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  1. #326
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JoshBoody Click here to enlarge
    I know Rader wants to discuss ATR, so here's my question. Below are the 2 throttle maps I use (different driver maps), which reach max load around 70%. Is anyone successful in pedal input 0-100%? I've only experimented with a few iterations, including the original stock mon factors which has values 0 to 1.0... but I didn't alter the x-axis at that time. Since I stack I do have 0-100% throttle, but I was hoping to do an experiment which needs 0-100% throttle in the DME (i tried 0-90% in this mapping).
    I don't know what the driver and Mon A/B tables do.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    I've never played around with the throttle tables, i just REALLY like the way "stock" mapping feels. But that is an interesting experiment.
    The stock tables feel sluggish to me, coming form the Procede. I adjusted them to be much more responsive (attached). This makes the car seem so much more awake to me. In contrast, I hated the LT settings.

    Have you all changed the boost ceiling setting? I presume that it defines the max boost the DME will request, correct?
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    700 and change

  2. #327
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    The boost ceiling is the "boost cap" you see people talking about. Using ATR you can't raise that ceiling... yet. There's more to it than just a safety limit for the turbos, it's an actual part of the DME logic that has to be rewritten
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  3. #328
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    I just read the entirety of this thread along with the Cobb ATR help document. I appreciate everyone's hard work in exploring the N54 DME and using ATR to unlock its logic. I'm an enthusiast in all of this and have made a few mods for "1+" performance, and have etuned with our PTF friends. However I am still somewhat "in the dark" regarding the overall N54 DME logic ... In this regard I would really be interested in seeing some kind of overall N54 DME controller flow chart that clearly shows the interplay between all of the sensor inputs and the command outputs. Does this exist already? I guess I'm really asking if anyone's cracked the DME logic, or perhaps just a subset of the logic for tuning purposes and who have developed a suitable flowchart to help us ATR newbies see the step-by-step possible results of changing various DME table values before an actual WOT pull. Wishful thinking? I am about to google "N54 DME control logic Wiki" or something like that.

  4. #329
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Jeffman Click here to enlarge
    I just read the entirety of this thread along with the Cobb ATR help document. I appreciate everyone's hard work in exploring the N54 DME and using ATR to unlock its logic. I'm an enthusiast in all of this and have made a few mods for "1+" performance, and have etuned with our PTF friends. However I am still somewhat "in the dark" regarding the overall N54 DME logic ... In this regard I would really be interested in seeing some kind of overall N54 DME controller flow chart that clearly shows the interplay between all of the sensor inputs and the command outputs. Does this exist already? I guess I'm really asking if anyone's cracked the DME logic, or perhaps just a subset of the logic for tuning purposes and who have developed a suitable flowchart to help us ATR newbies see the step-by-step possible results of changing various DME table values before an actual WOT pull. Wishful thinking? I am about to google "N54 DME control logic Wiki" or something like that.
    yep wishful thinking. there is a pdf from cobb about all atr tables on their site in but its vague. many info are here and other threads.
    07 335i AT - MOTIV 750 - MHD BMS E85 - BMS PI - JB4G5 - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - Helix IC - Stett CP - Custom midpipes with 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - LUX H8 - Level 10 AT upgrade
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  5. #330
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Jeffman Click here to enlarge
    I just read the entirety of this thread along with the Cobb ATR help document. I appreciate everyone's hard work in exploring the N54 DME and using ATR to unlock its logic. I'm an enthusiast in all of this and have made a few mods for "1+" performance, and have etuned with our PTF friends. However I am still somewhat "in the dark" regarding the overall N54 DME logic ... In this regard I would really be interested in seeing some kind of overall N54 DME controller flow chart that clearly shows the interplay between all of the sensor inputs and the command outputs. Does this exist already? I guess I'm really asking if anyone's cracked the DME logic, or perhaps just a subset of the logic for tuning purposes and who have developed a suitable flowchart to help us ATR newbies see the step-by-step possible results of changing various DME table values before an actual WOT pull. Wishful thinking? I am about to google "N54 DME control logic Wiki" or something like that.
    Maybe you can start his document Click here to enlarge I'd be all for it
    700 and change

  6. #331
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    I wan to verify my understanding and associated changes. My car doesn't hit boost targets on the top end, with my WGDC peaking at 50%. The diff between my WGDC base and after PID is the 11.5%, as specified in the WGDC Ceiling (Adder) table. I've upped this value to 21%, which should allow it to reach the max 57% as specified in the max WGDC.

