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  1. #301
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    My biggest beef with this is the mom knew the kid had problems and was mentally unstable and she still had the gun somewhere he could get it. Where was the gun safe that only she knew the code to? Where was the trigger lock that only she knew the code to? Improper gun safety/storage is just as safe as pointing a gun at someone and pulling the trigger with no clip in the gun. "Oh I thought it was empty"

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    How can a gun be in a safe place if it's for home protection. I'm sure most people who have guns for home protection have it within range of their bed or other places and have a full clip ready in the gun.

    You don't want your protection gun to be locked in a safe when you need it in the midlle of the night .

  3. #303
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by funkmobster Click here to enlarge
    How can a gun be in a safe place if it's for home protection. I'm sure most people who have guns for home protection have it within range of their bed or other places and have a full clip ready in the gun.

    You don't want your protection gun to be locked in a safe when you need it in the midlle of the night .


    This. Pistol Permits are already being delayed, this is not helping mine move on any further.

    The idea behind concealed carry is that you dont know WHO is carrying, so you think twice about robbing ANYONE.

    Not to mention that concealed carry can stop a violent person a lot faster than the cops can arrive.
    Last edited by Itsbrokeagain; 12-19-2012 at 03:52 PM.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90SoFlo Click here to enlarge
    There is no way to "not have weapons". Doesn't matter if its a rock or a knife. If its more then everyone else has its a advantage.
    So I am in Milano right now and unfortunately the attitude is that the Americans are getting what they deserve...you have everyone with guns and this is a byproduct of that. I think this is wrong as those children did nothing wrong but...times have drastically changed since the 2nd amendment was written so as a result, that amendment needs to be changed/updated. At least federally agreement can be in place to ensure the owners of a gun/rifle are on an annually basis tested to ensure they are mentally stable enough to own it.

    e90, you are correct that there will always be weapons but, any idiot can pull a trigger, for the most part, if you have a knife, you have to be within two feet of me to use it...big difference.
    Click here to enlarge

    I will quit being rude if you quit being stupid.

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  6. #306
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
    Sticky, please, you are confusing Ethnicity and race with nationality and place of birth. If thatís the case then you need to trace back to Native Americans: D
    Not really, nationality and race are very similar in those areas I mentioned.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
    FYI You Chinatown in London and a large Chinese community in most large cities in Europe.
    I said Chinatown in Norway. England isn't all of Europe just like two states aren't the same thing.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
    Still, I canít understand what this has to do with the Gun problem in the US??? Are you saying that African Americans or Chinese Americans tend to be more dangerous than European Americans???
    No, I'm saying having a ton of different cultures, languages, people, sometimes leads to violence. It has in the past. You can't compare areas with completely different demographics to the US as a whole and wonder why the statistics are different.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
    Isolated States with tighter gun laws will never work because there is no border control between States. Therefore you have free movement of Guns.
    Um, it works. California doesn't recognize other states CCW's for example and I can't just drive to Nevada to buy a gun to use in California.

    Didn't you see what happened to Plaxico Burress?

  7. #307
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90SoFlo Click here to enlarge
    No, I said the more people that can properly protect themselves, with a firearm, will lower victim death rate.

    Would you rob someone that you knew was carrying a gun, or would you choose someone that you know is defenseless? I think thats a pretty obvious question.

    How well did those guns ended up protecting Nancy Lanza's life? She did own 6 of them according to reports.
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by sr20seb Click here to enlarge
    How well did those guns ended up protecting Nancy Lanza's life? She did own 6 of them according to reports.
    So you equate a kid taking his mother's gun and using it on her to a random act of violence? SMFH

    She certainly should have locked her guns up knowing she had a mentally unstable child. That doesn't mean my​ rights to own a firearm should be infringed.
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  9. #309
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90SoFlo Click here to enlarge
    So now you want to use reality.

    You wouldn't rob someone with a gun. If you do you're stupid.
    I've been using reality as my basis for every argument - you rely on what if's. Just like they above question...you wouldn't do this or do that blah blah blah. And yet again you FAIL. Cause as I said, you can't tell if someone is carrying concealed and therefore a thief would have no way to tell who is and who is not armed. Again, your argument fails.

  10. #310
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
    The stupid comments like "cars are also dangerous", that spoons make you fat, that knives are dangerous too, so don't make this a gun control issue.. make me sick.
    So why limit their choices, let's make it legal to buy fully armed tanks.. why bother shooting up a school if you can blow it up? Stupid comments galore

    People with guns can shoot other people
    People with no guns cant shoot other people

    Try to spot the diffrence.

    You charge a school with a knife, how many will you be able to slaughter before someone stops you? Comparing guns to knives and cars.. jesus christ some people..

