• M157 bi-turbo V8 in 63 AMG models to be killed off after this generation? Mercedes says more power brings reliability concerns and hybrids are the future of AMG

      The M157 V8 will at some point be replaced. This happens to all motors eventually as technology and emissions standards continue to evolve. AMG's head Tobias Moers provides what amounts to a cop out stating, “Honestly, with 900Nm and 585hp with that engine, if I look for more than for reliability it is the end of that engine." Heh, really? And you're the head of AMG good sir? The M133 in the CLA56 AMG puts out 180 horsepower per liter completely stock.


      The M157 in comparison even in the new AMG S models when rated at 585 horsepower is at 106 horsepower per liter. This motor is hardly stressed as aftermarket tunes gaining over 100 horsepower (at the wheels) show. Not to mention there are turbo upgrades out and a plethora of motors that can be shown as an example of more horsepower with far less displacement. The Supra, the Nissan GT-R, BMW E46 M3, all of these have shown triple digit figures from comparatively small six-cylinders.

      AMG themselves adds power to these motors with just a software flash so what Tobias is peddling here is a load of BS. What is going to happen is the new 4.0 liter M177/M178 motor under development will eventually replace the M157. Downsizing to meet emissions standards is simply a reality that is taking place with OEM manufacturers.

      Plus it is not like the smaller motor will be less stressed than the M157 and hybrid technology is not the solution for making up the displacement disadvantage especially with the weight a hybrid drivetrain adds.

      Regardless, it seems hybrids are the future for AMG, "It’s clear depending on the segment – large SUVs, S-Class, whatever – in the future they will be assisted by electric motors… but there is no decision done, it is a discussion that must be done.” This he states despite no official decision on it yet.

      Gentlemen, enjoy the golden age of internal combustion horsepower while it lasts. The future will be filled with smaller motors assisted by electric motors.

      Source
      This article was originally published in forum thread: This kind of sucks started by nielsll View original post
      Comments 25 Comments
      1. DFM's Avatar
        DFM -
        Lame
      1. BlackJetE90OC's Avatar
        BlackJetE90OC -
        At least they are staying with 8 cylinders, unlike the M3/M4.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BlackJetE90OC Click here to enlarge
        At least they are staying with 8 cylinders, unlike the M3/M4.
        BMW is staying with 8 cylinders too though.
      1. BlackJetE90OC's Avatar
        BlackJetE90OC -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        BMW is staying with 8 cylinders too though.
        Just not in the car I am interested in, the M3/M4.

        I don't want a fat whale, in order to get a V8.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BlackJetE90OC Click here to enlarge
        Just not in the car I am interested in, the M3/M4.

        I don't want a fat whale, in order to get a V8.
        I hear you.
      1. 63Master's Avatar
        63Master -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I hear you.
        Why cant I start threads?
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 63Master Click here to enlarge
        Why cant I start threads?
        Because you are in a limited usergroup due to all your past abuse. I suggest trying different behavior.
      1. TT C6's Avatar
        TT C6 -
        http://www.autoblog.com/2013/09/19/m...v8-going-away/


        This is a sad day.
        I am seriously considering the 2015 C63, but I had hoped it would get the 5.5L TT. Click here to enlarge
        I hope the 4.0L TT turns out to be a beast.
      1. PianoProdigy's Avatar
        PianoProdigy -
        Should help the resale value of my ML63
      1. nawlinstornado's Avatar
        nawlinstornado -
        If they really build this thing like two M133 engines, the 4.0 could be quite potent. While I doubt it would reach the 180hp/l of the CLA, just hitting 150/l would be impressive. Coupled with some weight savings, it might be pretty awesome.
      1. leveraged sellout's Avatar
        leveraged sellout -
        So long as the 4.0 sees similar specific output levels as the 2.0, should be in good shape. Can you imagine having a 700 hp factory E63? My god. Although, I am really wondering what the aftermarket will look like. AMS and Weistec are both looking into built engine options for the M157, so it seems to me that you don't really want to go more than 200hp/liter on that engine with stock internals. Hopefully the new smaller engines won't be the end of 100 whp ECU tunes, but might be. Either way, with potentially 650-700 hp potential stock, there won't be much need Click here to enlarge
      1. 63Master's Avatar
        63Master -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Because you are in a limited usergroup due to all your past abuse. I suggest trying different behavior.
        Agreed. You already knocked me out in the negative for that. How could I cause harm by simply starting threads about cars?
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 63Master Click here to enlarge
        Agreed. You already knocked me out in the negative for that. How could I cause harm by simply starting threads about cars?
        Move on, talk about cars, and enjoy the forum.
      1. DXBE63's Avatar
        DXBE63 -
        what ever they come up with, I am sure it would be as impressive as the M157. Remember how everyone complained about it when they decided to depart from the naturally aspirated AMG v8s?
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DXBE63 Click here to enlarge
        what ever they come up with, I am sure it would be as impressive as the M157. Remember how everyone complained about it when they decided to depart from the naturally aspirated AMG v8s?
        Read: http://www.benzboost.com/content.php...-and-CAMTRONIC
      1. DXBE63's Avatar
        DXBE63 -
        I remeber watching the dyno pull renntech made with a A45, I think they concluded that its engine made about 400hp at the crank. So I assume if then 4.0 is based on that, it can easily make 650hp+ and this could give it the edge over Audi and BMW.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DXBE63 Click here to enlarge
        I remeber watching the dyno pull renntech made with a A45, I think they concluded that its engine made about 400hp at the crank. So I assume if then 4.0 is based on that, it can easily make 650hp+ and this could give it the edge over Audi and BMW.
        It will have plenty of capability. Audi's 4.0 TFSI is showing you can make a ton of power from a 4.0 liter even with just a tune.
      1. TT C6's Avatar
        TT C6 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        It will have plenty of capability. Audi's 4.0 TFSI is showing you can make a ton of power from a 4.0 liter even with just a tune.
        The flipside of the argument is why not just buy the 2013+ Audi S6 instead......
        I am warming up to the idea of a 4.0L in the C63, but I still want the M157 and might just buy a S6 if the C63 doesn't get the M157.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by TT C6 Click here to enlarge
        The flipside of the argument is why not just buy the 2013+ Audi S6 instead......
        I am warming up to the idea of a 4.0L in the C63, but I still want the M157 and might just buy a S6 if the C63 doesn't get the M157.
        Because the S6 will be much heavier? Additionally, the S6 turbos are restrictive so to get to the S8 level you need to change the turbos/manifold.

        I do understand your point though.
      1. DXBE63's Avatar
        DXBE63 -
        I remember a video that Matt Farah posted through the smoking tire channel saying that 4.0TSI in the S8 might have a different rotating assembly than the S6. Not only intake manifolds amd turbos. Cant remember though.