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  1. #26
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    im betting it is
    Not according to my car which ran the race map and low timing. I have still yet to see any full weight or even gutted n54 hit those trap speeds at the local tracks. Proper weight reduction including a driver along with the ability to actually use the power under 60-70 mph and there's no reason why it would not trap in the 123 plus range like all the top stock turbo traps, in a manual non the less.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Laloosh Click here to enlarge
    Not according to my car which ran the race map and low timing. I have still yet to see any full weight or even gutted n54 hit those trap speeds at the local tracks. Proper weight reduction including a driver along with the ability to actually use the power under 60-70 mph and there's no reason why it would not trap in the 123 plus range like all the top stock turbo traps, in a manual non the less.
    Not to mention the VANOS changeover alterations, richer AFR and lower resulting cylinder temps. It all adds up

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Autobahn335i Click here to enlarge
    His engine blew when he was running the JB3 so that's really not an option. Still can't believe the cats are to blame, unless they're clogged for some reason? 100cell cats should create next to no backpressure.
    we will try to help enrita entretodos

    and stop the war once bms vs visnnu
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  4. #29
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by R1000K3 Click here to enlarge
    The time difference to Enritas 7.86 run 100-200 km/h vs. dzenno's time 6.53 is far more than one second, which is huge. I agree RB's are phenomenal vs. TD's comparing these figures. The time difference can also have other roots, e.g. that dzenno's concept is much more optimized and he is using a monster IC with large core and fittings.
    My record runs were done on a slope, not sure about enrita. Also, the big tom fmic i have now was installed after the runs were done. Original fmic was the helix v1. I do think that the big tom fmic is doing the job as i'd hoped, meaning, less pressure drop but worse IAT control than the helix which doesn't matter as meth is there to take care of it in my case.

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    I think it's too much speculation on something that could be so simple. The difference between LM and dzennos car and enrita is the turbos.
    Head porting on enrita's car was very mild and only on the intake side so I doubt that's the case. Turbos are possible but not likely given they're basically the same as RBs. Compression+leakdown 1st, visual check of the cats, then the rest...let's not make assumptions, worst thing you can do

    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by R1000K3 Click here to enlarge
    We don't even know if the cams are correctly set in Enritas car so it is a bit early to trash his turbos IMHO. And if he could return to well below 8 seconds as before it would save a lot of money compared to ditch the turbos. Personally I would go for a single turbo if I needed to change the concept. But the play-money is right now spent on providing the moped with a decent turbo.
    Incorrectly timed cams could very well be the reason for it..Given fuel injection timing also depends on it and given he's had some unexplainable misfires (that seem to have been solved with the NGK plugs) I'd deal with looking into that later after compression/leakdown/visual inspection of the cats/turbos/exhaust
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  5. #30
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    enrita you are sure your sensor n20working?
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  6. #31
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    Sounds like cams should be the first thing check if you are not sure the timing is on.
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Life is so much more fun with a nemesis. I miss Shiv. Click here to enlarge
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    IF the turbos were bad, wouldn't you be able to see that on a boost log? I would assume that the boost would start falling off from the target?

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno Click here to enlarge
    LM he's run JB4 only as well with similar results..as well as procede
    he posted 15 psi logs though, and ran 9.4 id like to see a 18 psi run.

  9. #34
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Laloosh Click here to enlarge
    Not according to my car which ran the race map and low timing. I have still yet to see any full weight or even gutted n54 hit those trap speeds at the local tracks. Proper weight reduction including a driver along with the ability to actually use the power under 60-70 mph and there's no reason why it would not trap in the 123 plus range like all the top stock turbo traps, in a manual non the less.
    but what was your 60-130, 120mph is great, but it wouldnt be enough for a 7 sec run

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    but what was your 60-130, 120mph is great, but it wouldnt be enough for a 7 sec run
    Steve no stock turbo car will do a 7 second 60-130 lol.

    $#@! that's a tall order even for RBs.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Velocity26 Click here to enlarge
    IF the turbos were bad, wouldn't you be able to see that on a boost log? I would assume that the boost would start falling off from the target?
    I didn't say his turbos are bad, more that they aren't making the power expected.

  12. #37
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    7sec 60-130mph run on stock turbos without nos? highly wishful thinking even on much larger than 3% slope
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  13. #38
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    Thanks guys, wouldnt the ecu throw codes if cam timing is off? seems weird car runs fine if something that important is off but would explain the feeling of the engine holding back and not revving properly.
    how do you check that and can someone explain the consequences of timings being off?
    07 335i AT - MOTIV 750 - MHD BMS E85 - BMS PI - JB4G5 - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - Helix IC - Stett CP - Custom midpipes with 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - LUX H8 - Level 10 AT upgrade
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  14. #39
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    With cam timing being retarded or advanced you're basically shifting the power curve to the left or right. You can lose a ton of power if its not set correctly as well as encounter odd misfire issues. I'd check with that shop how they set the timing. Did they have a cam timing/adjustment locking toolkit when they installed it? Depending on what happened (if it really is the cause) the symptoms don't have to be VERY obvious. Car may drive perfectly in low load scenarios but be dog slow under high load.
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    5 out of 5 members liked this post. Yes Reputation No
    For cam timing, maybe you and DZ could run the same Cobb non-meth maps and compare trims and WGDC… and anything else you can think of that could point to cam timing… I can’t think of anything else off hand. Injectors are based on crank position, so window won’t change in relation.

