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    • 335/N54 fanboys get panties in a twist over a bolt on DCT E92 M3 pulling a JB4 tuned bolt on 335i

      Oh yes, here we go the millionth time, the ever popular 335 versus M3 discussion. A user posted the video below of a bolt on DCT E92 M3 pulling a JB4 tuned 335i in the forums and the N54 fanboys went for the pitchforks and torches. For whatever reason 335 owners in particular seem to really want to attack the E92 M3 perhaps in justification of their own purchase. There is the typical "oh I didn't get an M3 because a tuned 335 is faster" nonsense that N54 fanboys tend to comfort themselves with in the never ending M3 versus 335 debate.


      Even though the 335 in this video may have more power and torque in tuned form which the fanboys love to point out the other side of the coin is that the M3's redline and transmission are a huge advantage. Gearing is an area the M3 simply has an advantage over the 335 in and the transmission makes a big difference as one can see the shift speed in lower gears is really what gives the M3 the gains it sees in the race early on.

      Up top, the tuned 335's horsepower advantage comes into play as the cars spend more time in gear negating the gear change advantage provided by the DCT allowing the 335 to inch up and close the gap.

      This video is a good real world example as without race gas or meth a 335 will struggle against a tuned M3 especially one with DCT. Of course 335 owners will point out they can upgrade their turbos. Then M3 owners will say they can supercharge. Then the debate escalates and escalate and there are dozens of pages to read of M3 and 335 owners essentially throwing feces at each other. BMW fans, just enjoy 335 versus M3 round 400,000 in the video below.

      M3 is the camera car.

      This article was originally published in forum thread: New video-DCT m3 takes down a FBO 335 with jb4, downpipes, FMIC and intake started by Wannbm5 View original post
      Comments 315 Comments
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by justohigh Click here to enlarge
        ow is being able to rev high= to being built strong?
        Take a look at piston speeds sometime.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
        and i'm sure both motors will keep playing leapfrog until people get sick of spending so much... or yours exceeds all expectations and makes stupid power haha
        It isn't leapfrog, it was always game over since the beginning. It's no contest. The N54 would need to turn into an S54. Not happening.
      1. Flinchy's Avatar
        Flinchy -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        It isn't leapfrog, it was always game over since the beginning. It's no contest. The N54 would need to turn into an S54. Not happening.
        can't quite say that yet i don't think haha

        no one has properly wrecked an N54 yet Click here to enlarge

        it aint over until that happens! haha

        the S65 may be superior in many engineering aspects, that isn't up for debate.. but game over is a bit unfair
      1. BMWJunkie's Avatar
        BMWJunkie -
        S65 is so much stronger with bearing issues and i've personally seen two with broken valve springs.

        From VAC "We all know the S65 has a rod bearing issue. Not all engines suffer from premature bearing wear/failure, but enough do. We have had quite a few S65s through our machine shop and some showed some serious wear :-( BMW has had rather embarrassing issues with rod bearings in the past so we wanted to get ahead of the curve and release the 3 proven products that will strengthen our favorite BMW engines Click here to enlarge For those interested in the ultimate in oil management, our billet dry sump kit is for you!"
      1. BMWJunkie's Avatar
        BMWJunkie -
        Attachment 31099

        I think its funny they have a "blown motor registery" on m3post.

        http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=786615
      1. G0TB00ST?'s Avatar
        G0TB00ST? -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Stock block stock heads.
        @Justtohigh i was right
      1. justohigh's Avatar
        justohigh -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by G0TB00ST? Click here to enlarge
        @Jus ttohigh i was right
        I just figured all the time his car spent on the sidelines that it was being built.
      1. G0TB00ST?'s Avatar
        G0TB00ST? -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by justohigh Click here to enlarge
        I just figured all the time his car spent on the sidelines that it was being built.
        I know he's getting his teams built, but ill leave that for another thread
      1. Wedge1967's Avatar
        Wedge1967 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Omg this same idiotic point again. Another person trying to tell others what they need to realize when he doesn't realize 570 whp M3's are putting down the same trap speeds as the Vishnu single turbo in the mid 650's. How do you explain that?

