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    • Pictures of the state M5junky's E60 M5 was in when removed from ASR Engineering for failure to compete custom twin turbo setup

      Steve (M5junky) sent us these pictures with permission to post them. These pictures reveal the state his E60 M5 was in after having spent about 2 years at ASR Engineering. The car was sent there for a twin turbo built motor setup as most of you know and nothing was done. Well, nothing other than stripping the car the car down and leaving it a huge mess. The transmission was pulled and looks to be left stock. The motor was pulled and not built as agreed. The engine bay, well, you can see for yourself.

      There is much more to all of this and the legal wheels are turning. We do not want to get in the way or step on anyone's toes so we will simply let this play out. What people should be aware of is that tens of thousands were spent by M5junky and M5Ranger to receive their twin turbo setups on the E60 M5 only to be jerked around with nothing being completed and the money being pocketed. No refund has been issued as of this point and we will follow progress on the story as it develops.























      This article was originally published in forum thread: There cars are out of there!!!! - M5's removed from ASR started by Lock n Load View original post
      Comments 339 Comments
      1. Bimmerbear's Avatar
        Bimmerbear -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I'm pretty sure he had AA tune for the nitrous. You need to pull timing with that big of a dry shot but that also kills power when off nitrous since you can't just switch maps on the fly.
        Was the AA tune developed specifically for nitrous?

        If it was, then they could only have retarded the timing so much before eating into off-nitrous power like you said. They would have had to strike a compromise between off-nitrous performance and safety while spraying (which, in my opinion, shouldn't be done on a car like this). Still, I would expect a 150 shot on an M5 to be wet. The money and capability are obviously not problems; it should have been done that way in the first place.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Bimmerbear Click here to enlarge
        Was the AA tune developed specifically for nitrous?
        Yes.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Bimmerbear Click here to enlarge
        If it was, then they could only have retarded the timing so much before eating into off-nitrous power like you said. They would have had to strike a compromise between off-nitrous performance and safety while spraying (which, in my opinion, shouldn't be done on a car like this). Still, I would expect a 150 shot on an M5 to be wet. The money and capability are obviously not problems; it should have been done that way in the first place.
        I agree with you completely.
      1. Lock n Load's Avatar
        Lock n Load -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Matt@Camber-Toe Click here to enlarge
        Damn. Personal note to not $#@! with one of America's armed forces member.
        No sir. This is just nothing but the truth. That is the only intent since oddjob feels compelled to posts continual lies.

        Ranger
      1. M5 Junky's Avatar
        M5 Junky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Don't remember this and really have no idea about anything relating to ELF oil or warranties.
        I'll find the post about ELF. He had did a post either in a thread or by itself stating that when our engines were done being TT'd that he had struck a deal. ELF oil was going to waurranty our engines for 2 years. I'm just curious what all that jargon meant, and if this was just another empty promise? I'll look for it on the M5 Board. (he was supposedly going to use a high grade oil to break our engines in and ELF was goingot provide it)
      1. M5 Junky's Avatar
        M5 Junky -
        http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...ppliers-2.html

        Here it is. Last portion talks of the ELF oil in the stage 3 TT setup..
      1. tightie's Avatar
        tightie -
        Wow.. You tell them Ranger.. Oddjob just give up and say sorry.. go back and hide into a little hole.
      1. oddjob2021's Avatar
        oddjob2021 -
        i didnt want to post but come on now, why provoke more and more, i thought we said let the courts handle it? read all my posts in this thread, i have said sorry recently to all who have lost money and time with asr. i aint hiding in any hole, he can state my posts are lies so why cant i say he's lieing (though i never have and dont think he is). why is he allowed to call me out saying im someone im not, twice. just because he is the 'victim' doesnt give him rights over me. anyway like i said i dont want to post here anymore, this is not my problem and it is bigger than i ever imagined, please do not reply unless you feel you must.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by oddjob2021 Click here to enlarge
        i didnt want to post but come on now, why provoke more and more, i thought we said let the courts handle it? read all my posts in this thread, i have said sorry recently to all who have lost money and time with asr. i aint hiding in any hole, he can state my posts are lies so why cant i say he's lieing (though i never have and dont think he is). why is he allowed to call me out saying im someone im not, twice. just because he is the 'victim' doesnt give him rights over me. anyway like i said i dont want to post here anymore, this is not my problem and it is bigger than i ever imagined, please do not reply unless you feel you must.
        I just want to state, oddjob isn't a bad guy and he is providing his perspective.

