• ESS is attempting to back out of the dyno event they themselves requested?


      Roman at ESS is now attempting to back out of the tuner dyno day shootout. I would like to remind everyone, ESS requested this dyno comparison themselves and asked BimmerBoost to schedule it. Now that the date is nearing, ESS is going back on their word at the last minute

      I received this e-mail from Roman:

      Quote Originally Posted by Roman
      Joseph / Sticky

      I have been well aware of your communication with AJ in regards to your dyno event. I have also seen your post on mfest where you accuse AJ of agreeing to attend your scheduled event. I find it odd that you would schedule an event like this without any confirmation from AJ that he could attend due to his current work in Europe . The following email responses from AJ to your request seem to be very clear that he wanted to attend your event but could not commit to your dates and that he would follow up with you when he could. I have seen the emails and I do not see the one where you gave AJ a date and he agreed to be there.


      "Hi Joseph,

      I am currently back in Europe putting the finishing touches on our soon to be released V10 SC system, I have not confirmed return flight to the US yet as that depends on when development here is finished. I hope to be back mid-late August, is there any chance the event can be planned after that? If not I will look into flying out there from Europe if time allows it."


      "Joseph,

      I am not quite sure yet as my return depends on completion of the MSS65 SC work. I will keep you posted as soon as I know.

      I think the 14th may be to soon as we are doing a airfield event here in Scandinavia with the E60 M5 SC that weekend."


      I believe AJ has been very cordial in answering your questions and sending you dyno info at your request. He has also been very open with wanting to help you put together a dyno event to prove to you and the other doubters in your camp how our products perform. During this time you have continued to make untrue statements about our company in an attempt to promote the vendors that sponsor your car and your website. The most recent is the post you made on e90post in regards to our NA software. You continue to say one thing to us and do another on the forums. You might feel that because you make anonymous accounts on these forums you can hide your ID from others while taking your usual shots at our company but you and I both know the truth.


      Do to your continued actions I feel that it is best if we terminate communications with you as you seem to have a very obvious motive when it comes to our company and the products we make.

      .
      Roman Zepeda
      ESS Performance Products
      E-Mail : roman@esstuning.com
      Web : www.esstuning.com
      Tel : (602)751-0571
      This was my response:

      Quote Originally Posted by Sticky
      First of all Roman, I never asked to schedule an event. Asbjorn made the request to me on the 11th of May for a dyno comparison this summer:

      "On another note, would you guys be up for a friendly dyno shootout in CA this summer? We would be glad to bring out a few cars for some comparisons under identical conditions. I would also like to meet some of you guys in person to talk about various things you have questions about as I feel this internet hostility serves no purpose. We have absolutely nothing to hide, and I would like to prove it to you.

      Regards,

      Asbjorn"

      I told him I would schedule the event:

      "Absolutely, I would be more than happy to host a dyno shootout. I have been trying to get this done for some time but no one has been willing to agree. Of course the internet hostility serves no purpose and my desire was to point out legitimate questions but then everyone starts fighting with personal politics on the other boards. "

      This was the response from Asbjorn:

      "It would be a lot of fun doing some friendly comparo's and posting the results! :-)"

      At no point am I told not to go forward with this. ESS suggested this themselves and said it would be fun, so I did what was requested of me to accommodate ESS. I scheduled the event for late-July since ESS said "summer" and gave no specific date. Well, late July apparently did not work as per Asbjorn being in Europe. Despite that, he says he will fly out if necessary:

      "I am currently back in Europe putting the finishing touches on our soon to be released V10 SC system, I have not confirmed return flight to the US yet as that depends on when development here is finished. I hope to be back mid-late August, is there any chance the event can be planned after that? If not I will look into flying out there from Europe if time allows it."

      I reschedule the event to accommodate ESS and update Asbjorn on that. At no point am I told he can not make it. He says he will be back mid-August, I make it late August as he REQUESTED the event to be rescheduled which is confirmation of attendance. ESS suggested the event, suggested the time frame, and suggested it be organized. I have complied in every possible respect. I have spent considerable time and money making this happen as requested. I'm not sure what else you could possibly want of me, I have gone above and beyond fulfilling your demands for a dyno day with a dynojet, boost logging, and dates in the most professional and respectful manner possible.

      I do not post on e90post, so you have me confused with someone else. Secondly, I am not in any camp. As a matter of fact, I have contacted ESS from the very earliest days requesting products for my car only to be rebuked and not followed up with.

