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    • S65 V8 Rod Bearing Failure in Drew's Gintani Supercharged M3 - covered under Gintani warranty

      I have been reluctant to post about this earlier as I wanted to give Gintani ample time to look at the engine to try and determine what happened before I posted. We have an idea what caused it but currently the motor has not been broken down to do a full inspection. Given the current drama / speculation on the forums, I felt, along with Gintani, that we should post now and let everyone know that a failure did occur on my car, and then follow up later when we have more solid detailed information. As of now I know of no other Gintani car that has had a failure, but mine.

      The engine had been making a slight ticking noise on the passenger side wheel well for about a month before the failure, it sounded like an exhaust leak, but it is difficult to pinpoint noises on this engine. It appeared to have been a bad rod bearing that was causing the noise. Eventually the bearing failed, the rod seized onto the crank shaft, broke and one half came out the side of the block. That is all I currently know for certain, when Gintani tears the motor down they can investigate further to try and pinpoint exactly what it was, then post pictures, and a more accurate detailed analysis. It appears though that the Active Autowerke car that failed, is very similar in nature to this failure.

      A few things to point out -

      1. I've been running 9psi for over 10K miles on the motor, currently no other kit runs this much boost.
      2. When I dynoed the car, and removed the air filter, it hit 11psi, and you can see on the dyno a huge dip up top, which could be detonation.
      3. The seals on my 1st blower blew out while doing some spirited driving, eventually the car ran out of oil, this could have damaged the bearing.
      4. Other 2008 motors have been torn down and found to have wear on the rod bearings that could have eventually failed as mine did.

      The current status is that a long block is on it's way, Gintani is covering the cost of the motor and all labor, which is above and beyond what most companies would do. I am extremely thankful to them for doing so, they have always taken care of me. Right now my plans are that I am going to keep the kit, but most likely will lower the boost, hopefully I will be up and running soon, with more dyno's, video's, vbox data, etc.


      This article was originally published in forum thread: Rod Bearing Failure... started by DLSJ5 View original post
      Comments 132 Comments
      1. M33's Avatar
        M33 -
        Drew in all honesty I have no idea who that is & I don't play cat and mouse $#@! games but I understand why you would think it was cause there is a lot of haten little kids on these boards ....
        And to john Martin I'm not saying that's what caused it , I'm simply stating that could be one of the causes & so can lack of oil ...
        I'm no mech but I do know and understand the basics of a motor as well as owned a few highly modified cars ....
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by JonMartin Click here to enlarge
        Ya its friggin amazing... They all jumped on the story like stink on $#@!.

        I addressed the issue with my response here
        http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showp...&postcount=161
        Finally, someone says it.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by PEI330Ci Click here to enlarge
        Drew,

        Sorry to hear...PITA but you got off lucky in more ways than one.

        A few years ago a BMWCCA member by the name of John Holder had a rod bearing failure on his S54 at a rather high speed down a straight away, (Race track) and did an enourmous amount of damage to the car. (I think the bill totalled nearly $30k...and he didn't hit anything...although he flew over a water drainage ditch) Imagine having a rod failure at high speed, having the oil from the block coat the rear tires.....and well...you know the story from there.

        A very visual example of this can be seen on youtube from a certain car doing a top speed run in the "Silver State Classic".

        I look forward to seeing a more in depth analysis of the failure, certainly for learning, and not to point any figures. I think the way this thing has been handled so far has been pretty classy by all parties.
        You have me really worried now.

        I was planning on going after some high speed records with my car, maybe not any longer when scenarios like what you described are possible.
      1. KiokenM3's Avatar
        KiokenM3 -
        sorry to hear what happened. glad gintani is picking up the bill and even happier to hear your keeping your car! good luck brother
      1. Sorena's Avatar
        Sorena -
        Sorry to hear that , come back with stronger engine Click here to enlarge
        But damn no more runs from DLSJ5 for a while? :|
      1. DLSJ5's Avatar
        DLSJ5 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M33 Click here to enlarge
        Drew in all honesty I have no idea who that is & I don't play cat and mouse $#@! games but I understand why you would think it was cause there is a lot of haten little kids on these boards ....
        And to john Martin I'm not saying that's what caused it , I'm simply stating that could be one of the causes & so can lack of oil ...
        I'm no mech but I do know and understand the basics of a motor as well as owned a few highly modified cars ....
        I didn't think it was you, I was just messing around, this drama we've experienced between us needs some humor now and then. From what I've seen, for the most part, when logic comes into play, and the info is obvious, unlike others you tend to come around and have no ego in that regard. I see no problem with you and PG sharing information and posting it, and you make some good points as well, no worries.
      1. m54b25's Avatar
        m54b25 -
        Knocking/detonation does cause Rod bearing failure as well! When it detonates a with a high load, it pounds the rod bearing to the crank which will leave no oil film in the rod bearing surface.

