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    Fuel Mixture Codes, help?

    Hey guys, was wondering if anyone here has ever had the following issue:

    29E0/29E1 Fuel Mixture Bank 1 / 2 (system too lean). These also came with a front O2 sensor failure code (don't remember what it was), replaced front O2 sensor bank 2, code never came back.

    Car is on stock map, no piggyback, no flash. FBO, fully catless. I searched on the other forum and found that the DP fix / Procede O2 sim is the common denominator for these specific codes.

    I do have the BMS DP Fix installed (for emissions) and I was wondering if I should increase the strength of the DP fix to make these codes go away? Should I reset O2 / lambda adaptations after increasing the fix strength?

    Thanks in advance.

    edit - this is on 93 octane pump gas, not E85 related.
    Last edited by themyst; 12-20-2012 at 10:48 PM.

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    bump

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    So just to be clear, you were seeing 29E0/29E1 and an O2 sensor failure code, you changed bank 2 wide band, and now you only see 29E0/29E1?

    From what I understand, the secondary sensor is a narrow band type, so the output should fluctuate between 0.2 (lean) and 0.8 volts (rich), with 0.45 volts representing a stoichiometric mixture.

    I suspect the DP fix is an oscillator, and the adjustment changes the duty cycle. A duty cycle above 50% would represent an average rich condition, and a duty cycle below 50% would be an average lean condition. See http://mechdb.com/index.php/O2_sensor_simulator

    If the secondary sensor is used as a long term monitor of the AFR, then it could cause the code you are seeing.

    I can't recommend an ideal setting, because I have never measured the signal coming from the sensor with stock downpipes myself. However, it is free to make the adjustment, and will only throw a code if you get it wrong. I would reset adaptations after each adjustment is made. I would start by resetting adaptations without making any adjustment, but I suspect you have already done that.

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    FWIW I've only seen those mixture codes on E85 mixes. I'd remove the DPFIX to verify you only get 29F4/29F5 codes. But I suppose it being set too strong is a possibility.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ajm8127 Click here to enlarge
    So just to be clear, you were seeing 29E0/29E1 and an O2 sensor failure code, you changed bank 2 wide band, and now you only see 29E0/29E1?

    From what I understand, the secondary sensor is a narrow band type, so the output should fluctuate between 0.2 (lean) and 0.8 volts (rich), with 0.45 volts representing a stoichiometric mixture.

    I suspect the DP fix is an oscillator, and the adjustment changes the duty cycle. A duty cycle above 50% would represent an average rich condition, and a duty cycle below 50% would be an average lean condition. See http://mechdb.com/index.php/O2_sensor_simulator

    If the secondary sensor is used as a long term monitor of the AFR, then it could cause the code you are seeing.

    I can't recommend an ideal setting, because I have never measured the signal coming from the sensor with stock downpipes myself. However, it is free to make the adjustment, and will only throw a code if you get it wrong. I would reset adaptations after each adjustment is made. I would start by resetting adaptations without making any adjustment, but I suspect you have already done that.
    To be honest I never reset any adaptations until last night. Will report back after 50-60 miles to check if 1. My obd monitors are all ready for emissions and 2. Those mixture codes come back.

    Fwiw I was running 50% E85 blend for a very long time before switching back over to only pump gas.

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    I wish you luck figuring out your problems. Are you ever going to spill the beans as why you had to return your car back to stock for "major warrenty repairs" as you put it? Have you put the rb's back on yet? Inquiring minds want to know!

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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    fwiw, i've had these codes (29E1 and 29E0) for ages on pump gas, long before using E85. i've replaced the pre-cat O2 sensors, cleared adaptations, adjusted the O2 sims. they would reappear every few weeks or so, depending on my driving (usually during sustained throttle input on a highway around 60-80 mph).

    recently, i had all 6 injectors and spark plugs replaced, and they still reappeared the other day. i'm at a loss. Click here to enlarge

    the one and only thing I haven't done was remove the O2 sims altogether. using Cobb stage 2+ and inspection not due for another year and a half, i should give that a shot.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by danniexi Click here to enlarge
    fwiw, i've had these codes (29E1 and 29E0) for ages on pump gas, long before using E85. i've replaced the pre-cat O2 sensors, cleared adaptations, adjusted the O2 sims. they would reappear every few weeks or so, depending on my driving (usually during sustained throttle input on a highway around 60-80 mph).

    recently, i had all 6 injectors and spark plugs replaced, and they still reappeared the other day. i'm at a loss. Click here to enlarge

    the one and only thing I haven't done was remove the O2 sims altogether. using Cobb stage 2+ and inspection not due for another year and a half, i should give that a shot.
    I don't keep the dp fix installed after inspection cause it messes with AFRs a bit on a flash tune. If the adaptation reset doesn't fix it I guess I gotta get the inspection sticker the hard way.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    I don't keep the dp fix installed after inspection cause it messes with AFRs a bit on a flash tune.
    If that is correct then it adds validity to the thinking that the secondary O2 sensors do more than monitor the catalyst. I think I do remember you writing that in some other thread now.