      Asbjorn has agreed in principle to attend and suggested the event himself which I complied with. It seems now that the date is coming close you are attempting to back out. I will hold ESS accountable for the time and cost. Many companies have arranged their schedules around this event and you have led me on for almost 4 months now. If you would like to terminate the event, I will accept reimbursement for all the accrued time, fees, and potential lost revenue.

      Remember, ESS made the request for the event, confirmed, and asked for a reschedule. The entire point of the event was to alleviate any doubts so what motives do I have? To actually have a real third party comparison with all the tuners in one place? The product is supposed to speak for itself but you are not letting it. What was the point of all that talk when you requested a dyno challenge with Powerchip? Well, you have it, why are you not keeping your word? This is not professional behavior in the slightest. I hope this is simply a misunderstanding that we can work out and I would like to make it clear I fully have the best of intentions. That would also be why I even offered accommodations for Asbjorn at my expense. I hope we can work this out and I look forward to ESS honoring its word.

      - Joseph - BimmerBoost.com
      We have over a half dozen companies waiting on ESS. BMS has agreed and has been patiently waiting. MHP agreed although the date change now inconvenience them. Gintani agreed and said they would accept the date change for ESS. OE Tuning agreed and said they accept the date change to wait for ESS. Powerchip said they do not mind the date change and look forward to it. Vishnu has agreed in proxy and we also have GIAC representation. G-power is ready with their supercharger representation.

      BimmerBoost has worked tirelessly to make this event happen at substantial cost as any of these companies can attest. We have been on the phones and e-mailing back and forth for what is almost 4 months now.

      ESS requested this event, led everyone on, and now is backing down from their own challenge. BimmerBoost has considerable cost tied to the event and will not simply let it go. DC Performance has a large amount of revenue dependent on the event. Literally dozens of people, companies will be hurt financially and inconvenienced by ESS not honoring its own request.

      We would like the BMW community to encourage ESS to participate as they had agreed, please contact Roman and make it known you would like to see the event take place as planned:

      Roman Zepeda
      ESS Performance Products
      E-Mail : roman@esstuning.com
      Web : www.esstuning.com
      Tel : (602)751-057
      This article was originally published in forum thread: ESS is attempting to back out of the dyno event they themselves requested? started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 167 Comments
      1. BzzzBom's Avatar
        BzzzBom -
        October -- Too much BS for me. I'm out
      1. bash535i's Avatar
        bash535i -
        So this contest is basically just a big P!55ING contest for those who already have a tune I guess. I mean I hope there's nobody out there other than me that may have been waiting for the shootout to help determine what to buy. If you lease your car because you want to swap it out every couple of years, it just drives the cost of tune/month up. I've driven my 535i for 2 years without a tune and thought I'd see which tune would work best for me, buy one and drive it for another year before turning it in.

        There's no way I'm going to see what happens in Octocember or whenever it turns out to be and then buy a tune to use for half a year. Again, the info eventually gained might be cool for those who plan to keep the N54, but so far, I'm thinking this is a good engine to run hard, put up wet and in a couple of years, see what the next big thing is. Besides, only one vendor will come out on top and then it will be six months of arguing over how max hp didn't really reflect what you see on the track and in normal driving, so it's not going to be definitive on anything.

        Really disappointing.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BzzzBom Click here to enlarge
        October -- Too much BS for me. I'm out
        I'm sorry to hear that, did not realize that was a busy month for you.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bash535i Click here to enlarge
        So this contest is basically just a big P!55ING contest for those who already have a tune I guess. I mean I hope there's nobody out there other than me that may have been waiting for the shootout to help determine what to buy. If you lease your car because you want to swap it out every couple of years, it just drives the cost of tune/month up. I've driven my 535i for 2 years without a tune and thought I'd see which tune would work best for me, buy one and drive it for another year before turning it in.

        There's no way I'm going to see what happens in Octocember or whenever it turns out to be and then buy a tune to use for half a year. Again, the info eventually gained might be cool for those who plan to keep the N54, but so far, I'm thinking this is a good engine to run hard, put up wet and in a couple of years, see what the next big thing is. Besides, only one vendor will come out on top and then it will be six months of arguing over how max hp didn't really reflect what you see on the track and in normal driving, so it's not going to be definitive on anything.

        Really disappointing.
        You will see plenty of results and be able to come to your own conclusion, why not exactly? Why is it if it happens this month things all of a sudden change for you?