    Please verify the above logic.

    Thanks
    700 and change

  7. #332
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by The Ghost Click here to enlarge
    I wan to verify my understanding and associated changes. My car doesn't hit boost targets on the top end, with my WGDC peaking at 50%. The diff between my WGDC base and after PID is the 11.5%, as specified in the WGDC Ceiling (Adder) table. I've upped this value to 21%, which should allow it to reach the max 57% as specified in the max WGDC.

    Please verify the above logic.

    Thanks
    Yes, you should be go with that.

    That's what i do, with the way the X and Y axis are labelled it's kind of a hassle to tune for holding a lot of boost up top. Just 16psi at 6Krpms is +460g/s and I'm too lazy to rescale and retune the whole base table to more appropriately match that much air flow, so i left the base table for tuning the mid-range revs and i rescaled the adder table to take care of things up top. It works.
    Click here to enlarge
    MOTIV750, MOTIV P-1000 PI, MOTIV/FUEL-IT! low pressure fuel system, AEM EMS/COBB AP, Aquamist HFS-3, ETS FMIC, SPEC stage 3+ clutch/SS flywheel, BC Racing coilovers and VMR wheels wrapped in Hankook RS3s.

  8. #333
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    Bumping for VANOS insight. I plotted Stg0 (stock) vs Stg1+ vs Stg2+/E30 VANOS table data to visualize the changes made to VANOS intake and exhaust (moving, warm) through the stages. Not that I'm comfortable making edits, but the trend is clear...

    Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge

    Click here to enlarge


    Has anyone modified VANOS tables further? Any tips/hints/magic? I see ripples of "more power less timing" and assume someone is on to something..?


    Edit - Watching the HPF E46 VANOS tuning vid on youb00bs, he mentions "turning a 5 into a 10" (4:29 - vb is tossing the start-at link once embedded) where a single scalar adjustment is made to VANOS. What might this correlate to in terms of 2D double VANOS tables? A global adder for VANOS intake/exhaust angle? An overlap value?
    Last edited by Dfv2; 04-29-2013 at 10:15 PM.

  9. #334
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    Are you just plotting the high load column? Really you'd need to throw it on a dyno and play with it but unless you've got cash to burn i wouldn't advise it...every time you change it you'll have to adjust timing and wgdcs accordinly as everything changes

  10. #335
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    Yes, you should be go with that.

    That's what i do, with the way the X and Y axis are labelled it's kind of a hassle to tune for holding a lot of boost up top. Just 16psi at 6Krpms is +460g/s and I'm too lazy to rescale and retune the whole base table to more appropriately match that much air flow, so i left the base table for tuning the mid-range revs and i rescaled the adder table to take care of things up top. It works.
    Did you mean the airflow table? In reality, isn't the adder just a ceiling table? If that's the case, why not just make the adder table 100% and have the PID control it fully?
    700 and change

  11. #336
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
    Are you just plotting the high load column? Really you'd need to throw it on a dyno and play with it but unless you've got cash to burn i wouldn't advise it...every time you change it you'll have to adjust timing and wgdcs accordinly as everything changes
    Yes, just the highest load column - seemed most relevant.

  12. #337
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by The Ghost Click here to enlarge
    Did you mean the airflow table? In reality, isn't the adder just a ceilring? If that's the case, why not just make the adder table 100% and have the PID control it fully?
    Yes the airflow table. I've tossed around the idea of just giving the adder table free roam to add whatever it wants... I just haven't done it yet. It seems to me that would be the easiest way to eliminate any underboosting but if that was the case I feel like Cobb's default settings would've been more aggressive there. I can't think of why not to do that but I'm just a little nervous about doing it and I honestly can't tell you why lol
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  13. #338
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    I have a sudden, large timing drop on the top end that I can't explain. Timing goes from ~12.5 to about 4 degrees while WOT and over 6k. The timing tables show 12.x in these cells (it's the stock e30 timing tables) and there is NO timing corrections in any of the cylinders, but the timing does down non the less. Any ideas?

