• S65 V8 Rod Bearing Failure in Drew's Gintani Supercharged M3 - covered under Gintani warranty

      I have been reluctant to post about this earlier as I wanted to give Gintani ample time to look at the engine to try and determine what happened before I posted. We have an idea what caused it but currently the motor has not been broken down to do a full inspection. Given the current drama / speculation on the forums, I felt, along with Gintani, that we should post now and let everyone know that a failure did occur on my car, and then follow up later when we have more solid detailed information. As of now I know of no other Gintani car that has had a failure, but mine.

      The engine had been making a slight ticking noise on the passenger side wheel well for about a month before the failure, it sounded like an exhaust leak, but it is difficult to pinpoint noises on this engine. It appeared to have been a bad rod bearing that was causing the noise. Eventually the bearing failed, the rod seized onto the crank shaft, broke and one half came out the side of the block. That is all I currently know for certain, when Gintani tears the motor down they can investigate further to try and pinpoint exactly what it was, then post pictures, and a more accurate detailed analysis. It appears though that the Active Autowerke car that failed, is very similar in nature to this failure.

      A few things to point out -

      1. I've been running 9psi for over 10K miles on the motor, currently no other kit runs this much boost.
      2. When I dynoed the car, and removed the air filter, it hit 11psi, and you can see on the dyno a huge dip up top, which could be detonation.
      3. The seals on my 1st blower blew out while doing some spirited driving, eventually the car ran out of oil, this could have damaged the bearing.
      4. Other 2008 motors have been torn down and found to have wear on the rod bearings that could have eventually failed as mine did.

      The current status is that a long block is on it's way, Gintani is covering the cost of the motor and all labor, which is above and beyond what most companies would do. I am extremely thankful to them for doing so, they have always taken care of me. Right now my plans are that I am going to keep the kit, but most likely will lower the boost, hopefully I will be up and running soon, with more dyno's, video's, vbox data, etc.

      This article was originally published in forum thread: Rod Bearing Failure... started by DLSJ5 View original post
      Comments 132 Comments
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by fastgti69 Click here to enlarge
        I'm sorry if this question was asked but since the motor is open why not get some forged rods to be on the safe side? or even go stage 3
        He just wants to keep it stock for simplicity and not pay more money.

        Likely a smart move as I doubt I will ever recoup 1/10 of what I have spent.
      1. rt turbo's Avatar
        rt turbo -
        Hmm, blew out seals sounds like there may have been excess crank case pressure as well. That may point to ring damage as well.

        So this was a bearing failure, but we can possibly assume they are finding the limits of the rods or bolts at the 650ish power level? With the identificfation of possible oil starvation that could have just hurried it up.

        One things for sure that 4bolt main is in it for the long haul. Click here to enlarge
      1. JonMartin's Avatar
        JonMartin -
        I posted this on M3forum I think it should be brought up here because the sheep over on that forum can't come with an answer to this.

        So again since my post never get answered I just want to understand this:

        1. If you are a happy Gintani / OE Tuning customer you will be accused of getting stuff for free or pushing their product because you are an employee. And you have no credibility.

        2. If you don't say anything at all its because you are hiding something or Gintani ruined your car.

        3. However as long as you have something negative to say about Gintani even if you never dealt with them ever in your life and never even set foot in their shop you automatically get "cool points?" and become instantly credible. Is that about right?
        "
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        ^ Waste of your time, let them believe what they want. It's the same group of people who don't have these cars or have any experience with them that you are arguing with.

        Honestly, M3forum has nothing. Old site on the decline with no up to date info. Let them enjoy OT, the people who know are here.
      1. m54b25's Avatar
        m54b25 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by PEI330Ci Click here to enlarge
        That's just one area, there are quite a few others with regard to fluid containment that "stock" cars do NOT meet minimum safety requirements.

