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  1. #276
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    Sick dude.! I like the JDM flare. Glad to hear you are going with the jb4, you are paving the way for many to follow.

  2. #277
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    There will be no jb4 on this car. Boost control will be done via external boost controller. It's just easier. The car will be tuned using a Cobb flash.

  3. #278
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BoostAddict Click here to enlarge
    There will be no jb4 on this car. Boost control will be done via external boost controller. It's just easier. The car will be tuned using a Cobb flash.
    Not a bad idea. Flat boost level across the board or what? Can a controller set up a curve?
    Click here to enlarge

  4. #279
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    2 out of 2 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Eric335 Click here to enlarge
    Not a bad idea. Flat boost level across the board or what? Can a controller set up a curve?
    For now a flat curve. With an electronic boost controller we'll able to shape our own. At this point the plan is to just tune this thing on wastegate pressure and let Dan enjoy the car. He hasn't driven it since November so I'm sure he's ready too. The limiting factory now is the trans more than anything. What we've talked about is getting the Vargas fuel system upgrade and tuning for 100% e85 on 1 bar and see what happens.

  5. #280
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BoostAddict Click here to enlarge
    He hasn't driven it since November so I'm sure he's ready too.
    SMH, I bet Sticky feels the same way after 3 years and counting.

  6. #281
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by RnmEvo9 Click here to enlarge
    SMH, I bet Sticky feels the same way after 3 years and counting.
    +1

  7. #282
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    u should run an Apexi SAFC w/ vortech FMU and greddy profec b spec 2

  8. #283
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TurboSid Click here to enlarge
    u should run an Apexi SAFC w/ vortech FMU and greddy profec b spec 2
    Lmao

  9. #284
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BoostAddict Click here to enlarge
    Lmao
    Happy 800th birthday

  10. #285
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BoostAddict Click here to enlarge
    There will be no jb4 on this car. Boost control will be done via external boost controller. It's just easier. The car will be tuned using a Cobb flash.
    Best of luck with that. I'll be here waiting when it doesn't work. Click here to enlarge
    Burger Motorsports
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  11. #286
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    We aren't interested in committing to any tuner. All it does is stir up drama, and condescending posts. No offense T, but it just creates issues in the community since everybody is so hostile. Terry, Shiv, and Dzenno have all reached out to help in the project, and this is all greatly appreciated. The main issue here is lack of user adjustability. Letting one of you guys tune it means we have very little control over anything. Dan is a tinkerer, and has certain goals. Making changes on the fly is a must. If letting the dme control everything except boost doesn't work we'll obviously revisit our options. But as of now we are going to try. I bet it would benefit the community greatly to see if it works. In the end the goal is to have fun, and enjoy cars. Not be part of a war. And saying it can't be done, well that's just motivation to try harder, so I appreciate the support Click here to enlarge

  12. #287
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    love your exhaust
    Click here to enlarge

  13. #288
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BoostAddict Click here to enlarge
    We aren't interested in committing to any tuner. All it does is stir up drama, and condescending posts. No offense T, but it just creates issues in the community since everybody is so hostile. Terry, Shiv, and Dzenno have all reached out to help in the project, and this is all greatly appreciated. The main issue here is lack of user adjustability. Letting one of you guys tune it means we have very little control over anything. Dan is a tinkerer, and has certain goals. Making changes on the fly is a must. If letting the dme control everything except boost doesn't work we'll obviously revisit our options. But as of now we are going to try. I bet it would benefit the community greatly to see if it works. In the end the goal is to have fun, and enjoy cars. Not be part of a war. And saying it can't be done, well that's just motivation to try harder, so I appreciate the support Click here to enlarge
    No offense taken. Dan had previously told me he was going to ship the car out so we could develop JB4 single turbo boost control for it. Which I was happy to do for him as he's been with us a long time. Nothing to do with your kit or being your tuner. Just tuning Dan's car. The plan was to use a version of our back end flash for fueling, timing, and VANOS, and then the JB4 for boost and throttle control. The first part is easy. Second part is difficult. Especially so with an automatic. Both the flash and the JB4 mapping would be open for anyone who wanted to make changes. As I told Dan I'd have to have the car in front of me for a period of time to even attempt the boost control on it. Not the sort of thing I would want to work on remotely. So if he is in a hurry to get it running then this would not work for him anyway.