    Attached is the image of the log and graph (this happened when winding-out 1st gear, on a 1-4 gear pull).

    Can anyone explain why this may be? The only thing I can think of, is it is using the "Timing (Failsafe)" table, as it has the value of "4 deg" in this cell. I don't know when this tables gets triggered, however.

    Thoughts?

    @dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks
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    700 and change

  14. #339
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    Isnt that drop related to the preparation of the shift? You at?
    07 335i AT - MOTIV 750 - MHD BMS E85 - BMS PI - JB4G5 - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - Helix IC - Stett CP - Custom midpipes with 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - LUX H8 - Level 10 AT upgrade
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  15. #340
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    I'm MT. I didnt see this when running procede, just AP.

    idreally like to know what triggers using the fail safe table.
    700 and change

  16. #341
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by The Ghost Click here to enlarge
    I'm MT. I didnt see this when running procede, just AP.

    idreally like to know what triggers using the fail safe table.
    I've never done the leg work, but i would assume anytime a P3100 event is triggered.
    2011 E90 M3 \ Melbourne Rot Metallic

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    What is a P3100? I don't have any codes thrown, and that isn't on the code list that I'm using.
    700 and change

  18. #343
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    I think 3100 is boost control.

    DME is intervening for some reason… you can also see WG PID being zeroed. I’ve seen this before on a larger scale when someone was having under boost codes. Try increasing the PID authority in the adder table and see what happens. Also happens in the top of 3rd.

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    Anyone have any recommendations for a track tune? Specifically E30 map with some load dialed out and increased timing? Something reliable for HPDE or AutoX ?

  20. #345
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    1 out of 1 members liked this post. Reputation: Yes | No
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Jetbill Click here to enlarge
    Anyone have any recommendations for a track tune? Specifically E30 map with some load dialed out and increased timing? Something reliable for HPDE or AutoX ?
    I have a map that i played around with for a little while and i believe it would work well for this. Running a 160 load value straight across running 7.5 degrees of timing ramping to 9.5 degrees. It keeps boost low(~13.5 psi peak) and it helps CATs reasonably low and doesn't have that instant kick of torque down low and power feels like it stays steady throughout the RPM range.
    Click here to enlarge
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  21. #346
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    After I get my clutch in, I'm planning on doing something similar, lowering load target to about 175-ish, and letting it run 12-13 degrees of advance on E30. If I bring 3 5-gallon jugs of E85 to a track event, should be plenty to maintain E30. 16-17psi on E30 should be pretty easy on the motor.

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    N20 TMAP Sensor

    I searched the thread but didn't get any hits. Anyone know what I need to change in my map to account for the N20 TMAP sensor? I'll be having Cobb install my RBs and do pump and race gas maps soon, and want to go ahead and get the sensor installed before dropping it off.

  23. #348
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by georgelb Click here to enlarge
    I searched the thread but didn't get any hits. Anyone know what I need to change in my map to account for the N20 TMAP sensor? I'll be having Cobb install my RBs and do pump and race gas maps soon, and want to go ahead and get the sensor installed before dropping it off.
    Boost control -> MAP Conversion-> Then input this information

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  24. #349
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rader1 Click here to enlarge
    Boost control -> MAP Conversion-> Then input this information
    Fantastic. Thanks, Rader. =)

  25. #350
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by georgelb Click here to enlarge
    Fantastic. Thanks, Rader. =)
    No probClick here to enlarge
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    MOTIV750, MOTIV P-1000 PI, MOTIV/FUEL-IT! low pressure fuel system, AEM EMS/COBB AP, Aquamist HFS-3, ETS FMIC, SPEC stage 3+ clutch/SS flywheel, BC Racing coilovers and VMR wheels wrapped in Hankook RS3s.

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