    Also you said you just switched from E50 to E10. Do you think that could have something to do with it? And you just removed your flash tune? I would definitely try resetting the all adaptations before you do anything else.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ajm8127 Click here to enlarge
    If that is correct then it adds validity to the thinking that the secondary O2 sensors do more than monitor the catalyst. I think I do remember you writing that in some other thread now.

    Also you said you just switched from E50 to E10. Do you think that could have something to do with it? And you just removed your flash tune? I would definitely try resetting the all adaptations before you do anything else.
    Yes I tend to go richer than target running a flash tune with the dp fix. Oddly I am a touch too lean when dp fix is off. Weird stuff actually.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    Yes I tend to go richer than target running a flash tune with the dp fix.
    So this indicates to me the car thinks it is running lean when the DP fix is installed, which coincides with the codes you now have. I would definitely try to adjust it. Without a good meter able to measure duty cycle or an oscilloscope, you are shooting in the dark though, just trial and error. You don't even know which way turning the potentiometer adjusts the duty cycle. Maybe @Terry@BMS can help figure this out.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ajm8127 Click here to enlarge
    So this indicates to me the car thinks it is running lean when the DP fix is installed, which coincides with the codes you now have. I would definitely try to adjust it. Without a good meter able to measure duty cycle or an oscilloscope, you are shooting in the dark though, just trial and error. You don't even know which way turning the potentiometer adjusts the duty cycle. Maybe @Terry@BMS can help figure this out.
    The dial is adjustable for strength on the dp fix. Thanks for your insight!

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    Hey guys, was wondering if anyone here has ever had the following issue:

    29E0/29E1 Fuel Mixture Bank 1 / 2 (system too lean). These also came with a front O2 sensor failure code (don't remember what it was), replaced front O2 sensor bank 2, code never came back.

    Car is on stock map, no piggyback, no flash. FBO, fully catless. I searched on the other forum and found that the DP fix / Procede O2 sim is the common denominator for these specific codes.

    I do have the BMS DP Fix installed (for emissions) and I was wondering if I should increase the strength of the DP fix to make these codes go away? Should I reset O2 / lambda adaptations after increasing the fix strength?

    Thanks in advance.

    edit - this is on 93 octane pump gas, not E85 related.
    LPFP could be on it's last breath, since you used E85 for so long. The stealership can measure requested, and actual fuel pressures. FYI LPFP failure is sudden, and without warning. The result can be devastating engine damage, just do a search on E90shiv.com.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Turkeybaster115 Click here to enlarge
    LPFP could be on it's last breath, since you used E85 for so long. The stealership can measure requested, and actual fuel pressures. FYI LPFP failure is sudden, and without warning. The result can be devastating engine damage, just do a search on E90shiv.com.
    lol, it was about 4000 miles worth of use, varying between E30 to E50. 60 miles since adaptation reset, no mixture codes yet... need another 60 to make sure it's gone for good. Usually if the mixture codes and SES light pop up, they happen within 30-60 miles.

    I do have a 2AAF and DMTP-related code in memory though, but I'm not clearing it.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    lol, it was about 4000 miles worth of use, varying between E30 to E50. 60 miles since adaptation reset, no mixture codes yet... need another 60 to make sure it's gone for good. Usually if the mixture codes and SES light pop up, they happen within 30-60 miles.

    I do have a 2AAF and DMTP-related code in memory though, but I'm not clearing it.
    No need to lol. If you read the thread, I'm not the first one to suggest E85 related issues.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Turkeybaster115 Click here to enlarge
    No need to lol. If you read the thread, I'm not the first one to suggest E85 related issues.
    I am actually in agreement that the codes are possibly E85 related. I have seen a good crop of mixture code issues pop up lately, which coincides with the popularity rise of E85 itself. But I've also seen it attributed to the DP fix. I have a question though, if the car perceives itself as "lean", would I strengthen or weaken the DP fix? @Terry@BMS

    The odd part is, I haven't run E85 in well over a month, and reset all adaptations, so I'm flummoxed as to what's going on.

    Status update - The fuel mixture code came back in a "pending" state in INPA, but didn't trigger the SES light in well over 120 miles of driving since I reset adaptations.