    There are some options for trying to tune it without a JB4 or a procede but they are not very desirable. Normally I'm not one to go around $#@!-caning people's ideas. But, I do design control systems for the N54. So it's something I've given a bit of thought. The easiest option really would just be to have Shiv do the piggyback tuning as he has it mostly working already via the procede. Then do the flash side yourself. If he has offered I would take him up on it at least to get the kit running. But, working with Shiv is a bit like doing business with the devil. There is always a price to be paid at some point. Click here to enlarge
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  14. #289
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    No offense taken. Dan had previously told me he was going to ship the car out so we could develop JB4 single turbo boost control for it. Which I was happy to do for him as he's been with us a long time. Nothing to do with your kit or being your tuner. Just tuning Dan's car. The plan was to use a version of our back end flash for fueling, timing, and VANOS, and then the JB4 for boost and throttle control. The first part is easy. Second part is difficult. Especially so with an automatic. Both the flash and the JB4 mapping would be open for anyone who wanted to make changes. As I told Dan I'd have to have the car in front of me for a period of time to even attempt the boost control on it. Not the sort of thing I would want to work on remotely. So if he is in a hurry to get it running then this would not work for him anyway.

    There are some options for trying to tune it without a JB4 or a procede but they are not very desirable. Normally I'm not one to go around $#@!-caning people's ideas. But, I do design control systems for the N54. So it's something I've given a bit of thought. The easiest option really would just be to have Shiv do the piggyback tuning as he has it mostly working already via the procede. Then do the flash side yourself. If he has offered I would take him up on it at least to get the kit running. But, working with Shiv is a bit like doing business with the devil. There is always a price to be paid at some point. Click here to enlarge
    The car still could end up at your place as that was the original plan. But first we want to try something's. If all else fails I think we'll run the car like eleventeen is and in that case we would use the bms flash. Don't worry you'll be the first to know if it doesn't work. I think trying to push the car on the stock auto is kind of a waste of time. Hopefully the alpina flash buys the tranny some time.

  15. #290
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BoostAddict Click here to enlarge
    The car still could end up at your place as that was the original plan. But first we want to try something's. If all else fails I think we'll run the car like eleventeen is and in that case we would use the bms flash. Don't worry you'll be the first to know if it doesn't work. I think trying to push the car on the stock auto is kind of a waste of time. Hopefully the alpina flash buys the tranny some time.
    drop VB ship to level 10, that would buy a bit more time as well.
    Click here to enlarge
    Instagram: Sammy0559
    VTX3's Click here to enlarge
    Got one more tow with AAA lets make it count Click here to enlarge

  16. #291
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    This thread got more interesting with the tuning. PS that single exhaust is $#@!ing badass!
    Burger Motorsports
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  17. #292
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    Sweet! Car looks great, I like that you're doing your own thing here and seeing where it lands you. Lots of good ideas come out of that sort of thinking. Nice work.

  18. #293
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    Freakin sick man! mad props.

  19. #294
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    Love the exhaust work! The turbo porn is cool too Click here to enlarge

  20. #295
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BoostAddict Click here to enlarge
    The car still could end up at your place as that was the original plan. But first we want to try something's. If all else fails I think we'll run the car like eleventeen is and in that case we would use the bms flash. Don't worry you'll be the first to know if it doesn't work. I think trying to push the car on the stock auto is kind of a waste of time. Hopefully the alpina flash buys the tranny some time.
    If you tell me what you are planning I'll tell you whether or not it will work. The best option I could come up with for tuning a single with a stand alone boost controller was to basically allow the DME to operate in a perpetual state of 30FE/3100 over boost limp mode. You'd do this by setting the load targets to basically zero. You'd also need to zero out the throttle tables so it can't close the throttle when boost goes over that target. Since the DME is not controlling boost you'd continue to target whatever boost you have the EBC set to, the DME mapping *should* all function normally, and you'll just have to ignore the Christmas tree dash. The trade off other than all the codes in dash is you loose throttle control. That throttle control is pretty huge for controlling boost especially with automatics but maybe if boost is low enough like 12psi you can get away with it for awhile. You're just going to get big shift spikes. There are also unknown variables like how the trans will react to actual torque being over target torque. It may also limp out. The DME may decide to fight it by dropping advance negative also. A variation on this might be to set the load targets all higher than or close to target and instead have a perpetual 30FF/3100 code state. But remember when 3100 triggers target drops to 0 anyway. So I think its best to have it always in 3100. Maybe a third option is just to leave some unimportant sensor unplugged so it can never come out of 3100 mode for consistency. Any way you handle it you'll have an ugly but drivable setup.