        I'm getting really disappointed with the entitled posts that sound like they are coming from spoiled children. This event is being done for your benefit at tremendous cost and involving a lot of work. You guys aren't paying for anything yet getting all the results for free and complaining about a date change? Big deal, an extra month or two won't kill you.
      1. bash535i's Avatar
        bash535i -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I'm getting really disappointed with the entitled posts that sound like they are coming from spoiled children.
        Spoiled children? Really? Can you find any posts where I asked anyone to do anything for me? Granted, you're taking control and bearing the burden of cost, scheduling, etc... which is very commendable. However, if I remember correctly (I don't read this or any other board daily), there have been two dates cancelled already. I simply was hoping to see the results of what you have started, when you committed to having them.

        Watch some spoiled kids play for a while when things don't go as they had planned. "You're not playing fair, or I didn't get to shoot the ball as much as the other boy or I didn't get on or get to pick the team I wanted or etc...", the typical spoiled kid response, "It's my ball and I'm taking it home even if I did say that we'd play with it today. I'll bring it back out when I want." In the same scenario, the other kids who all showed up to watch or play based on the first kid's invitation are ticked off and gripe a little because of the first kids actions. In this example, who is spoiled?

        Commitment is something that spoiled children usually lack. Expectation of another man following through on a commitment is something most most responsible adults have of each other. Just my two cents for however long they stay here before the banning commences.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bash535i Click here to enlarge
        Spoiled children? Really? Can you find any posts where I asked anyone to do anything for me? Granted, you're taking control and bearing the burden of cost, scheduling, etc... which is very commendable. However, if I remember correctly (I don't read this or any other board daily), there have been two dates cancelled already. I simply was hoping to see the results of what you have started, when you committed to having them.

        Watch some spoiled kids play for a while when things don't go as they had planned. "You're not playing fair, or I didn't get to shoot the ball as much as the other boy or I didn't get on or get to pick the team I wanted or etc...", the typical spoiled kid response, "It's my ball and I'm taking it home even if I did say that we'd play with it today. I'll bring it back out when I want." In the same scenario, the other kids who all showed up to watch or play based on the first kid's invitation are ticked off and gripe a little because of the first kids actions. In this example, who is spoiled?

        Commitment is something that spoiled children usually lack. Expectation of another man following through on a commitment is something most most responsible adults have of each other. Just my two cents for however long they stay here before the banning commences.
        You are going to see the results exactly as I committed to giving them so I don't see the issue. I don't understand why people are having an issue with a date change when it was caused by ESS, not me. If anything, I have tried my best to make this happen as quickly as possible.

        I just don't see your scenario being relevant at all as the spoiled insinuation is that people complain when they don't get what they want when they want, which is, the nearest date. People complaining about an event they aren't paying for is a bit extreme and if anyone is upset they should direct their complaints to Roman @ ESS for creating an inconvenience for everyone.

        Yes, commitment is something spoiled children lack although perhaps they are committed to being spoiled Click here to enlarge Regardless, only one party did not honor their commitment here so if you have any issues with a date you should take it up with them. I am following through on the event I promised everyone but I need time to give people what I promised to give them due to someone breaking their commitment. I'm not sure how much clear I can be on this.

        What banning is supposed to commence exactly? Not even sure where you are going with this but no one has even brought this up and it certainly is not applicable.

        If a date shift is so upsetting on the event I am still making happen and only modifying, I will offer a complimentary tune to be raffled off at the event to show goodwill and my apologies for the inconvenience I am not even responsible for.
      1. Powerchip's Avatar
        Powerchip -
        Powerchip remains committed to having it's products tested in a public forum, and hope that a test of software for m3, 335i and 335d can still take place in the near future.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Powerchip Click here to enlarge
        Powerchip remains committed to having it's products tested in a public forum, and hope that a test of software for m3, 335i and 335d can still take place in the near future.
        Thank you, that is the attitude we like to see and we never had any doubts with Powerchip.
      1. bash535i's Avatar
        bash535i -
        Sorry Sticky. I've got lot's of other things going on in my life (daughter fighting Leukemia for 9 mos in hospital) that causes a lot of little things to get under my skin and it's not uncommon for me to ramble on a bit. Heck, for most of us, our cars are not much more than toys, so it's nothing to get upset about either way. I don't see you offering a free tune as anything necessary. You're 100% right, the guys who backed out are the ones lacking commitment. Frankly, I wouldn't care if their tune was better and waiting for them seems irrelevant now. If they can't keep their commitment to you and the bimmerboost community when so many other vendors have, why would we put their product in our cars without a good reason to believe that they would honor any commitment of assistance related to their product?