        He is a good member with a great history here. I understand his perspective is in conflict with everyone else but he still deserves to be able to say what is on his mind. He isn't disrespecting the board or anyone else he is putting things how he sees them about a very heated topic as gently as he can.

        Let's calm down guys, we are on the same team.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M5 Junky Click here to enlarge
        http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60...ppliers-2.html

        Here it is. Last portion talks of the ELF oil in the stage 3 TT setup..
        I read that and I think it just that ELF oil stands behind their oil in not causing any problems in a motor. I think that was just more marketing by Abid as I really doubt they have anything to do with ASR's "warranty" on engines.
      1. DBFIU's Avatar
        DBFIU -
        Give oddjob some credit, he is stepping on hot coals and is trying to shed more light on the subject for all of us. It isn't fair to act immature towards him regardless of whether you agree or not.
      1. cesmotorsport's Avatar
        cesmotorsport -
        First off, let me just introduce myself. I am John, CEO of CES Motorsport Inc. I have decided to make a quick post since this ASR thing has started to heat up even more, and I felt I needed to at least let everyone know that there is definitely something going on with Abid and ASR Engineering Inc. Thanks to RT Turbo from bimmerforums.com for bringing this to my attention on this forum...

        The Information that I can divulge at this point.
        I have been doing business with Abid for quite some time, since around Nov 2006. We flew him up here since one of our customers had gotten word of the nitrous setups Abid was doing and wanted one for his car. I personally got to know Abid from that point forward, and had been doing business together with him since then, on both a personal and business level. I have gone down to Miami multiple times, have stayed with his family for a week at a time. He actually was a good friend. I got to know his wife, his kid, his parents, his brother, everyone. We would all spend time together when I would come down for business and I would stay at Abid's house, visit with his family, even go to birthday parties with the kids... Like-wise when he would fly up to do various work that our customers/friends wanted done. My house was open to him. We were almost like family. There was no reason in the world to believe things would end up the way they did. Abid really was a good engineer, and produced some great products. We even did do some succesful business together at the very beginning. But over time, things just took a turn for the worse. Among the other dealings that I had with him, (which I cannot discuss at this time), one issue that will hit a chord with some other members on this forum is that Abid also had my personal car for over a year and a half. They may have seen it also. A black 95 e36 turbo M3. Our company specializes in e36 M3 turbo systems, and I was trying to work with Abid to make some headway in tuning one of our latest turbo systems we were developing using a similar Vishnu piggyback software package Abid was using for the 135/335i turbo system upgrades he was developing. Needless to say, after months and months of phone calls, hearing excuse after excuse for various delays about one thing or another, I finally had to drive down to pick my car up from Abid's shop in March of last year. It was like he had become a different person, and could care less about anything but himself. It seems like I was not the only one being treated this way, having seen personally the other cars in Abid's shop that were supposedly getting "work done" on them as he put it. From that point forward, things went from bad to worse. There are many more issues between he and I that I have not discussed in this post yet, and one will be a bombshell to many M5 owners, but until our legal issues with him have been resolved, I cannot divulge anything further until after I have the go ahead from our legal advisors... but rest assured, to all that are in doubt, there is definitely something going on, and I feel for all the other people that have been involved and had problems with Abid or ASR Engineering Inc. Once I am able to discuss what has happened, I will post the rest of what has transpired, and would be happy to help out in any way I can with the others that are also caught up in this debacle...

        Best Regards from The CES Motorsport Team
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by cesmotorsport Click here to enlarge
        There are many more issues between he and I that I have not discussed in this post yet, and one will be a bombshell to many M5 owners, but until our legal issues with him have been resolved, I cannot divulge anything further until after I have the go ahead from our legal advisors... but rest assured, to all that are in doubt, there is definitely something going on, and I feel for all the other people that have been involved and had problems with Abid or ASR Engineering Inc. Once I am able to discuss what has happened, I will post the rest of what has transpired, and would be happy to help out in any way I can with the others that are also caught up in this debacle...

        Best Regards from The CES Motorsport Team
        Thank you very much for chiming in and sharing your perspective.

        We understand you can not share anything further than what you have and only ask you keep us updated when you are able to divulge more of what transpired.

