build Thread
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  15. #40
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    well said

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    Flip...99% of what I was looking for. So I'm still waiting for the last 1%...anytime now...Click here to enlarge

    But I get it now. So basically Alpha-N is mostly pointless until you get the CSL style airbox. On the "flip"side, getting the CSL style box and not getting Alpha-N leaves some gains on the table and is not required.

    Going OT...but I had wanted to do headers and a 3.5" BW style exhaust with the software. Then at some point add the CSL box. So I am trying to figure out if software with the exhaust system will be a total waste.

    Thanks!

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by flipm3 Click here to enlarge
    I wish I could give you a more technical explanation, but I just don't think I know the concept well enough to suffice. What I can do is tell you the benefits that I've personally had after having, stock tune, Evolve MAF Tune, and Evolve AlphaN Tune.

  17. #42
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    well said
    Thanks!!

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bigjae1976 Click here to enlarge
    Flip...99% of what I was looking for. So I'm still waiting for the last 1%...anytime now...Click here to enlarge

    But I get it now. So basically Alpha-N is mostly pointless until you get the CSL style airbox. On the "flip"side, getting the CSL style box and not getting Alpha-N leaves some gains on the table and is not required.

    Going OT...but I had wanted to do headers and a 3.5" BW style exhaust with the software. Then at some point add the CSL box. So I am trying to figure out if software with the exhaust system will be a total waste.

    Thanks!
    Great to know the post served some benefit Click here to enlarge

    Unfortunately, you cannot run a CSL style airbox unless you delete the MAF because of the volume of air and size of air. There is no MAF for the S54 that can meter anything like that.

    There are CF Airboxes out there that are MAF-compatible. But they are restricted to a very small cone filter, which totally negates the gains of an Airbox to begin with. The CSL Airbox works so well because of the massive potential of volume of cold air you can shove into the lovely inline-6.

    Truth is, at the end of the day, moving to a bigger CF Airbox/AlphaN will provide a small fraction of gains additionally compared to what a proper refined tune can. Depending on what supporting modifications you have, I think the Evolve and CSL Airbox with an AlphaN would be good for an extra 5-10whp. 5whp being if you have very street friendly modifications and restrictive exhaust, 10whp if you start adding the big stuff like the BW 3.5".

    As I'm sure you know, it's about the harmony of parts you have with this NA stuff and making what you have work as well as you can. If you baseline at an average 280whp, then with headers, BW 3.5", and tune should give you about 320-330whp provided your car is running healthy and efficient. If you then add a CF Airbox/AlphaN to the mix, I could see you gaining 10whp throughout the powerband.

    Is it worth getting a tune twice for different stages of your build?...I think that depends on what your application is.

    Are you just tracking for fun or are you getting competitive?

    There are some tuners that just charge you the difference between the two stages of tune, so maybe you can inquire about that as well which is rather an attractive benefit.
    2002 E46 M3 6MT | Jet Black . Black Nappa | My GermanBoost Build Thread
    2009 E90 M3 DCT | Melbourne Red . Speed Cloth

  18. #43
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by flipm3 Click here to enlarge
    I wish I could give you a more technical explanation, but I just don't think I know the concept well enough to suffice. What I can do is tell you the benefits that I've personally had after having, stock tune, Evolve MAF Tune, and Evolve AlphaN Tune.

    First thing is that I am now able to use an Airbox that has much more massive air flow that the stock MAF is not capable of metering. The nice perk is that I get to use a sexy CF Airbox that sounds out of this world when paired with the S54B32.

    Second thing I noticed is the feel of the throttle. Evolve has done a pretty darn good job with their throttle mapping for both MAF and AlphaN. With AlphaN, it took what I felt with the MAF tune to another level. This is the only car I've ever driven that is as close to throttle-cable setup. It feel as if the amount of throttle input I induce is in a 1:1 relationship with what the throttle bodies do. So what I noticed on the street is much more predictable, manageable, and natural throttle control. Whether it be heal-toe, holding throttle around a turn, on-off throttle transitions....it's just instantaneous, yet smooth and predictable.

    With the MSS54, there is an integrated barometric sensor. So despite the extremes in weather condition and slight deviation in elevation that I confront, my car has never skipped a beat. It has driven 100% reliable and predictable in literally all four season with a drastically wide range of temperature.

    Another nice perk of deleting the MAF is that now I can relocate the IAT sensor to somewhere that is more accurate and consistent in reading. In the stock S54B32 MAF, the IAT is integrated within the MAF sensor. The problem is that the MAF has a tendency to heat soak, tricking the IAT into thinking that the temps are higher than they really are. This is not very ideal for power output and consistency. With the MAF delete, I now use a IAT relocation sensor. Evolve has scaled the IAT within the DME maps to read 100% accurate and precise. With my own data logging and when up to speed, my IATs are always within a few degrees of ambient. In my opinion, this just shows how reliable and consistent both Evolve's Intake is and their choice of IAT location.