    Even if your constitution states the right to bare arms.. how in the hell did that translate into an arsenal of asssault weapons? How many children need to die before you realize that the availability of guns makes it possible for some nutters to do these things in the spear of the moment. If this guy would not have had access to weapons, he would not have shot anyone.
    riiiight.. its the guns fault it was used for evil and not home defense, or sport, or a collector piece.. its not the kid that did wrong it was the gun.

    a determined person can kill with anything. and can kill many. if noone has a gun, how will you stop me with a knife? tell me, how? your gonna finda knife and duel it out? better yet, your gonna rush me w/o a weapon? lol, love to see it. you bleed out before i moved onto the next victim.

    stop, just stop claiming removing all guns would have prevented this.. he illegally obtained a weapon. how does removing legal owners that right make this not happen again? oh, it doesnt? it lets many others illegally obtain guns and do it again? wow, thats logic

  11. #311
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
    How do you classified illegally obtained. Are you for example going to classify this school shooting as an illegally obtained weapons becaus they were not his, but his mothers?
    well, lets simplify this. if you UNLAWFULLY take an object belonging to someone else, thats legally obtained?if you drive a car w/o a license, are you driving legally? come on now. your smarter than that

  12. #312
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ChuckD05 Click here to enlarge
    I am actually with everyone saying that guns should not be taken away from people nor do I think laws need to be put in place to stop the sale of guns or to recover the ones in circulation...

    BUT.... I have never once in my life heard a story about anyone stopping any of these lunatics while on their killing spree becuase they were carrying. I never seen a story on the news about a citizen who was carrying saving another person from being robbed/killed/raped due to carrying. I have seen a few stories regarding home invasions and criminals being scared away, which is why I am pro the ownership of guns. I myself wouldnt want to always carry and will deal with whatever is dealt to me outside my home. If its my time to go bc of some crazy with a gun than so be it, but i will still defend myself and others to the best of my ability if that situation arrises.

    Maybe media doesnt here about these or purposely choses not to make these stories big ?

    I understand everyones argument here, and maybe all you guys are tougher/braver/smarter than other people who carry but with all these shootings and the numbers listed of people who own guns, why dont we ever here of a good citizen stopping a crime? It makes it easier for the anti-gun people to argue when there are no accounts of citizens like us on here stopping a tradgedy.

    again i am on the side of sticky and others who are saying the ban of guns is not the answer, i am just stating an observation.
    now you have. its just not SENSATIONAL news, so they dont report on it

    http://www.ktrh.com/pages/michaelber...ticle=10648178

    Click here to enlarge

  13. #313
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    riiiight.. its the guns fault it was used for evil and not home defense, or sport, or a collector piece.. its not the kid that did wrong it was the gun.

    a determined person can kill with anything. and can kill many. if noone has a gun, how will you stop me with a knife? tell me, how? your gonna finda knife and duel it out? better yet, your gonna rush me w/o a weapon? lol, love to see it. you bleed out before i moved onto the next victim.

    stop, just stop claiming removing all guns would have prevented this.. he illegally obtained a weapon. how does removing legal owners that right make this not happen again? oh, it doesnt? it lets many others illegally obtain guns and do it again? wow, thats logic

    Lots of "objects" can be used as weapons. Cars need keys and gas. Guns are just hunks of metal until you chamber a round - same analogy as a car. So why not tax the $#@! out of ammunition ?? Why hasn't any politician suggested doing this ? I guarantee you if it cost $2500 bucks to spray a couple hundred rounds we'd stop having these mass killings or greatly reduce the occurrence.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
    I honestly think the best way to stop this problem would be taxing the $#@! out of ammunition. Sure, people are still gonna get shot and die....but maybe the amount of people being killed at once would stop. Who knows...but I just don't think the proposed legislation being discussed right now is going to work because the clips and magazines are the problem. And God only knows how many of them are in circulation. Probably five times the number of guns that they fit into.

    and guns need bolts, magazines and ammo.. exactly, anything can be a weapon, what are we trying to do, limit the amount of peole killed? homemade bombs will be the norm. the more attention such incidents get, the worse the next one will be.
    lol, no. the solution is 3 fold, in respect to guns. ENFORCE current laws better, TRAIN those that do wish to carry, SHALL issue CCW. laws do nothing if they are not enforced.

    besides, all that would do is increase home reloading, and then you get into blackmarket ammo. people do hunt for food, people do shoot for sport. 250rds .223 is about $500 as is.

    $#@!ty people do $#@!ty things. think outside the box.

  15. #315
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    I think we need to really look at what are problem is.