        Only the early S54 rod bearing recall are due to too tight clearances for a high revving engine + heat that ended up seizing the rod bearings to the crank wear when everything was driven hard. Thus BMW fixed the issue by using racing rod bearing clearances & used thicker TWS Motorsport oil.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by m54b25 Click here to enlarge
        Knocking/detonation does cause Rod bearing failure as well! When it detonates a with a high load, it pounds the rod bearing to the crank which will leave no oil film in the rod bearing surface.
        Definitely, but that does not seem to be the issue here. This seems to be more inline with the bearing issue similar to what the S54 experienced or else we would not see repeat failures for these bearings across tuned and stock motors for a certain year.
      1. BrenM3's Avatar
        BrenM3 -
        Yes we agreed on this. However if that happens damage will happen elsewhere and it'll be Obvious to all.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by m54b25 Click here to enlarge
        Knocking/detonation does cause Rod bearing failure as well! When it detonates a with a high load, it pounds the rod bearing to the crank which will leave no oil film in the rod bearing surface.

        Only the early S54 rod bearing recall are due to too tight clearances for a high revving engine + heat that ended up seizing the rod bearings to the crank wear when everything was driven hard. Thus BMW fixed the issue by using racing rod bearing clearances & used thicker TWS Motorsport oil.


        BG
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BrenM3 Click here to enlarge
        Yes we agreed on this. However if that happens damage will happen elsewhere and it'll be Obvious to all.
        Yep, and the disassembly should answer this quite definitively.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        By the way Drew, that is pencilgeek without a doubt. He is the only one to ever claim I had a blown motor NA when I got a bent valve fixed under BMW warranty. He is also blaming Jeremy for a valve spring failure, unbelievable. The old man will blatantly lie to try to hurt people, pathetic.
      1. m54b25's Avatar
        m54b25 -
        Yes, a tear down & look of the rod bearing topside & piston crown+skirt will tell. Also, the S60/S65 have been known with valve springs failures at BMW... that's one possible recall to be done.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by m54b25 Click here to enlarge
        Also, the S60/S65 have been known with valve springs failures at BMW... that's one possible recall to be done.
        Yes, I experienced this failure and hopefully the faulty valve springs have been replaced.
      1. PEI330Ci's Avatar
        PEI330Ci -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        You have me really worried now.

        I was planning on going after some high speed records with my car, maybe not any longer when scenarios like what you described are possible.
        Engine Diaper

        If you think I'm joking, look it up.

        I never got that far on the black car, but it was coming....
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by PEI330Ci Click here to enlarge
        Engine Diaper

        If you think I'm joking, look it up.

        I never got that far on the black car, but it was coming....
        I admit, I did think you were joking:

        Click here to enlarge

        Still, how could I really go around saying my car wears a diaper?
      1. PEI330Ci's Avatar
        PEI330Ci -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I admit, I did think you were joking:

        http://www.bimmerboost.com/images/im...apers003-1.jpg

        Still, how could I really go around saying my car wears a diaper?
        Engine diaper

        Transmission blanket

        You see the trend?

        On the upside, you could say these are required on all Top Fuel cars now...and be 100% correct.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by PEI330Ci Click here to enlarge
        On the upside, you could say these are required on all Top Fuel cars now...and be 100% correct.
        Suddenly it feels manly to have a car wearing diapers.
      1. PEI330Ci's Avatar
        PEI330Ci -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Suddenly it feels manly to have a car wearing diapers.
        That's just one area, there are quite a few others with regard to fluid containment that "stock" cars do NOT meet minimum safety requirements.

        People thought I was nuts to run -3 AN line for my transmission and differential breathers....but if you've ever seen what happens to a transmission or diff with regard to oil foaming at high speeds, you'd sign up for "bullet proof" really fast. That aquarium tubing most people seem to run can get snagged and cut driving through grass, or in the pit areas around race tracks. One little "off" and your breather system under the car may be compromised.

        Stock cars also don't usually have a coolant catch can either....

        Sorry to get so far off topic regarding the engine failure. I'll be quiet now.
      1. tightie's Avatar
        tightie -
        Great post Drew.

        Jon - You should post over your response on M3F on BB about that video.
      1. fastgti69's Avatar
        fastgti69 -
        Idk how i missed 3 pages of this.. but damn so thats where your car has been.

        I'm sorry if this question was asked but since the motor is open why not get some forged rods to be on the safe side? or even go stage 3 Click here to enlarge