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  1. #876
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    Its possible he really just sucks at shifting quickly. Maybe what he is really saying is if he was not losing so much time shifting, if he loses it on one shift all the shifts must be slow, he really has a 9 second car with a good driver.
    Kevin
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  2. #877
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    I'd gladly let an AT owner take my car down the strip once this weekend in Orlando to see how much fun it is trying to launch this car.

  3. #878
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GeorgiaTech335Coupe Click here to enlarge
    I'd gladly let an AT owner take my car down the strip once this weekend in Orlando to see how much fun it is trying to launch this car.
    My advice, if you dont get the ET you want (which i doubt you'll get due to lack of experience and 6MT) on the first two runs just roll easy off the line and go for that trap!

    OR, just go for the trap speed from the get-go Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    My advice, if you dont get the ET you want (which i doubt you'll get due to lack of experience and 6MT) on the first two runs just roll easy off the line and go for that trap!

    OR, just go for the trap speed from the get-go Click here to enlarge
    100% what I'm doing. First few runs I won't launch too hard (but have to try or car bogs down badly). I want to see what trap I get mostly. Then after a few of those runs, I'll go for gold. My main concern is when I'm going to snap those half shafts, want to have a little fun first.

    I'm hoping this new clutch allows me to use 2step and NLS. The ACT clutch would not let me use it effectively due to the super low engagement point.

  5. #880
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    You don't lose .4s but you are at a 0.3sec disadvantage compared to a 6AT car that doesn't unload through shifts
    With NLS you hold boost so there isn't much re-spool time. You might loose .3ths of acceleration time but that is fairly negligible IMHO. Maybe .1th? I could go work it out on paper but under the weather and can barely keep my head up at the moment. Click here to enlarge
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  6. #881
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    You don't lose .4s but you are at a 0.3sec disadvantage compared to a 6AT car that doesn't unload through shifts
    I wonder if that's over the whole quarter mile not per shift. IIRC BMW lists the 6MT 2/10 quicker to 60 than the standard auto & 1/10 slower than the DCT go figure.
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  7. #882
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GeorgiaTech335Coupe Click here to enlarge
    100% what I'm doing. First few runs I won't launch too hard (but have to try or car bogs down badly). I want to see what trap I get mostly. Then after a few of those runs, I'll go for gold. My main concern is when I'm going to snap those half shafts, want to have a little fun first.

    I'm hoping this new clutch allows me to use 2step and NLS. The ACT clutch would not let me use it effectively due to the super low engagement point.
    Have rick@defiv express ship you the diff lockdown kit and you're safe from broken drivetrain parts
    Click here to enlarge

  8. #883
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Have rick@defiv express ship you the diff lockdown kit and you're safe from broken drivetrain parts
    I ALWAYS get off on wheel hop. Makes me cringe. I think they'll break from launching with boost tho, without wheel hop.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory Click here to enlarge
    I wonder if that's over the whole quarter mile not per shift. IIRC BMW lists the 6MT 2/10 quicker to 60 than the standard auto & 1/10 slower than the DCT go figure.
    I've seen many 60-130 VBOx logs comparing AT/DCT with MT and showing how many mph the MT loses on the shift compared to AT/DCT. Always a few mph difference.

  10. #885
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    Usually and unfortunately getting off after already getting hop is too late and some or complete damage has been done
    Click here to enlarge

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    What HP does wheel hop usually start, and are you guys running stock suspension components or something else?

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    It's a matter of incurring wheel spin and IRS going all over the place trying to hook causing violent rear suspension action...not really hp related but you need enough to start breaking traction which isn't too hard with N54 levels of torque..

    I have all rear suspension bits you can think of now with defiv lockdown to finalize it..if for any reason it doesn't get rid of it i'll forget about drag racing this car and i surely hope it works out
    Click here to enlarge

  13. #888
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    It's a matter of incurring wheel spin and IRS going all over the place trying to hook causing violent rear suspension action...not really hp related but you need enough to start breaking traction which isn't too hard with N54 levels of torque..

