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  1. #26
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by turbosetch Click here to enlarge
    I am running the snow safeinjection box with the fsb. Works perfectly.

    I have installed the safeinjection box on lots of cars with flashed tunes. Typically we remove the codes that are triggered during a boost cut when the safety is triggered. Cobb tunes usually allow for code suppression with little effort..I will say I have not seen the custom tuning interface for the BMW flashes yet so I'm not sure.


    Depending on the application we have used the solenoid bypass to bleed or block, just a simple relay also works to cut boost control on the stock solenoid in the N54 case you could go both ways I think...I wouldn't be worried about a limp mode as much if all other methods fail. I would rather have a temporary issue then a broken ring landing or worse in the case of a meth flow issue.

    I am open to doing testing at the shop on the shop 335xi if anyone wants us to try something.
    Awesome. Looks like I will be purchasing a boost bypass solenoid this week for testing while I wait for Terry's solution. They're only 60 bucks plus shipping.

  2. #27
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    why does all the exciting stuff have to start happening in the winter Click here to enlarge

  3. #28
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    How's this for a simple inexpensive solution:

    We design a JB+ style circuit that connects to the TMAP sensor. It will have some DIP switches inside as well as a trim pot to select different software options.

    Option 1: Take in a flow sensor signal (like the Snow, or FSB if using a BMS kit) and if boost > X, meth < Y, for the duration of Z milliseconds then the output boost becomes 3psi more than the input boost causing instant throttle closure and timing reduction. Tripping the failsafe would be not be super smooth but it would save your engine and unlike a bypass solenoid system is likely to actually work as intended.

    Option 2: Take in a flow sensor signal and progressively output a decreasing boost signal (to cause the DME to raise actual boost) proportional to methanol flow. This mode would be more useful when ATR comes out as you could design you own medium boost high advance map and then use the JB+ to add say 3psi on top of that across the board.

    Option 3: Same as option 1 only instead of altering boost IAT is increased to 170 degrees. For this to work the flash tuning would need to be programmed to run a very low advance curve when IAT got to 170 degrees. Like say 2 degrees ramping up to 8 degrees at redline.
    Might drive the cost of this box up, but would it be possible to use a PIC chip/connector in the box for firmware rewrites? This way we could future-proof this box if Cobb implements a passive meth failsafe or for when ATR comes out.

    If the above isn't cost-effective, for now it seems Option 1 is the most viable for what we have available right now. Guessing you'd have two dials inside the FSB (meth flow, delay)?

  4. #29
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    OK, I ordered the boost bypass solenoid. I can't believe Snow Performance is asking $20 for ground shipping on something that is small and weighs less than 1 lb! Have they ever freaking heard of USPS for smaller packages?

    No matter, found an eBay seller located in PA that is selling for $60 + $9.00 shipping.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    OK, I ordered the boost bypass solenoid. I can't believe Snow Performance is asking $20 for ground shipping on something that is small and weighs less than 1 lb! Have they ever freaking heard of USPS for smaller packages?

    No matter, found an eBay seller located in PA that is selling for $60 + $9.00 shipping.
    Lol. I just went off on them two weeks ago about this bs shipping charge. Told them about the USPS if it fits it ships program and they were like silent for a couple of seconds then they said to me that it's there policy and nothing they could do plus they had me by the balls because I needed the FS from them!! I also reamed into nitrous express for charging me 20 bucks for 3 nitrous jets!!!!!!! I fuc. Ing laughed so hard and told them it was BS so the guy spoke to manager and they sent it USPS for 5 bucks. These company shipping rates are just out of control. They are even looking to profit off shipping...

  6. #31
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Cn555ic Click here to enlarge
    Lol. I just went off on them two weeks ago about this bs shipping charge. Told them about the USPS if it fits it ships program and they were like silent for a couple of seconds then they said to me that it's there policy and nothing they could do plus they had me by the balls because I needed the FS from them!! I also reamed into nitrous express for charging me 20 bucks for 3 nitrous jets!!!!!!! I fuc. Ing laughed so hard and told them it was BS so the guy spoke to manager and they sent it USPS for 5 bucks. These company shipping rates are just out of control. They are even looking to profit off shipping...
    You need to seriously start shopping around a little! Click here to enlarge

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Snow-Perform...#ht_1412wt_925

  7. #32
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    You need to seriously start shopping around a little! Click here to enlarge