    Is it people dying before they should?
    Is it people committing crimes?
    Is it that you're anti-gun?

    What is each person problem?




  16. #316
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    More info from Australia: (source: http://www.aic.gov.au/statistics/violent%20crime.html)


    Click here to enlarge


    • Recorded assault increased again in 2007, to 840 per 100,000, compared with 623 per 100,000 in 1996. The 2007 rate was the highest recorded since 1996.
    • The rate for robbery peaked in 2001. Rates have declined by 38 percent since 2001, to 86 per 100,000 per year.
    • The rate of kidnapping remained between three and four per 100,000 per year from 1996 to 2007.
    • The homicide rate was 1.9 per 100,000 in 1996 (which includes the 35 victims of the Port Arthur massacre) and was at its highest in 1999, at 2.0 per 100,000. In 2007, the rate was 1.3 per 100,000, the lowest recorded (since 1996).
    • The rate of recorded sexual assault increased between 1997 and 2007, from 78 to 94 persons per 100,000 per year




    What do we take from this? Assaults went up, rather than going down. Murders were so low to begin with that their trends aren't even visible on this chart. So here is a chart with better resolution:

    Click here to enlarge

    Averaging out the peak and trough in the chart above, we see a .6% decrease in murders since the gun ban, and a 33% increase in assaults. Seems like a waste of $500 million to me.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    and guns need bolts, magazines and ammo.. exactly, anything can be a weapon, what are we trying to do, limit the amount of peole killed? homemade bombs will be the norm. the more attention such incidents get, the worse the next one will be.
    lol, no. the solution is 3 fold, in respect to guns. ENFORCE current laws better, TRAIN those that do wish to carry, SHALL issue CCW. laws do nothing if they are not enforced.

    besides, all that would do is increase home reloading, and then you get into blackmarket ammo. people do hunt for food, people do shoot for sport. 250rds .223 is about $500 as is.

    $#@!ty people do $#@!ty things. think outside the box.

    Bolts mags are not the projectile that kills. The bullet is.
    Homemade bombs would do the trick but are not easy to build quickly and effectively nor do many have the ability/knowledge to build them thus they would not be used for mass killing that happen spur of the moment.
    I agree - laws, enforcement of them and training are greatly lacking - but so is intelligence in the average human...

    The home reloading aspect would be fine for personal use but not for sale - there could be stiff laws regarding that. Without the jackets it's hard for people to reload...but if you made blackmarket reloads illegal for sale it might work. Hey, I AM trying to think outside the box. Everyone else keeps to be repeating the same thing.

  18. #318
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    Oh yeah also you would never see another spent casing left on the ground at the range lol Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
    .
    Homemade bombs would do the trick but are not easy to build quickly and effectively nor do many have the ability/knowledge to build them thus they would not be used for mass killing that happen spur of the moment.
    I agree - laws, enforcement of them and training are greatly lacking - but so is intelligence in the average human...
    Just gonna post 2 photos:

    1. You can probably Google the directions to make the same bomb
    Click here to enlarge

    2. Real Talk
    Click here to enlarge
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  20. #320
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by whoosh Click here to enlarge
    More info from Australia: (source: http://www.aic.gov.au/statistics/violent%20crime.html)


    Click here to enlarge


    • Recorded assault increased again in 2007, to 840 per 100,000, compared with 623 per 100,000 in 1996. The 2007 rate was the highest recorded since 1996.
    • The rate for robbery peaked in 2001. Rates have declined by 38 percent since 2001, to 86 per 100,000 per year.
    • The rate of kidnapping remained between three and four per 100,000 per year from 1996 to 2007.
    • The homicide rate was 1.9 per 100,000 in 1996 (which includes the 35 victims of the Port Arthur massacre) and was at its highest in 1999, at 2.0 per 100,000. In 2007, the rate was 1.3 per 100,000, the lowest recorded (since 1996).
    • The rate of recorded sexual assault increased between 1997 and 2007, from 78 to 94 persons per 100,000 per year




    What do we take from this? Assaults went up, rather than going down. Murders were so low to begin with that their trends aren't even visible on this chart. So here is a chart with better resolution:

    Click here to enlarge

    Averaging out the peak and trough in the chart above, we see a .6% decrease in murders since the gun ban, and a 33% increase in assaults. Seems like a waste of $500 million to me.
    So you're blaming this rise in crime and assaults on not having guns. It's quite ridiculous that you're even making this correlation, being as you don't think population growth has anything to do with the possibility of increased crime. How stupid to even think like me right? Just like more cars driving on a road lessens the risk of getting into a car crash. Your reasoning makes perfect sense, crime went up just because guns were "restricted."