        People thought I was nuts to run -3 AN line for my transmission and differential breathers....but if you've ever seen what happens to a transmission or diff with regard to oil foaming at high speeds, you'd sign up for "bullet proof" really fast. That aquarium tubing most people seem to run can get snagged and cut driving through grass, or in the pit areas around race tracks. One little "off" and your breather system under the car may be compromised.

        Stock cars also don't usually have a coolant catch can either....

        Sorry to get so far off topic regarding the engine failure. I'll be quiet now.

        Oh yes, foaming was another issue the S54 had when tracked & revised oil system it's needed =) Thanks PEI330Ci for bringing this up!
      1. jhuang25's Avatar
        jhuang25 -
        Drew, first off, I think it's really honorable to come online and open both yourself and Gintani up for criticism by exposing what has happened to your motor. This type of thing happens much more often than what you see online. It's very easy to go to a forum and post impressive numbers, much harder to discuss failure. These things happen when you push cars to the limit and I think it's great that you are sharing your experiences, good or bad with all the BMW enthusiasts. It's unheard of for a tuner to take care of their customers car the way Gintani has taken care of you. I have had my share of high hp vehicles, and when disaster strikes, I'm always amazed at how both reputable tuners and "high end" and expensive installers tend to run and hide. I look forward to what you guys find caused this failure, and more importantly for you to get your car back on the streets so we can see which direction you take next with your car.
      1. M3_WC's Avatar
        M3_WC -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        My M3 is an '08 build as well and DCT, how is that possible M33?
        I don't get how pencilgeek who claims to be the all-knowing of M3's, doesn't know that there many 2008 M3's out there with DCT.
      1. JonMartin's Avatar
        JonMartin -
        In case anyone had any doubts about Gintani stealing or modifying the G-power software to run more timing..... here is a screenshot of an e-mail from G-power's North american distributor admitting that I was given a high octane file. And them offering me yet another kit after my car was fixed. Not something they would do if they suspected I just ripped them off right?

        Click here to enlarge
      1. DLSJ5's Avatar
        DLSJ5 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VetteFish Click here to enlarge
        Drew, very unfortunate to hear. 2007 was a year for our C6Z's that is known to have weak rod bearings as well, there have been many accounts of failures in stock cars...ya never know. The fact that your car has had 10k of POWERFUL boosted miles is great, you really drove that car how it should and unfortunately something happened. The fact that Gintani is covering the cost is incredible. When I blew my boosted motor in my C5 Z06 I was left in the dust, had to go to a new shop, and shell out thousands and thousands of dollars to be back on the road again. I give both yourself and the guys at Gintani a lot of respect for how the situation is being handled. I'm sure you will be back on the road in knowtime with tricks up your sleeve giving me runs for my money Click here to enlarge
        Thanks Fishi!
      1. DLSJ5's Avatar
        DLSJ5 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by PEI330Ci Click here to enlarge
        Drew,

        Sorry to hear...PITA but you got off lucky in more ways than one.

        A few years ago a BMWCCA member by the name of John Holder had a rod bearing failure on his S54 at a rather high speed down a straight away, (Race track) and did an enourmous amount of damage to the car. (I think the bill totalled nearly $30k...and he didn't hit anything...although he flew over a water drainage ditch) Imagine having a rod failure at high speed, having the oil from the block coat the rear tires.....and well...you know the story from there.

        A very visual example of this can be seen on youtube from a certain car doing a top speed run in the "Silver State Classic".

        I look forward to seeing a more in depth analysis of the failure, certainly for learning, and not to point any figures. I think the way this thing has been handled so far has been pretty classy by all parties.
        Wow, that is pretty scary, luckily when it went I was just shifting into 2nd gear, got on it a little when it happened. The one bad thing about DCT once you stop and pull over, you can't put the car back into neutral unless you can start the motor. It was tough getting it on the toe truck. Appreciate your thoughts on this, I've always admired the way you post and your common sense, thanks man.
      1. DLSJ5's Avatar
        DLSJ5 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by KiokenM3 Click here to enlarge
        sorry to hear what happened. glad gintani is picking up the bill and even happier to hear your keeping your car! good luck brother
        Thanks Ricky.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
        Sorry to hear that , come back with stronger engine Click here to enlarge
        But damn no more runs from DLSJ5 for a while? :|
        I think I"m going to keep the motor stock, and run lower boost. I do miss old Mexico. Click here to enlarge

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by tightie Click here to enlarge
        Great post Drew.