        Someone focusing on engine torque figures again, wonderful. Still the common poster does not get it.

        I'll never make the same torque as some of these big turbo cars but I'll annihilate them. The M3 doesn't need more peak torque it's where it makes its torque that matters. God damn...
        You of all people to comment about this. LOL You should have showed up at shift sector so you could have got your @$$ handed to you... The video is lower RPM rolling start, so don't tell me a high torque car won't pull on a low torque car... Talk about common sense. You can see what a FBO 335 does to a e92 M3 with FBO mods and tune... I provided two examples and yet you want to throw out trap speeds. WTF LOL It's nice that your charged M can run the same traps up top, just shows you're making good WHP... But don't forget who gets there quicker, torque... Smoke that in your tail pipe.. haha
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Wedge1967 Click here to enlarge
        BTW, don't get me wrong... I would love to have an M3, especially this one....

        http://youtu.be/8md-YC82KOI
        The only thing "wrong" with the G-Power stuff is the cost.... The Evolve is a very, very close 2nd to that.

        And this is going to honestly be an on going battle. The N54 has clearly shown itself to be a much more capable power platform on a stock motor (S65s hitting high 500s, the N54 sitting just over 700 WHP with possibly more room) and for a significantly lower investment, but for all we know that can be changed with the Gintani TT kit. It's completely worthless though to compare built motor S65s (like Stickys) against high HP N54s (the Vargas Stage 3 or Vishnu ST) until people start building the motor. YES the N54 was built for boost, but until someone builds an N54, we're making an apples v oranges comparison.


        Honestly, I just want a Vargas Stage 3 and a Gintani YSI (both 6MTs) to line up & have them run against each other.
      1. G0TB00ST?'s Avatar
        G0TB00ST? -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by G0TB00ST? Click here to enlarge
        I know he's getting his teams built, but ill leave that for another thread
        I meant trans
      1. Wedge1967's Avatar
        Wedge1967 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        The only thing "wrong" with the G-Power stuff is the cost.... The Evolve is a very, very close 2nd to that.

        And this is going to honestly be an on going battle. The N54 has clearly shown itself to be a much more capable power platform on a stock motor (S65s hitting high 500s, the N54 sitting just over 700 WHP with possibly more room) and for a significantly lower investment, but for all we know that can be changed with the Gintani TT kit. It's completely worthless though to compare built motor S65s (like Stickys) against high HP N54s (the Vargas Stage 3 or Vishnu ST) until people start building the motor. YES the N54 was built for boost, but until someone builds an N54, we're making an apples v oranges comparison.


        Honestly, I just want a Vargas Stage 3 and a Gintani YSI (both 6MTs) to line up & have them run against each other.
        Not sure why people keep throwing out comps anyway with regard to 335 vs M3. The 335 is a better daily driver and with mods is a quick straight line car. But if you want to track your car, the M is a better choice no doubt in my mind. Granted, the 335 can be setup to track also. So depending on the argument, which this was straight line performance, there is no question in my mind I would take the 335 $ for $.
      1. Wannbm5's Avatar
        Wannbm5 -
        I assume most n54 guys would atleast admit a P31 C63 would beat a fbo n54? Here is a catless m3 taking a C63 P31 and leading the way up until really high speeds where c63 claws back. Maybe someone can explain this as well as they did the initial video. Right
      1. G0TB00ST?'s Avatar
        G0TB00ST? -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Wedge1967 Click here to enlarge
        Not sure why people keep throwing out comps anyway with regard to 335 vs M3. The 335 is a better daily driver and with mods is a quick straight line car. But if you want to track your car, the M is a better choice no doubt in my mind. Granted, the 335 can be setup to track also. So depending on the argument, which this was straight line performance, there is no question in my mind I would take the 335 $ for $.
        /thread
      1. ChuckD05's Avatar
        ChuckD05 -
        wannab5 go buy an m5 and stfu please...