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Snow-Perform...#ht_1412wt_925
    Bro you on crack or something!!!! Thats a progressive controller and not the safe injection unit. That is either a false advertisement or an error in wording!!! That's why I don't buy much from ebaY. I know the item # matches but the pic doesnt so you never know what they will send you!! Btw I just searched and found one for 159 shipped

  8. #33
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Cn555ic Click here to enlarge
    Bro you on crack or something!!!! Thats a progressive controller and not the safe injection unit. That is either a false advertisement or an error in wording!!! That's why I don't buy much from eba
    My bad! I just did a search for "safeinjection" let me keep looking around

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  10. #35
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    Found this one too.... $179.99 shipped http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SNO-30020/ but yours is the far better deal!

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    Found this one too.... $179.99 shipped http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SNO-30020/ but yours is the far better deal!
    You my friend found the best deal!! You bought mine which I only used for a month!!!!

  12. #37
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Cn555ic Click here to enlarge
    You my friend found the best deal!! You bought mine which I only used for a month!!!!
    HAHA yeah I did. Then again nobody ever ran that thing, so if it didn't work, I had a pricey paperweight. It's not 100% perfect though, it will crap out when it's really hot outside. Happened only once though, when it hit like 105 degrees in July with 100% meth in the tank. Probably wasn't a safe idea either way Click here to enlarge

  13. #38
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    Might drive the cost of this box up, but would it be possible to use a PIC chip/connector in the box for firmware rewrites? This way we could future-proof this box if Cobb implements a passive meth failsafe or for when ATR comes out.

    If the above isn't cost-effective, for now it seems Option 1 is the most viable for what we have available right now. Guessing you'd have two dials inside the FSB (meth flow, delay)?
    Probably isn't practical to include a USB/RS232 converter on it. Easiest thing would be to sell you an update chip if we ever had to change it. The chip we'd use on that would be pretty inexpensive. Maybe $10 shipped updates, etc.

  14. #39
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Probably isn't practical to include a USB/RS232 converter on it. Easiest thing would be to sell you an update chip if we ever had to change it. The chip we'd use on that would be pretty inexpensive. Maybe $10 shipped updates, etc.
    Noo, I was thinking we could resurrect those old JB3 PIC chip burners. Click here to enlarge There are plenty sitting out there.

  15. #40
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    ok my bypass solenoid came in. Will install tomorrow and report.

  16. #41
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
    ok my bypass solenoid came in. Will install tomorrow and report.
    cool
    Click here to enlarge

  17. #42
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    OK, this thing is pretty idiot proof actually. one end goes into vacuum post-WG solenoid, the other end is left open as it vents to atmosphere if the trigger is sent. I bet you could use a regular injector solenoid to do the exact same thing, with a proper barb fitting for the vacuum line.

    I may drop down to stage 2 pump, drain the meth almost empty and datalog to show how this thing works in a real no-flow situation.

    It was hard to understand how this unit worked until I had it in my hands. I bet any meth kit company like coolingmist et al could just add a barb fitting to their existing injector solenoids and call it a bypass solenoid. All the trigger does is the same thing an injector solenoid does, open the latch when there is a no flow situation detected by the FSB to vent vacuum.

    Price-wise @ $60 bucks, it's not all that much more than a regular injector solenoid, but both should work similarly.

  18. #43
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    It shouldn't be too hard to wire up. Look forward to your findings as this maybe a viable solution for Cobb users

  19. #44
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    Had an interesting idea for meth mapping for you Cobb guys running the JB4 for meth control and in dash gauges.

    What if we make a special version of the firmware where you enter the meth additive by RPM under map 6. So you might enter 4psi across the board, 2psi down low ramping to 4psi up top, etc. Whatever you want. Then with map 6 selected the tuning will run the OEM boost target (whatever you have loaded via the flash) and add in that RPM based boost additive as a function of meth flow. So at 0% flow you'd get the Cobb target, and at 100% meth flow (user defined) you'd get the Cobb target plus our map 6 RPM based additive, with a linear slope for in between values.

  20. #45
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    Sounds like a great idea Terry!
    Especially with Cobb it could allow to put the extra boost where its missing especially up top. Looking forward to the release.
    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Had an interesting idea for meth mapping for you Cobb guys running the JB4 for meth control and in dash gauges.

