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  1. #201
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    it is a lot of math. energy density of meth is like 50% of gas. I think the % if figuring 100% meth at 1500ml/min would be no more than 20% subsequent fueling from meth. Anyway you are still very close to gasoline equiv volume if not flowing more. So in theory race gas should be no prob... their pumps seem to be working. Very curious to see Terry's test results.

  2. #202
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    If you do E85 only for twins you can cover it no meth with upgraded HPFP, new lines, and parallel the stock pump with an E85 pump. Or you may be able to do it without upgrading lines, but then you probably need to parallel a pair of Walbros and maybe over volt them. Not sure. You won't do it on a series setup using Walbros though, that's for sure, they don't flow enough independently and series won't increase flow past the max either can do.

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    2 out of 2 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    This from page one of a DSM forum fuel pump discussion, different pumps. I said it before and I'll say it again. ALL THIS HAS BEEN DONE. We basically have it easy street, copy what has worked on other platforms. Looks like I will prob be doing one in-tank, one external in parallel. Your Welcome


    Click here to enlarge
    Last edited by Tony@VargasTurboTech; 01-11-2013 at 08:49 PM.

  4. #204
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    Different pumps but interesting results. Running two Walbro 255 pumps in series gave only a 20% flow improved at 70psi over the single Walbro 255 pump. While running them in parallel resulted in a 100% flow increase over the single pump. Click here to enlarge
    Burger Motorsports
    Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, N63s, S55s, and S63s!

    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  5. #205
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Different pumps but interesting results. Running two Walbro 255 pumps in series gave only a 20% flow improved at 70psi over the single Walbro 255 pump. While running them in parallel resulted in a 100% flow increase over the single pump. Click here to enlarge
    Terry, yeah its pretty impressive. I think I am going to run parallel. You will be seeing the car so we can see how it works once I get it there.

  6. #206
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    We could run 10 low pressure pumps but until we get a higher flowing HPFP I don't think it will matter much. But one option is to replace the regulator with an aftermarket and get pressure at the high pressure inlet up to say 90 or 100psi. We could reference it on boost just like the "old days" so the pumps only need to work hard when the fuel is needed.
    Burger Motorsports
    Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, N63s, S55s, and S63s!

    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  7. #207
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    We could run 10 low pressure pumps but until we get a higher flowing HPFP I don't think it will matter much. But one option is to replace the regulator with an aftermarket and get pressure at the high pressure inlet up to say 90 or 100psi. We could reference it on boost just like the "old days" so the pumps only need to work hard when the fuel is needed.
    Have we 100% found the limits of the HPFP? If were not 100% sure I don't want to start swapping stuff out yet. Would like to run it and see where we max out at.

  8. #208
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    Once you get it up and running then monitor low fuel pressure and high fuel pressure. If low fuel pressure is at 72psi but high fuel pressure is dropping, then you are at the limit of your high pressure pump. We've found even stock turbos running E85 can max out the high pressure pump in the midrange @ 12:1. It's around 500wtq.
    Burger Motorsports
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  9. #209
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
    Have we 100% found the limits of the HPFP? If were not 100% sure I don't want to start swapping stuff out yet. Would like to run it and see where we max out at.
    Terry and Tony.

    Do work.




  10. #210
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Once you get it up and running then monitor low fuel pressure and high fuel pressure. If low fuel pressure is at 72psi but high fuel pressure is dropping, then you are at the limit of your high pressure pump. We've found even stock turbos running E85 can max out the high pressure pump in the midrange @ 12:1. It's around 500wtq.
    Gotcha, so they are getting around this by dumping meth into the cylinders. Not the way things need to be heading, we need to address the fueling issue instead of band aiding it. I tried to contact a HPFP company twice, no response.

  11. #211
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    Meth is the major work around right now. I personally don't have a problem with that. But to run straight E85 no meth and support big power more fuel system innovation than what is currently being done will be needed.
    Burger Motorsports
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  12. #212
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Different pumps but interesting results. Running two Walbro 255 pumps in series gave only a 20% flow improved at 70psi over the single Walbro 255 pump. While running them in parallel resulted in a 100% flow increase over the single pump. Click here to enlarge
    That's what I've been trying to say forever! Haha. The funny thing is going to be when we see a 450lph sucking through a 255lph. These pumps are matched, which is the ideal for series pumps working on an incompressible fluid. What this study probably doesn't include is restriction in the line and upstream, but we are talking benefits in the 20% range, it isn't going to make a huge diff. Glad this data is up.