        It seems Abid is going to have his hands full with a lot of legal issues shortly.
      1. DBFIU's Avatar
        DBFIU -
        Thanks for the input CES.
      1. M5 Junky's Avatar
        M5 Junky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by cesmotorsport Click here to enlarge

        The Information that I can divulge at this point.
        I have been doing business with Abid for quite some time, since around Nov 2006. We flew him up here since one of our customers had gotten word of the nitrous setups Abid was doing and wanted one for his car. I personally got to know Abid from that point forward, and had been doing business together with him since then, on both a personal and business level. I have gone down to Miami multiple times, have stayed with his family for a week at a time. He actually was a good friend. I got to know his wife, his kid, his parents, his brother, everyone. We would all spend time together when I would come down for business and I would stay at Abid's house, visit with his family, even go to birthday parties with the kids... Like-wise when he would fly up to do various work that our customers/friends wanted done. My house was open to him. We were almost like family. There was no reason in the world to believe things would end up the way they did. Abid really was a good engineer, and produced some great products. We even did do some succesful business together at the very beginning. But over time, things just took a turn for the worse. Among the other dealings that I had with him, (which I cannot discuss at this time), one issue that will hit a chord with some other members on this forum is that Abid also had my personal car for over a year and a half. They may have seen it also. A black 95 e36 turbo M3. Our company specializes in e36 M3 turbo systems, and I was trying to work with Abid to make some headway in tuning one of our latest turbo systems we were developing using a similar Vishnu piggyback software package Abid was using for the 135/335i turbo system upgrades he was developing. Needless to say, after months and months of phone calls, hearing excuse after excuse for various delays about one thing or another, I finally had to drive down to pick my car up from Abid's shop in March of last year. It was like he had become a different person, and could care less about anything but himself. It seems like I was not the only one being treated this way, having seen personally the other cars in Abid's shop that were supposedly getting "work done" on them as he put it. From that point forward, things went from bad to worse. There are many more issues between he and I that I have not discussed in this post yet, and one will be a bombshell to many M5 owners, but until our legal issues with him have been resolved, I cannot divulge anything further until after I have the go ahead from our legal advisors... but rest assured, to all that are in doubt, there is definitely something going on, and I feel for all the other people that have been involved and had problems with Abid or ASR Engineering Inc. Once I am able to discuss what has happened, I will post the rest of what has transpired, and would be happy to help out in any way I

        Best Regards from The CES Motorsport Team
        John... Thanks for chiming in... I'd love to hear the rest of the story one day when the time is right. What you wrote brings back memories of what Juan and I were like with him. I never spent nights or anything at his home, but I've been to his house and met his family Including his brother and parents. That's why all this became so hard to do as far as pulling out. We were all decent friends. I thought anyway. Again thanks for chiming in. Look forward to hearing more when the time is right. By the way nothing would probably really surprise me. This has been a nightmare for us to date.

        Thanks
      1. Lock n Load's Avatar
        Lock n Load -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I just want to state, oddjob isn't a bad guy and he is providing his perspective.

        He is a good member with a great history here. I understand his perspective is in conflict with everyone else but he still deserves to be able to say what is on his mind. He isn't disrespecting the board or anyone else he is putting things how he sees them about a very heated topic as gently as he can.

        Let's calm down guys, we are on the same team.
        Sorry but I respectfully must disagree regarding Mr. oddjob.
        How would you feel if you were blatantly lied about by someone who doesn't even know you?

        Also btw John (cesmotorsport) thank you for your contribution regarding dealings with ASR/Abid. This is extremely vital and we need to talk.

        Ranger
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Lock n Load Click here to enlarge
        Sorry but I respectfully must disagree regarding Mr. oddjob.
        How would you feel if you were blatantly lied about by someone who doesn't even know you?
        I understand your perspective Ranger. If someone blatantly was lying about me whom I did not even know I would not be happy with it.

        I have spent a lot of time with oddjob here though, he really isn't a bad guy. You guys are free to disagree.
      1. Itsbrokeagain's Avatar
        Itsbrokeagain -
        This just keeps unravelling.

        150 shot dry? On an M5 engine? I have only done 2 nitrous kits in my entire life but damn..that is a HUGE no no..especially on anything non domestic without extra fueling.