    What if we make a special version of the firmware where you enter the meth additive by RPM under map 6. So you might enter 4psi across the board, 2psi down low ramping to 4psi up top, etc. Whatever you want. Then with map 6 selected the tuning will run the OEM boost target (whatever you have loaded via the flash) and add in that RPM based boost additive as a function of meth flow. So at 0% flow you'd get the Cobb target, and at 100% meth flow (user defined) you'd get the Cobb target plus our map 6 RPM based additive, with a linear slope for in between values.
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  21. #46
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Had an interesting idea for meth mapping for you Cobb guys running the JB4 for meth control and in dash gauges.

    What if we make a special version of the firmware where you enter the meth additive by RPM under map 6. So you might enter 4psi across the board, 2psi down low ramping to 4psi up top, etc. Whatever you want. Then with map 6 selected the tuning will run the OEM boost target (whatever you have loaded via the flash) and add in that RPM based boost additive as a function of meth flow. So at 0% flow you'd get the Cobb target, and at 100% meth flow (user defined) you'd get the Cobb target plus our map 6 RPM based additive, with a linear slope for in between values.
    Perfect! Click here to enlarge

    That's exactly the way i used to "abuse" map6 boost settings when running the combo, so those settings will work out a lot cleaner...it'd also be nice, for those on RBs, to be able to hold a bit higher boost levels than 17.5-18psi on the 15ohm board on top of the cobb wgdc..

    i suggest everyone disables the bogfix and lagfix and also set the futureuseb=100 so that boost wouldn't autotune down due to inherently lower timing on the cobb maps

    for safety on RBs I also up the fuel pressure all the way to 100 as the flash doesn't see the true boost/load target in this scenario and there's a chance the AFR will be leaner than targetted on really high boost levels...again, this may pertain only to RB customers running really high boost...just thought i'd throw all that out there...

    Terry, maybe given all of this, you can create a special map instead of just map6 boost overrides so it takes care of the other params?
    Last edited by dzenno@PTF; 11-28-2011 at 03:45 PM.
    Click here to enlarge

  22. #47
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Had an interesting idea for meth mapping for you Cobb guys running the JB4 for meth control and in dash gauges.

    What if we make a special version of the firmware where you enter the meth additive by RPM under map 6. So you might enter 4psi across the board, 2psi down low ramping to 4psi up top, etc. Whatever you want. Then with map 6 selected the tuning will run the OEM boost target (whatever you have loaded via the flash) and add in that RPM based boost additive as a function of meth flow. So at 0% flow you'd get the Cobb target, and at 100% meth flow (user defined) you'd get the Cobb target plus our map 6 RPM based additive, with a linear slope for in between values.
    Something that clean gets implemented and I'll be getting both Click here to enlarge
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  23. #48
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    P.S. when I was buying race gas last time the guy at the shop asked how much boost i was planning to run and i said fairly high, 20-21psi, he sort of chuckled and said, that's low boost...40-50psi is high boost Click here to enlarge so people, by come informal/unofficial standards out there we're running LOW boost even at 20-21psi Click here to enlarge
    Click here to enlarge

  24. #49
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno Click here to enlarge
    P.S. when I was buying race gas last time the guy at the shop asked how much boost i was planning to run and i said fairly high, 20-21psi, he sort of chuckled and said, that's low boost...40-50psi is high boost Click here to enlarge so people, by come informal/unofficial standards out there we're running LOW boost even at 20-21psi Click here to enlarge
    You need an upgraded map sensor. I guarantee those RBs have more in them than 21 psi peak.

    And fwiw, I still didn't install my boost bypass solenoid. Call me lazy yeah buddy. I don't pull unless my AP is live monitoring timing correction cylinder 5 that's for sure.

  25. #50
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
    Had an interesting idea for meth mapping for you Cobb guys running the JB4 for meth control and in dash gauges.

    What if we make a special version of the firmware where you enter the meth additive by RPM under map 6. So you might enter 4psi across the board, 2psi down low ramping to 4psi up top, etc. Whatever you want. Then with map 6 selected the tuning will run the OEM boost target (whatever you have loaded via the flash) and add in that RPM based boost additive as a function of meth flow. So at 0% flow you'd get the Cobb target, and at 100% meth flow (user defined) you'd get the Cobb target plus our map 6 RPM based additive, with a linear slope for in between values.
    Thing is I still don't know what the boost curve looks like on this race map. All i know is 20 psi down low tapering to 16 at redline. The boost curve anywhere in between is anyone's guess.

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