  13. #213
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
    That's what I've been trying to say forever! Haha. The funny thing is going to be when we see a 450lph sucking through a 255lph. These pumps are matched, which is the ideal for series pumps working on an incompressible fluid. What this study probably doesn't include is restriction in the line and upstream, but we are talking benefits in the 20% range, it isn't going to make a huge diff. Glad this data is up.
    Those results will be interesting! It will be funny if you're right on this. I honestly am not sure how the test will turn out. Click here to enlarge
    Last edited by Terry@BMS; 01-12-2013 at 02:04 AM.
    Burger Motorsports
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  14. #214
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    It appears that the price has dropped to $395 now. http://procedetuning.com/BMW/n54/sty...-22/index.html

  15. #215
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    I see the kit contains "mourning" hardware..
    Click here to enlarge

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    And a Walbro 400.

  17. #217
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Someone needs to create a post on E90 about the new pricing, with a "brought to you by bimmerboost & Terry@BMS - you're welcome"
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

    Click here to enlarge

  18. #218
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lulz_m3 Click here to enlarge
    Someone needs to create a post on E90 about the new pricing, with a "brought to you by bimmerboost & Terry@BMS - you're welcome"
    lol funny they lowered the price & went to a lower volume pump. In my testing this pump looked promising and is only $95 shipped, no special hardware needed.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Walbro-GSL39...75505d&vxp=mtr
    Burger Motorsports
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TCW Click here to enlarge
    And a Walbro 400.
    Correct myself, they are comparing it to a Walbro 400. I don't see where it is specified the pump that they use.

  20. #220
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    lol funny they lowered the price & went to a lower volume pump. In my testing this pump looked promising and is only $95 shipped, no special hardware needed.http://www.ebay.com/itm/Walbro-GSL39...75505d&vxp=mtr
    Terry, Is this pump adequate for running a decent mix of e85 and not maxing trims? is this all that is needed?
    2007 335i (100% stock with mods)

    N54 is not a German 2JZ lol

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    Now its back to $595...what the hell it was $395 an hour ago???

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
    Terry, Is this pump adequate for running a decent mix of e85 and not maxing trims? is this all that is needed?
    Fuel pumps have nothing to do with fuel trims. But, it's an upgrade over the stock pump. I think it will be more than good enough for those who are dropping low fuel pressure under heavy E85 mixtures.
    Burger Motorsports
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  23. #223
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bmw335iguy Click here to enlarge
    Now its back to $595...what the hell it was $395 an hour ago???
    lol, I thought it was 40% over priced even @ $395. Click here to enlarge
    Burger Motorsports
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    It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please see http://www.burgertuning.com/emissions_info.html for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.

  24. #224
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Ferruccio Click here to enlarge
    I have the Flex Fuel kit installed, and I really do like it! It's nice not having to get the ratios just right (though, I'm sure that the right ratios perform extremely well on other systems, too.). I'm wondering whether this system would work with a swapped pump. I'm certainly willing to do some further testing of my own, especially given how crazily easy it is to access the fuel pump.
    Does anyone know HOW the Vishnu/FFTEC FlexFuel sensor even works with the tune/DME?? Reason why I ask is because Shiv has advertised the FlexFuel sensor as the "miracle solution" and that you'll never have to know what the ethanol content is because the tune will automatically adjust the fueling, timing & boost for the different ethanol levels. BUT it's not like Shiv is mimicking the ProEFI approach & creating (and this is where I could be wrong) an 91/93 octane tune & then a pure E85 tune and letting the PROcede adjust accordingly to the ethanol concentration.
    COBB AP ProTune by Bren of ///Bren Tuning
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  25. #225
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Does anyone know HOW the Vishnu/FFTEC FlexFuel sensor even works with the tune/DME?? Reason why I ask is because Shiv has advertised the FlexFuel sensor as the "miracle solution" and that you'll never have to know what the ethanol content is because the tune will automatically adjust the fueling, timing & boost for the different ethanol levels. BUT it's not like Shiv is mimicking the ProEFI approach & creating (and this is where I could be wrong) an 91/93 octane tune & then a pure E85 tune and letting the PROcede adjust accordingly to the ethanol concentration.

    I'm confused. Are you asking me how the product is made? How much information do you want? Do you want a source code? I am unaware of what ProEFI is, so, I apologize if I am not completely understanding what you want from me. I do not think I will be able to tell you which leads connect to what between the Siemens fuel sensor and the piggyback. But, there are DIY installation instructions available. That might give you an idea as to how it is done. You can also call up FFTEC, who has used similar methods to tune other vehicles long before the Vishnu method. It seems like it was a collaboration between both people.

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