    If you want to do it without the JB4 running boost but still using a JB4, it's going to be a lot cleaner. Just not ideal compared to the JB4 running boost. In this scnerio you do the flash tuning with close to realistic load targets. Do the timing, fuel, and VANOS tuning via the flash. Then you throw the JB4 in the mix and set map 6 to your EBC boost target + 1/2 psi. Say 16.5psi across the board. Then you set the EBC to say 16psi. No lights in dash, everything runs/operates normally. But the EBC is controlling boost. If boost goes over 16.5psi the JB4 will then also proportionally closes the throttle for you. The trade off here is a stand alone EBC can't control boost as well as a fully integrated system like the JB4 can (provided we were to write that code for it), but at least you will have some throttle safety, gauges in dash, no codes, and avoid all the DME and torque management related issues. A couple other guys are running in this configuration currently waiting for us to write the JB4 single turbo boost control code.
    Last edited by Terry@BMS; 04-23-2013 at 01:06 PM.
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  21. #296
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    At this point everything is theoretical. I have a couple different ideas. We'll discuss further when the car is ready to be tuned.

  22. #297
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    What's wrong with mapping the flash based on turbo spool... of course this changes with conditions, gear, etc, but potentially the variances won't be enough to throw a code. This way piggy works as it always has, except for working with an EBC now.

  23. #298
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    What's wrong with mapping the flash based on turbo spool... of course this changes with conditions, gear, etc, but potentially the variances won't be enough to throw a code. This way piggy works as it always has, except for working with an EBC now.
    If you leave a piggy in place its workable. It's being done now. But with the piggyback not controlling boost throttle management and overall boost control suffer. It's probably fine at 12psi because who cares if it spikes to 16psi for a moment or if the throttle over compensates because it's not directly in the loop but if you are trying to run 28psi that is another story all together. Automatic shifting is a big part of the boost control routine. As I said above there are a few non-ideal options but the best option is an integrated piggyback running point / fine tuning with a back end flash for base fuel, timing, and VANOS. Running a piggy as I described above is also workable. Running without a piggy is going to be ugly unless Cobb steps up and reworks a bunch of code. The problem with the ideal option is the JB4 code to run that way doesn't exist yet and won't exist until I get a local single turbo car for a week or two. So the only currently available option is Shiv and I'm not entirely sure he has all his bugs worked out or would want to support a non-FFTEC single turbo project. Realistically a JB4 or procede is not going to cost much more than a good EBC anyway and will be easier to install with better functionality so it will likely go that route eventually whether they want to or not. It's just a matter of the code being written. And as they pointed out until the auto trans are built up its a bit moot anyway.

    Typing all that has be thinking, what is happening with part throttle boost transitions on these big singles? Has anyone with a single turbo kit posted any part throttle step logs?
    Last edited by Terry@BMS; 04-23-2013 at 02:29 PM.
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  24. #299
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    Ok, I wasnít thinking of part throttle (<WG default pressure)Ö maybe you could use a very low pressure WG <10psi and have less dependence on throttle plate
    And
    -Flash / piggy work as they have
    -Piggy controls DC bleed of pressure to WG, which I assume is DC of EBC although I have never used one.
    -Piggy frequency out / WG tables would have to be altered to work with new boost control setup.

    Maybe Iím missing something

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    A n54 piggyback can relatively easily be tuned to run a single turbo. He wants to use an electronic boost controller without an n54 specific piggyback.
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