        Either way, I'm sure the event will be very appreciated. Consider this my apology and last post related to this topic.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bash535i Click here to enlarge
        Sorry Sticky. I've got lot's of other things going on in my life (daughter fighting Leukemia for 9 mos in hospital) that causes a lot of little things to get under my skin and it's not uncommon for me to ramble on a bit. Heck, for most of us, our cars are not much more than toys, so it's nothing to get upset about either way. I don't see you offering a free tune as anything necessary. You're 100% right, the guys who backed out are the ones lacking commitment. Frankly, I wouldn't care if their tune was better and waiting for them seems irrelevant now. If they can't keep their commitment to you and the bimmerboost community when so many other vendors have, why would we put their product in our cars without a good reason to believe that they would honor any commitment of assistance related to their product?

        Either way, I'm sure the event will be very appreciated. Consider this my apology and last post related to this topic.
        I feel the same way, I don't care whose tune is better. Everyone is taking the same risk, let the cars speak. Oh well, maybe one day.

        No, I want to offer a free tune just to show how dedicated I am to the members here. That is my choice, and even though it is not necessary, I will do it. Most of the work I do is not necessary but I do it anyway to show my dedication/determination.

        I'm sorry about your daughter, not sure how to respond to that. Puts this car nonsense in perspective, we waste too much time on the stuff that isn't important.
      1. Pious Poodle's Avatar
        Pious Poodle -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I am still going to do everything I can to accommodate ESS and if i have to spend money yet again to pick another date, so be it.

        Despite the blatant disrespect they have shown me, I will continue to treat them with the respect I feel everyone involved in BMW tuning should show one another.

        I will do whatever it takes to make this happen. If the only way this happens is if ESS needs it to take place on the moon, I'm becoming an astronaut.
        But would you be willing to step out of it and having somebody else run it if thats whats necessary? It sounds like thats what they really want.
      1. xxe92xx's Avatar
        xxe92xx -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Powerchip Click here to enlarge
        Powerchip remains committed to having it's products tested in a public forum, and hope that a test of software for m3, 335i and 335d can still take place in the near future.
        +1
      1. Pious Poodle's Avatar
        Pious Poodle -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Pious Poodle Click here to enlarge
        But would you be willing to step out of it and having somebody else run it if thats whats necessary? It sounds like thats what they really want.
        Just sayin here that might be whats necessary if you want this to happen. If I had some dog biting me for a couple of years and then got an invitation from the dogs owner to come pet the dog I dont think I'd want to go.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Pious Poodle Click here to enlarge
        But would you be willing to step out of it and having somebody else run it if thats whats necessary? It sounds like thats what they really want.
        I'm not running it, I never was, the shop was. That is why their excuse holds no water, I just helped organize.

        There is nothing that can be done to please them, the dyno shop is third party as is the operator as they requested. I'm not running anything.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Pious Poodle Click here to enlarge
        Just sayin here that might be whats necessary if you want this to happen. If I had some dog biting me for a couple of years and then got an invitation from the dogs owner to come pet the dog I dont think I'd want to go.
        Would be a bit different if you were the one who initiated the invitation by asking for it yourself, right?
      1. ScrotieMcBoogerBalls's Avatar
        ScrotieMcBoogerBalls -
        Sticky,
        sup man?
        Whats the new ETA date?
        Let me know,
        Thank you
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by unfor Click here to enlarge
        Sticky,
        sup man?
        Whats the new ETA date?
        Let me know,
        Thank you
        I will, just finishing up the final details.
      1. MHP LLC's Avatar
        MHP LLC -
        Good God sticky ...

        No question you went above and beyond in scheduling and I'm only on page 1 at this point, very sorry to hear about the wasted time/energy.
      1. MHP LLC's Avatar
        MHP LLC -
        Yea after reading all 6 it sucks even more.

        Anyone that doesn't give sticky props for doing what he's done, essentially stand on his head to make this event happen, is not paying the man his dues.

        Try organizing an event of this magnitude yourself if you don't feel the same, believe me it's not an easy thing to do.


        Thanks
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by MHP LLC Click here to enlarge
        Yea after reading all 6 it sucks even more.

        Anyone that doesn't give sticky props for doing what he's done, essentially stand on his head to make this event happen, is not paying the man his dues.

        Try organizing an event of this magnitude yourself if you don't feel the same, believe me it's not an easy thing to do.

        I appreciate it, I just want to make it happen.

        I don't understand companies that sit there and talk smack all day but will never meet anyone on the track or dyno. What it even worse is if they ask to do so and then waste everyone's time. Just mind boggling really.