    So AlphaN as a whole gives you the opportunity to experience a few small things here and there, that overall can have a nice change in the driving experience.

    Hopefully that helps share one side of the story. If you have any specific questions, I'd definitely be willing to be as helpful as I can.
    It's pretty cool when my own forum can blow me away with awesomeness still. Nice post.

  19. #44
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    OK, got it. Its mostly a HPDE car, nothing competitive, that will still be streetable...barely. I LOVE the sound of the CSL box and want something close to it. With that, I know that this is more of an enjoyment mod than a performance one.

    The last concern I have right now is the safety of Alpha-N. The car will see the severe stress dished out by my right foot. So I do not want to add any reliability concerns or complicate maintenance tasks.

    The maintenance piece was 50% of the reason I parted my 330 out. It had so much crap bolted on in the engine bay that it was such an f'ing whore to do anything. I dreaded opening the hood.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by flipm3 Click here to enlarge
    Thanks!!


    Great to know the post served some benefit Click here to enlarge

    Unfortunately, you cannot run a CSL style airbox unless you delete the MAF because of the volume of air and size of air. There is no MAF for the S54 that can meter anything like that.

    There are CF Airboxes out there that are MAF-compatible. But they are restricted to a very small cone filter, which totally negates the gains of an Airbox to begin with. The CSL Airbox works so well because of the massive potential of volume of cold air you can shove into the lovely inline-6.

    Truth is, at the end of the day, moving to a bigger CF Airbox/AlphaN will provide a small fraction of gains additionally compared to what a proper refined tune can. Depending on what supporting modifications you have, I think the Evolve and CSL Airbox with an AlphaN would be good for an extra 5-10whp. 5whp being if you have very street friendly modifications and restrictive exhaust, 10whp if you start adding the big stuff like the BW 3.5".

    As I'm sure you know, it's about the harmony of parts you have with this NA stuff and making what you have work as well as you can. If you baseline at an average 280whp, then with headers, BW 3.5", and tune should give you about 320-330whp provided your car is running healthy and efficient. If you then add a CF Airbox/AlphaN to the mix, I could see you gaining 10whp throughout the powerband.

    Is it worth getting a tune twice for different stages of your build?...I think that depends on what your application is.

    Are you just tracking for fun or are you getting competitive?

    There are some tuners that just charge you the difference between the two stages of tune, so maybe you can inquire about that as well which is rather an attractive benefit.

  20. #45
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    It's pretty cool when my own forum can blow me with awesomeness still. Nice post.
    Thanks!!! Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bigjae1976 Click here to enlarge
    OK, got it. Its mostly a HPDE car, nothing competitive, that will still be streetable...barely. I LOVE the sound of the CSL box and want something close to it. With that, I know that this is more of an enjoyment mod than a performance one.

    The last concern I have right now is the safety of Alpha-N. The car will see the severe stress dished out by my right foot. So I do not want to add any reliability concerns or complicate maintenance tasks.

    The maintenance piece was 50% of the reason I parted my 330 out. It had so much crap bolted on in the engine bay that it was such an f'ing whore to do anything. I dreaded opening the hood.
    Oh the CF Airbox induction roar is marvelous.

    You bring up a great point about reliability and safety. That's the beauty of AlphaN! It's simply just one less thing to worry about, in the sense that your MAF won't crap out on you, and be forced to run in a really crappy pig rich state if it does. As long as you have a properly tuned AlphaN car, your car will be 100% reliable. It's a matter of choosing someone to tune your car safely and consistently. Evolve Automotive and Epic Motorsports have been tuning E46 M3 competitive race cars all over the world for awhile now. Some choose to turn off safety parameters, while others don't. But as I said, as long as your car is dialed out properly on the dyno, you should have zero problems pertaining to the tune.

    I definitely know what you mean! It's a tough balance between wanting as much power as possible, but maintaining reliability. So do you have an E46 M3 now?
    2002 E46 M3 6MT | Jet Black . Black Nappa | My GermanBoost Build Thread
    2009 E90 M3 DCT | Melbourne Red . Speed Cloth

  21. #46
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    Yup and thanks!

    So what's the procedure for Evolve? Remote tuning? What kind of data do they require to make adjustments to the tune?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bigjae1976 Click here to enlarge
    This is probably a stupid question. What is the advantage of Alpha-N...especially in a car that sees mostly track time?
    Almost every n/a race car runs Alpha-N.

    Alpha-N is just a calculation of the airflow(instead of measuring it via MAF) using throttle position(Alpha) against engine RPM(N).

    The CSL runs Alpha-N from the factory due to the airbox.
    Also the S65 runs Alpha-N from the factory.

    Alpha-N does not gain power by itself,this is what the power mapping does.