    Which brings me to another false statement you make. Guns in Australia are banned, I even made it easy by using bold text so you can clearly see it. Let's look at the definition of the word:

    Ban: To prohibit, especially by official decree: See Synonyms at forbid

    You make it sound as nobody in Australia can poses a firearm which is completely and utterly untrue. You can own firearms in Australia with restrictions. And according to your chart that occurred in 1996, so before you see an incline in crime before the gun restrictions were in place, then we see a decrease right after. Followed by another increase and then another sharp decline.

    The year 2002, unless otherwise specified counts the 88 Australians who were killed in Bali which accounts for the sharp increase and then again a huge decrease right after that. This is does not build your case in any shape or form, you're omitting way too many variables to justify that:

    Restriction on guns is causing increase in crime.

    You're omitting, acts of terrorism and most importantly population growth.
    Click here to enlarge

  21. #321
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
    Just gonna post 2 photos:

    1. You can probably Google the directions to make the same bomb
    Click here to enlarge

    2. Real Talk
    Click here to enlarge
    Here's a few stories:

    http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?se...cal&id=8813201

    http://www.startribune.com/local/sou...1.html?refer=y

    I'm sure I can find 100's of these resulting in deaths of an individual over the last 10 years or so. But I'm not making any sense right? If those people didn't have guns on them they'd have bombs instead and also knives too. Throwing knives at cars is just as deadly as unloading bullets into one.
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by sr20seb Click here to enlarge
    Here's a few stories:

    http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?se...cal&id=8813201

    http://www.startribune.com/local/sou...1.html?refer=y

    I'm sure I can find 100's of these resulting in deaths of an individual over the last 10 years or so. But I'm not making any sense right? If those people didn't have guns on them they'd have bombs instead and also knives too. Throwing knives at cars is just as deadly as unloading bullets into one.

    Both of your stories go to show that the people who fired were un-trained, or in the second case he was drunk and had previous convictions for a weapon. So here we go again, guns dont kill people. Idiot people or crazy people kill people.

    Stop the idiots, and the violence will go down. Illegal guns and shootings is always gonna happen, there is nothing you can do to curb it. There will always be an influx, so why make the normal law abiding public pay for an idiots issues?

    I have several guns of my own, but you dont see me walking around causing problems do you? If someone came at me or broke into my house with the intent to rob or harm me you damn well bet I will be unloading hot lead into his ass until hes on the ground.

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    Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlargeClick here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Itsbrokeagain Click here to enlarge
    I have several guns of my own, but you dont see me walking around causing problems do you?
    Hopefully not, but you usually don't see this forehand, normal people snap, kids get their hands on parents guns, neighbours get into a dispute.

    A gun that is handy will always be in the wrong place for the wrong person, but that is the essence of the problem. People can't generally be trusted. Situations can't be prodicted. Having an AR15 with a 30bullet magazine + a couple of fast shooting 9mm with extra long clips laying around wont just escalate any situation, but in many cases be the actual cause of the situation.

    If you think that the 2nd amd. is still justifiable, and should give anyone "demed sane and for change sensable checked out bye authorities" the right to bear arms then why does it need to give you the right to own an aresenal of multi-round military design hardware?? What kind of a burgelar are you expecting??
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
    Hopefully not, but you usually don't see this forehand, normal people snap, kids get their hands on parents guns, neighbours get into a dispute.

    A gun that is handy will always be in the wrong place for the wrong person, but that is the essence of the problem. People can't generally be trusted. Situations can't be prodicted. Having an AR15 with a 30bullet magazine + a couple of fast shooting 9mm with extra long clips laying around wont just escalate any situation, but in many cases be the actual cause of the situation.

    If you think that the 2nd amd. is still justifiable, and should give anyone "demed sane and for change sensable checked out bye authorities" the right to bear arms then why does it need to give you the right to own an aresenal of multi-round military design hardware?? What kind of a burgelar are you expecting??
    I disagree, Normal people do not "snap" and go shooting people. Kids (i believe) can live with guns, they have to be taught how to handle them obviously.

    For years, if you have a disagreement with someone, they get into a fist fight, (which i even think is redneck), one guy gets a black eye, bloody nose, the dispute is resolved. This has been happening in high school for years. Nobody would even consider getting a gun. But as society changes..


    "A gun that is handy will always be in the wrong place for the wrong person"
    What? No. A gun is not always in the wrong place.

    30 rounds magazines, are used to defend against multiple people. You can't do that with 5 bullets.

    "fast shooting 9mm" Only the fast shootings ones?

    Cause of the situation? No. The situation can be anything from being robbed to having people fly planes into buildings.

    Maybe this last situation.




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