        And it was done BEFORE the Mass Airflow sensors? Like spraying through them? That is definetly a no no. You will ruin the sensors by doing that.
      1. PEI330Ci's Avatar
        PEI330Ci -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M5 Junky Click here to enlarge
        I still don't know what happened to my engine. Ever since I had installed the nitrous I had 3 times where a loud THUD happened when hitting it. The third time was the charm when it spun a rod. Abid told me when I shipped it back to him that he "inspected it" and that one of the wrist pins on one of the pistons was super thin, and that's why it spun. Have no idea the truth. I've gotten feed back from others and they say what probably happened was one hell of an explosion occurred in one of the cylinders and that's what broke it.. Who knows. I never saw the internal parts that Abid said were faulty from BMW. I doubt this was the case. I believe ALL M engines are hand assembled. I would think a guy putting the engine together on the BMW line would have caught it. Dunno. I always ran a 150 shot. Abid told me once that I could do a 250 before I went to Dallas, but I was too nervous to try it, so I never tried it. (reason for not trying it.. The Dyno shop I used to go to locally had an explosion, and fire at it because some kid came into my guys Dyno shop - said he was doing a 150 shot on a camaro, but was really doing a 250. Guy fried the shop backwall - so I thought "not a good idea"). I stayed safe, or at least I thought I was safe. It's funny you say they were taking the bigger shots. I wonder from time to time how everyone else's set ups are doing that ASR did for NOS. We never hear, but I'm sure that's what did juan's and my car in. No trying to spread a $#@! storm over NOS now, but I wonder from time to time - that's all..
        Nitrous Backfire.

        Usually happens at lower RPMs, (If activation point is too low) and system is lean. Can happen at low RPMs when system has good AFR as well with too low RPM activation point. Basically, the spark plug can't handle the heat and causes a backfire.

        I was highly suspicious how the S85 was making 150hp more without changing the spark plugs. Also from a tuning perspective, I would want it in writing how much timing was being pulled from the stock ECU before I hit the "go" button.

        I would be highly suspicious of any dry nitrous system installed before the MAF expecting it to "compensate" the right amount of fuel based on air density...and further in the intake manifold, air temp. The MAF is going going to compensate for the increase in air density with nitrous added, not the molecular change in the Oxygen ratio. Looking at the compensation tables for some factory ECUs, they just don't have the range to magically compensate for nitrous. However, if you had a piggyback controller installed that changed the duty cycle of the fuel injectors....that's a whole other story. Thing is...the only way I know of doing that would add about $2k to the installation hardware, and the ASR "kits" couldn't have included that in their price.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M5 Junky Click here to enlarge
        I'm not a nitrous guru at all, but it was a dry shot. Yes Juan had the same issue, but not as severe as mine. He didn't crack a block.

        Would you know this answer?? when Classic BMW called me to pick my car up from Dallas after the explosion. He gave me a run down of what was wrong.. He told me that my NOS nozzles were installed wrong at the intakes. He told me that the driver side was pointing towards the intake, and the passenger side was pointing away from the intake. He said both should be pointing towards the intake. I told Abid this and he said no it's installed right. I believed him - I had no reason to not?? What do you think? Why wouldn't they both be pointing in? Classic said that was creating a bad balance for the spray. ????
        The direction isn't as critical as some think, but it can make a difference, and it is a detail that shows neglect. If the nozzle is several feet from the intake valve, it's much less critical than if it's 6" from the valve in a DP setup. I don't think this anomaly is the route cause of the engine failure(s) described.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Bimmerbear Click here to enlarge
        Wow, that's ridiculous. ASR has done a direct port build before. I thought it would have been standard for any nitrous build they did.

        http://www.audiboost.com/images/impo...11/01/1165.jpg
        As pretty as that setup is, I've seen issues with "rail" based distribution systems. I won't get into my direct experiences, but will point those interested towards the "plenum" systems now popular in 10.5 and Pro Mod cars. They are feeding 4 cylinders per rail, and use a solenoid on both ends to help even out distribution. Even then, the jetting is adjusted for the center 2 cylinders. The ASR setup picture above is feeding from one end, and I can see there being a difference in flow across the 5 cylinders in each bank as a result. It may have worked for a period of time, but it made me nervous.

        That's all I have time to comment on for now....
      1. DBFIU's Avatar
        DBFIU -
        Wait so they were selling nitrous kits with no tuning and expected the stock MAF to understand what was happening to O2?

        The stock MAF can measure mass flow but not oxygen content as nitrous oxide has more O2 in than air, which is right what you said. What the hell was included in the kit?
      1. jacobs323i's Avatar
        jacobs323i -
        Abid u r scum and you will get what is coming to you! Everyone that acts like you always gets the bad end of karma! Click here to enlarge