    With Alpha-N the biggest difference is the throttle response as it is like on an engine with throttle cable.
    Plus no worries about the MAF sensor anymore.
    Almost no customer buys the power mapping only,but the Alpha-N as well.
    Same power mapping with MAF connected and then running Alpha-N is a big difference in throttle response.Well worth the bit extra money.

    All the Evolve tunes and Alpha-N tunes are tested in various conditions from cold Scandinavian winters to hot desert climates and from sea level to high altitudes.
    Many of the cars see regular track use and some of the S54 powered cars with Evolve Alpha-N are dedicated track toys.
    Zero issues with tracking them.

    If you are in NA and want the Evolve tune,contact: jamie@rkautowerks.com
    For rest of the world,contact:rizwan@evolveautomotive.com


    The process is easy,you get the Evolve-R
    cable,download the file of your stock car,email it to Evolve and load the tuned file back in the car.

    @alex:

    Did you get ever the cam timing checked on your S54?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by S62R Click here to enlarge
    The CSL runs Alpha-N from the factory due to the airbox.
    I believe this is incorrect, this is what I thought as well.

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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by S62R Click here to enlarge
    Almost every n/a race car runs Alpha-N.

    Alpha-N is just a calculation of the airflow(instead of measuring it via MAF) using throttle position(Alpha) against engine RPM(N).

    The CSL runs Alpha-N from the factory due to the airbox.
    Also the S65 runs Alpha-N from the factory.

    Alpha-N does not gain power by itself,this is what the power mapping does.

    With Alpha-N the biggest difference is the throttle response as it is like on an engine with throttle cable.
    Plus no worries about the MAF sensor anymore.
    Almost no customer buys the power mapping only,but the Alpha-N as well.
    Same power mapping with MAF connected and then running Alpha-N is a big difference in throttle response.Well worth the bit extra money.

    All the Evolve tunes and Alpha-N tunes are tested in various conditions from cold Scandinavian winters to hot desert climates and from sea level to high altitudes.
    Many of the cars see regular track use and some of the S54 powered cars with Evolve Alpha-N are dedicated track toys.
    Zero issues with tracking them.

    If you are in NA and want the Evolve tune,contact: jamie@rkautowerks.com
    For rest of the world,contact:rizwan@evolveautomotive.com


    The process is easy,you get the Evolve-R
    cable,download the file of your stock car,email it to Evolve and load the tuned file back in the car.

    @alex :

    Did you get ever the cam timing checked on your S54?
    Great post man! All solid information.

    I personally haven't checked my own timing, but it will be done very shortly during my next valve adjustment...and then some Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
    I believe this is incorrect, this is what I thought as well.
    @Sticky...I actually stand partially corrected. After further recent research, it seems like the CSL runs a hybrid MAP/AlphaN. I don't recall the exact values, but I believe that MAP sensor is only good up to a certain value of pressure/load, but after that pressure value, the DME may potentially revert to full AlphaN. Forgive me for my very rudimentary and vague response. I have much more to educate myself on, so I'd rather not give false information.

    @evolve and @S62R might be able to further explain. Looks like we were both right, haha...its both MAP and AlphaN.
    2002 E46 M3 6MT | Jet Black . Black Nappa | My GermanBoost Build Thread
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by S62R Click here to enlarge
    Almost every n/a race car runs Alpha-N.

    Alpha-N is just a calculation of the airflow(instead of measuring it via MAF) using throttle position(Alpha) against engine RPM(N).

    The CSL runs Alpha-N from the factory due to the airbox.
    Also the S65 runs Alpha-N from the factory.

    Alpha-N does not gain power by itself,this is what the power mapping does.

    With Alpha-N the biggest difference is the throttle response as it is like on an engine with throttle cable.
    Plus no worries about the MAF sensor anymore.
    Almost no customer buys the power mapping only,but the Alpha-N as well.
    Same power mapping with MAF connected and then running Alpha-N is a big difference in throttle response.Well worth the bit extra money.

    All the Evolve tunes and Alpha-N tunes are tested in various conditions from cold Scandinavian winters to hot desert climates and from sea level to high altitudes.
    Many of the cars see regular track use and some of the S54 powered cars with Evolve Alpha-N are dedicated track toys.
    Zero issues with tracking them.

    If you are in NA and want the Evolve tune,contact: jamie@rkautowerks.com
    For rest of the world,contact:rizwan@evolveautomotive.com


    The process is easy,you get the Evolve-R
    cable,download the file of your stock car,email it to Evolve and load the tuned file back in the car.

    @alex :

    Did you get ever the cam timing checked on your S54?
    OK, thanks! That was the exact explanation I was looking for. That's what I remembered but wasn't sure and couldn't find it. Right now, got so much other crap to deal with. As things calm down, I'll be calling Evolve to get some more info.

    Thanks! Kind of a thread jack...my bad.

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