    I have all rear suspension bits you can think of now with defiv lockdown to finalize it..if for any reason it doesn't get rid of it i'll forget about drag racing this car and i surely hope it works out
    Weird. I don't have any wheel hop on stock E92 suspension with an open diff. I think I don't have enough power to really deflect the bushings (430whp or so) Click here to enlarge

  14. #889
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GeorgiaTech335Coupe Click here to enlarge
    I've seen many 60-130 VBOx logs comparing AT/DCT with MT and showing how many mph the MT loses on the shift compared to AT/DCT. Always a few mph difference.
    I would agree that the DCT or 6AT can shift faster then a 6 speed, have seen MTs drop back on very shift on roughly equal cars......what I am having a problem with is Shiv's math about the1/4 mile spread between him & his other customer. For what its worth my car is the first personal fun use car I have ever owned since 1960 with a automatic. Have a lot of years campaigning 4 speed's at Englishtown.
    Last edited by BEAR-AvHistory; 12-28-2012 at 11:05 PM.
    Kevin
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    3 out of 4 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    I'm just waiting to see how a 6AT single turbo car does, I mean if 440whp can do 11.3 surely 570whp should be able to do high 10s right???

    lol

  16. #891
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by amclint Click here to enlarge
    I'm just waiting to see how a 6AT single turbo car does, I mean if 440whp can do 11.3 surely 570whp should be able to do high 10s right???

    lol
    should know by march/April at the latest
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  17. #892
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Laloosh Click here to enlarge
    Put it this way, I have never officially drag raced anything BUT a manual transmission car, and the bmw manual tranmission flat out sucks. I was still able to crack low 12s and over 120 traps on stop turbos, however the shifting never felt right when pushed to its max. Over the course of 3 years I got some what use to it, untill I got my mustang and realized that I can slam the $#@! out of the shifter and chirp the 3-4 shift at over 100 mph in a bone stock car. I believe one of my first posts when my bmw was bone stock was how to fully turn off traction control (even though it was) becuase I was bogging a bone stock car from shifting to fast.

    As for launching a mt, theres alot more to getting a mt car downt he track then just launching, more then half the time I blow the tires on a good hard 1-2 shift instead of the initial hit....
    This +1000000. I've bogged every tune including stock. The dme slows the 6mt's down a lot. You'd have to drive one to understand. There's no reason I should be able to chirp the 2-3 shift in a 1st gen miata, yet run $#@!ty track times with the 335 when not spinning out of the hole.

    I do think that claiming a .8 handicap is too much, but I guess it could be at that power level/time range. The faster you go the more hp you need, and the more errors affect you.

  18. #893
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    I give props to any BMW MT owner who can get consistent results. Before I got my AT 135i, I test drove a MT 135i and I found that transmission very random to say the least. I don't know if it was because of the CDV that I found out about later on or if I was spoiled by Honda transmissions/my Evo transmission, but I honestly wasn't enjoying that test drive with the MT 135i. So with that in mind, I still miss driving a manual and I definitely will get one next time, it just won't be a BMW though lol.

  19. #894
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    You don't lose .4s but you are at a 0.3sec disadvantage compared to a 6AT car that doesn't unload through shifts
    The question is, can it be fixed?

  20. #895
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
    Weird. I don't have any wheel hop on stock E92 suspension with an open diff. I think I don't have enough power to really deflect the bushings (430whp or so) Click here to enlarge
    It could be due to how the car is tuned and the transmission. AT cars are less prone to wheel hop more likely because they have torque converters.

    DCT and MT rear wheel drive cars are more prone to wheel hop, based on complaints I've seen, with same wheel suspension and with better tires .

  21. #896
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GeorgiaTech335Coupe Click here to enlarge
    I've seen many 60-130 VBOx logs comparing AT/DCT with MT and showing how many mph the MT loses on the shift compared to AT/DCT. Always a few mph difference.
    word!?? where can we ALL see such graphs to draw conclusive data?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by amclint Click here to enlarge
    I'm just waiting to see how a 6AT single turbo car does, I mean if 440whp can do 11.3 surely 570whp should be able to do high 10s right???

    lol
    lol, who the hell negged you for that. great point though.. sure hope someone goes and tries it

  23. #898
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BuraQ Click here to enlarge
    It could be due to how the car is tuned and the transmission. AT cars are less prone to wheel hop more likely because they have torque converters.

    DCT and MT rear wheel drive cars are more prone to wheel hop, based on complaints I've seen, with same wheel suspension and with better tires .
    After break-in pure stock with run flats I had real bad wheel hop the first time I ever launched in 1st from a standing start. I have never driven a performance car including IRS versions this sensitive to wheel hop right out of the box.
    Kevin
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    word!?? where can we ALL see such graphs to draw conclusive data?
    Not my data, so I don't have access to it.

    When I get around to it, I'll do some 60-130 runs. I'll do some with and without NLS too so we can see what the difference is.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory Click here to enlarge
    After break-in pure stock with run flats I had real bad wheel hop the first time I ever launched in 1st from a standing start. I have never driven a performance car including IRS versions this sensitive to wheel hop right out of the box.
    Its weird. I don't have any wheel hop at all. I don't get it. The only mod I have is a rear sway bar and 275mm nonrfts. I mean, I'm glad I don't, but I can't figure out why others do.

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