        Jon - You should post over your response on M3F on BB about that video.
        Thanks J!
      1. DLSJ5's Avatar
        DLSJ5 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jhuang25 Click here to enlarge
        Drew, first off, I think it's really honorable to come online and open both yourself and Gintani up for criticism by exposing what has happened to your motor. This type of thing happens much more often than what you see online. It's very easy to go to a forum and post impressive numbers, much harder to discuss failure. These things happen when you push cars to the limit and I think it's great that you are sharing your experiences, good or bad with all the BMW enthusiasts. It's unheard of for a tuner to take care of their customers car the way Gintani has taken care of you. I have had my share of high hp vehicles, and when disaster strikes, I'm always amazed at how both reputable tuners and "high end" and expensive installers tend to run and hide. I look forward to what you guys find caused this failure, and more importantly for you to get your car back on the streets so we can see which direction you take next with your car.
        Appreciate that Brotha, I know you can empathize, looking forward to seeing you again soon man.
      1. kiloil's Avatar
        kiloil -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        From what Gintani told me today, they intend to be as open with this as possible as there is nothing to hide. I quickly jumped in to say I would document every piece of the motor as it was being disassembled with high resolution pics for everyone. They did not seem to be opposed to the idea and Drew is not hiding anything either.

        So what I can tell everyone is you will see inside the motor.
        Why would Gintani talk to you about Drew's car? Don't take it personally, If I was in Drew's position, I would want NO one to speak about my car publicly, unless a written consent was given.
      1. MSIZZLE's Avatar
        MSIZZLE -
        Hey drew i dont know you but kudos for posting your business!!! Second i partner in a race shop with a friend and peolple some time forget that when it comes to modding a car especially when you make a na car fi there will be some growing pains and collateral damage along the way, it doesnt mean anyone did anything wrong it may just mean we found the limit! if it was a rod bearing we community now knows for the next build this must be adressed, as far as them paying thats a big thumbs up because if they didnt install or tune it wront with the 10k miles verifies they dont really owe you anything
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge
        I don't get how pencilgeek who claims to be the all-knowing of M3's, doesn't know that there many 2008 M3's out there with DCT.
        Exactly, guy can't even get basics right. Don't get me started on when he used to think the motor was 12.5:1 compression....
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by kiloil Click here to enlarge
        Why would Gintani talk to you about Drew's car? Don't take it personally, If I was in Drew's position, I would want NO one to speak about my car publicly, unless a written consent was given.
        Bud, this was after I spoke to Drew to about it and it wasn't public. This was only after Drew stated he intended to confront the issue and if Drew requested I not say anything, I would not say anything. Simple as that... if you call Alex, I highly doubt you will have the same conversion with him I did.
      1. biglare's Avatar
        biglare -
        Sux, best of luck Drew
      1. M33's Avatar
        M33 -
        Thanks for the negative points stinks
      1. DLSJ5's Avatar
        DLSJ5 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M33 Click here to enlarge
        Thanks for the negative points stinks
        Jaime, we may disagree at times, but I don't see anything out of line with what you've posted in this thread. What exactly is going on here?
      1. DD GT3 RD's Avatar
        DD GT3 RD -
        ^ that wasnt what he wrote, it was edited. But im with you drew, Im not sure why he wrote what he did, he didnt say anything bad in this thread...till the last post (that was changed, it said some bad stuff) but not sure why jaime got upset when it didnt seem there was any drama in the thread.