    I’m not really understanding the JB logs with IATs, but I guess meth flow looks acceptable… what was ambient?

    Don’t both you and DZ have EGT probes… some comparison may point to an exhaust issue. But I’d just remove the cats for now.

    every post I get the 15 second thingy... don't have to worry about it for another 24 hours.

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    test... ok, maybe I can post

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    Outside temp was 15 c .
    doesnt cobb have some cam timings channels? Maybe vanos logging would be enough to compaire?
    If there is a big difference it would point straight away to cam timings. Dont wanna take my car apart right now ...
    Iam getting soon the new jb board. Will run an 18 psi across boost and see what times i get.
    07 335i AT - MOTIV 750 - MHD BMS E85 - BMS PI - JB4G5 - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - Helix IC - Stett CP - Custom midpipes with 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - LUX H8 - Level 10 AT upgrade
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    @JoshBoody, its not about the VANOS timing "tune", its about the correct position of both cams to begin with. If they aren't correctly set to start with (mechanically speaking) then the vanos timing tuning will be off as well BUT it won't show up in the logs.

    @enrita and I have already compared logs many times and two main things that were noticed are:

    1) On enrita's car, for the same tune (boost+timing+afr), the trims are less maxed out than on mine or Shiv's car when he had ASR turbos on the same tune was well.

    2) WGDC with his TD turbos is more similarly set to the stock turbos than on the RBs. For say 45% wgdc on RBs we'll boost X, while on enrita's car he'll be boosting X-1psi for instance. This is only indicative of the wg stiffness/adjustment as his car does hit the boost targets confirmed with 3 different tuning platforms (cobb/procede/jb).
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    your right about WG... too many variables, but if it's much different could point to less flow due to exhaust timing. Trims would be a good indication of something if you all are running the same map... ie same base IPW and pressure... cam timing not the same would result in variations of fuel added/subtracted. blowing fuel out the exhaust would be higher trim, lower trim would indicate less VE and/or more reversion. But any exhaust restriction would also have an effect on trims.

  20. #45
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    I haven't checked how much one teeth off on a N54 camshaft sprocket will do. But I recently checked it on the bike and it is 22+ crank degrees. The camshafts rotates with half engine speed so one teeth off would mean a lot. But I would be surprised if it would run as good and smooth as Enrita's car, so my bet is the cams are timed correctly. Worth checking though.

  21. #46
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    I am going to have to say timing on the cams as well! You can be 1 tooth off on the sprockets and not trip the camshaft position sensor. Happens all the time.

    Also, was the head shaved? Was a thicker gasket used? This can change the timing slightly as well as it changes the relationship between crank sprocket and the cams.

    When the engine was rebuilt, did they reuse the original timing chain or did they install a new one? Timing chains get stretched a little over time (not as much as a timing belt), so that can also be a factor.
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    Yes head was shaved and thicker gasket used. Timing chain probably still the same, there is a tensioner there so dont think could be stretched.
    gonna:
    - test new jb board on 18 psi across
    if still bad vbox times
    - check the exhaust cats and turbines
    if ok
    - do a leak down
    if thats ok
    - check cams timings
    if thats ok
    Live with it...
    07 335i AT - MOTIV 750 - MHD BMS E85 - BMS PI - JB4G5 - Okada Coils - NGK 5992 Plugs - Helix IC - Stett CP - Custom midpipes with 100 HJS Cats - Bastuck Quad - PSS10 - QUAIFE LSD - BMS OCC - Forge DVs - AR OC - ALCON BBK - M3 Chassi - Dinan CP - Velocity M rear Toe arms - Advan RZ-DF - LUX H8 - Level 10 AT upgrade
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    Steve no stock turbo car will do a 7 second 60-130 lol.

    $#@! that's a tall order even for RBs.
    thats my point, enrita's car does/did mid 7, should trap 125+mph the cobb timing curve is tame. id check that first, its the easiest way. i would add a few gallons of racefuel though, to ensure you get maximum timing and potential.. if its faster, significantly, you know your onto something.. doesnt have to be as fast as before as 60-130 is waaaaay more tempermental than a dragtsrip mph

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
    thats my point, enrita's car does/did mid 7, should trap 125+mph the cobb timing curve is tame. id check that first, its the easiest way. i would add a few gallons of racefuel though, to ensure you get maximum timing and potential.. if its faster, significantly, you know your onto something.. doesnt have to be as fast as before as 60-130 is waaaaay more tempermental than a dragtsrip mph
    7.8 100-200km not 60-130mph.

    If you want to use that metric, dzenno is deep into the 6s.

  25. #50
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    regardless, i misquoted. rule out the cobb,

    JB4-racefuel-run it- compare

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