    Once I pass inspection via less-than-legal means, I will keep messing with the DP fix to see if we can resolve these pesky fuel mixture code issues through that. I have a feeling we should increase the strength of the fix two steps to start and see what happens.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    I am actually in agreement that the codes are possibly E85 related. I have seen a good crop of mixture code issues pop up lately, which coincides with the popularity rise of E85 itself. But I've also seen it attributed to the DP fix. I have a question though, if the car perceives itself as "lean", would I strengthen or weaken the DP fix? @Terry@BMS

    The odd part is, I haven't run E85 in well over a month, and reset all adaptations, so I'm flummoxed as to what's going on.

    Status update - The fuel mixture code came back in a "pending" state in INPA, but didn't trigger the SES light in well over 120 miles of driving since I reset adaptations.

    Once I pass inspection via less-than-legal means, I will keep messing with the DP fix to see if we can resolve these pesky fuel mixture code issues through that. I have a feeling we should increase the strength of the fix two steps to start and see what happens.
    Well, first of all, I have the DPfix V3. Which version do you have? I get these types of codes, relating to fuel leaning, whenever, I do a day of racing (circuits) with 100 octane race gas. After clearing the codes though, they go away. My guess has always been that the vehicle is sensing that there is an issue with O2 levels, because of the way it's burning the oxygenated fuel. The combustion rate changes, and it uses this to determine that it's getting false information from the O2 sensors. Hope this helps.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Turkeybaster115 Click here to enlarge
    Well, first of all, I have the DPfix V3. Which version do you have? I get these types of codes, relating to fuel leaning, whenever, I do a day of racing (circuits) with 100 octane race gas. After clearing the codes though, they go away. My guess has always been that the vehicle is sensing that there is an issue with O2 levels, because of the way it's burning the oxygenated fuel. The combustion rate changes, and it uses this to determine that it's getting false information from the O2 sensors. Hope this helps.
    same, V3 with the adjustable dial.

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    any updates on a fix?

    I just got these codes last night, but using a E60 mixture and accelerating aggressively before the 160F oil temp mark. First time I ever seen a SES light on my car lol
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    If you just hook a DC volt meter to the output of the DP fix you should see a higher voltage when the duty cycle is also high (DC meters measure average voltage). So a higher average voltage would indicate a rich mixture. An average voltage of 0.5 should be a 50% duty cycle (assuming a 0.2 low level, and an 0.8 high level), or damn close. Make sure to read the voltage before you make an adjustment for a point of reference. I am assuming the total period of the oscillation is rather fast, at least 4 or 5 hertz. If it is too slow, like <1Hz, you will probably just see it switch between 0.2 and 0.8 volts at the output when read on the DC meter, though timing the time spent with the output high, over the entire period (one cycle of high and low) will give you the duty cycle.

    I also think that abruptly switching fuels might make the DME freak out because I doubt it expects that significant of a change from tank to tank. But if you reset adaptations, i would think it would wipe the slate clean so to speak, though I am not positive.

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    Put 200 miles on my car since installing the BMS flash + JB4 ISO, the DMTL and mixture codes have not come back. I am guessing the DP fix was the cause of this as I removed it when installing the tune.

    FYI, JB4 auto code clearing has been disabled.

    Only code stored is 2AAF which isn't much.

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    fml. I've been running OTS Cobb stage2+ for a couple of hundrred miles now on regular 93 octane, (haven't had the opportunity to get e85) and the mixture codes have been coming back more often (29e0 29e1). Will remove v3 O2 sims whenever I stop being lazy and report back. Seems like it is causing these issues judging by everybody else's situation.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by danniexi Click here to enlarge
    fml. I've been running OTS Cobb stage2+ for a couple of hundrred miles now on regular 93 octane, (haven't had the opportunity to get e85) and the mixture codes have been coming back more often (29e0 29e1). Will remove v3 O2 sims whenever I stop being lazy and report back. Seems like it is causing these issues judging by everybody else's situation.
    Fwiw u dont need the o2 sims on s2+ unless you are trying to pass emissions.

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    random update. i removed the O2 sims, drove for a hundred miles on 93 octane. No codes. i also recently added e85 (arond E40) for another 100 miles. No codes. so far so good. sims may have been the culprit for me as well.

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    I have been dealing with the same issue, @themyst. While I had only run E85 a few times, it does seem to coincide with when the codes showed up. I took the DP fix out and then cleared the codes and reset adaptations on my piggy. Codes/SES light came back on within a few days of normal driving. Please update if you figure anything else out...

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