        FYI my 135i Manual beat jonsc63 oe tuned c63 that has the fastest 60-130s for non LTH NA c63s .... quicker than a p31. so no we dont agree.... i would love nothing more than to be able to run any of these said cars but my car is a rotting disaster filled with bad luck not allowing me too.

        now a days with the more aggressive tunes, a full bolt on n54 IN THE RIGHT HANDS will beat a otherwise stock p31 c63 or m3 dct to whatever speed you want to go to. do p31 c63s trap 123-125? no they dont...

        should i show you videos of all the cars Terry beats and than just proclaim n54s are faster than all of those cars too... 1 video of joe blow the moron racing doesnt prove a damn thing..

        as far as the m3 goes... i do not agree its a better motor to drive on the street at all.. i extensively test drove the two cars before my last purchase and i could not get over the lack of tq down low... if you drive like a 18 year old testosterone filled moron above 6k every driving second of your life sure its exhilarating but i could not get over the lack of low end tq and miserable passing power without downshifting on the highway in comparison to my fbo 135 at the time...

        I dig the m3 , would def like to own one, but i feel the lack of low end grunt outweighs the pros unless u drive like speed racer. The overall car is superior for sure.. but as a DD the n54 MOTOR is better.. suspension, tranny, and looks all inferior.


        but i prob shouldn't continue to

        Click here to enlarge
      1. Wedge1967's Avatar
        Wedge1967 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Wannbm5 Click here to enlarge
        I assume most n54 guys would atleast admit a P31 C63 would beat a fbo n54? Here is a catless m3 taking a C63 P31 and leading the way up until really high speeds where c63 claws back. Maybe someone can explain this as well as they did the initial video.
        Haha, a C63 is NO match for a well tuned FBO 335 running 100% e85 and 100% Meth. Don't believe me? Watch the video... Kid got his @$$ handed to him. LOL



        Also, I see a few people disliked my other videos where I spanked a couple of modified and tuned M3's. Truth hurts doesn't it. F'n babies. I personally would take an M3 over a 335 any day. Doesn't negate the fact that a well tuned & modified 335 will hand you're @$$ to you in a drag. Get over it already...
      1. bobS's Avatar
        bobS -
        Lol

        Nice vid wedge

        If you haven't driven a well tuned 335, you should, it's a blast
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
        can't quite say that yet i don't think haha

        no one has properly wrecked an N54 yet Click here to enlarge

        it aint over until that happens! haha

        the S65 may be superior in many engineering aspects, that isn't up for debate.. but game over is a bit unfair
        It's a 4.0 liter V8 with 8400 rpm there isn't much that can be done to change that.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BMWJunkie Click here to enlarge
        S65 is so much stronger with bearing issues and i've personally seen two with broken valve springs.

        From VAC "We all know the S65 has a rod bearing issue. Not all engines suffer from premature bearing wear/failure, but enough do. We have had quite a few S65s through our machine shop and some showed some serious wear :-( BMW has had rather embarrassing issues with rod bearings in the past so we wanted to get ahead of the curve and release the 3 proven products that will strengthen our favorite BMW engines http://www.m3post.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif For those interested in the ultimate in oil management, our billet dry sump kit is for you!"
        Because BMW used bad bearings once again doesn't mean once you replace them or upgrade the cheap oiling system it doesn't remedy those issues.

        I personally bent a valve spring because BMW sent out a bad batch. Is it the parts BMW chose to use or the S65? Because weird when they have higher tolerances like in racing the motor is just fine.

        The point being the S65 is the ultimately stronger base because it is and always has been and always will be.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by justohigh Click here to enlarge
        I just figured all the time his car spent on the sidelines that it was being built.
        Did get built not sure what you are talking about.