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    • Harrop Engineering doing the "impossible" - Introducing the world's first positive displacement E92/E90/E92 S65 V8 supercharger

      Wow. That is exactly what came out of my mouth when I saw this supercharger kit at Bimmerfest. In all honesty, it was my main motivation for attending the event once I heard it would be there. Some people may be reading this and wondering what the big deal is as superchargers already exist for the M3. That is true, superchargers do exist, but they are all centrifugal style blowers. This is the world's first positive displacement supercharger for the S65 V8.

      Why is that a big deal? Because it's a completely different type of blower with completely different power delivery. This is the solution for those who complain about the M3's torque or for those who do not like the response down low of a centrifgual blower which needs rpm to make boost. This style of supercharger is always making boost, from anywhere in the rev range.

      That is what makes incorporating it on the S66 V8 difficult with its independent throttle bodies as positive displacement blowers usually are set to pull air through a throttle body not blow into it. The centrifugal blowers send air into a manifold. If a positive displacement were to use a similar setup it would be blowing air in while the throttle bodies attempted to close as it is always making boost. See the problem?

      The solution Harrop Engineering came up with was a manifold that fits in between the throttle bodies with a bypass valve fit that relieves pressure as needed and makes sure boost is not made as throttles are closing. Pretty trick setup eh? You can see the design in the photos and also how tight the packaging is. I do not even want to know how many hours were put in trying to get this all to fit.

      The blower employed is a TVS1740 unit from Eaton. This is a roots blower and likely will be set to 5.5 psi or so initially. Boost from this blower is different from a centrifugal and will be harder on the stock rods since it is at full boost right away. Expect horsepower in the low 500's to the wheels.

      Oh and see that little black box to the left of the manifold off a metal area at the inlet? There will be electronic boost control which is likely the first of its kind on a positive displacement setup although I am not able to confirm this. Different maps with different boost levels for different fuel? A possibility, yes.

      This is a big deal and an engineering feat for the S65. My complete and utter respect and that of this network to the guys at Harrop. There is still work to be done here. It is not quite ready although pricing is initially set at $12,990. There is still a lot of tuning to be done but this will be coming eventually.

      Pictures below, much respect Harrop and it was a pleasure meeting you guys at Bimmerfest. You were incredibly nice and answered all my (MANY) questions. Thank you:























      This article was originally published in forum thread: Harrop Engineering Twin Screw S65 V8 Supercharger started by CookieCrisp View original post
      Comments 276 Comments
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        compared to present company, im the Eisenstein of the S65
        That you might actually believe that says enough.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        negatives are tuning is more tedious, and dct/motor strength is unkown. tend to run more hot than others. i think its exciting, but we need ome information.

        Ive always said, 6-7 psi with one of these will be a whole different M3 than we are used to

        http://www.germanboost.com/showthrea...re-twin-screws
        This setup will be more harsh on the stock rods so it just won't be able to be pushed as much.

        Additionally, heat soak will be a bigger issue.

        But... it's going to be a $#@!load of fun.
      1. LostMarine's Avatar
        LostMarine -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        That you might actually believe that says enough.
        the fact that you cant argue it says even more.
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        This setup will be more harsh on the stock rods so it just won't be able to be pushed as much.

        Additionally, heat soak will be a bigger issue.

        But... it's going to be a $#@!load of fun.
        yea, we never had a Tq issue to worry about.. ill be intersting. DCT will be strained/maxed

        but $#@!, its gotta be giving the M just what its missing

        I suppose with your theory of tq multiplication + actual tq, its gonna be a $#@!ing tire roaster..
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        the fact that you cant argue it says even more.
        I'm supposed to argue delusions? Um, ok.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        I suppose with your theory of tq multiplication + actual tq, its gonna be a $#@!ing tire roaster..
        Torque multiplication isn't theory it's mathematical fact. Yes, this thing will make people go through tires awful fast.

        It's going to be a lot of fun and enhance the M engine character.
      1. ultimateendz's Avatar
        ultimateendz -
        twinscrews are ALOT of fun....ask me how I know Click here to enlarge
      1. mdrobnak's Avatar
        mdrobnak -
        Yes, and unfortunately very addicting. When I had my 2003 SVT Cobra Mustang, MPG varied wildly depending on how much I was pressing down on the go pedal. Click here to enlarge

        Avg: 16 MPG around town.
        Best: 26 MPG from NY -> MA @ ~75 - 80 MPH
        Worst: 7.5 MPG around town. :-D

        As others have pointed out, as you have a fixed unit in which you are compressing, you are generating a bit of heat. The way to make more boost is to spin it faster, which reduces efficiency, heating things more. A air-to-water intercooler is ideal in these setups, but require custom intakes, which if I read it right, has been done here. It should make the car even more of a beast.

        -Matt
      1. LostMarine's Avatar
        LostMarine -
        i dont see anything a small shot of meth wont cure

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I'm supposed to argue delusions? Um, ok.

        hasnt stopped you in any other thread in which you have less experience..
      1. ultimateendz's Avatar
        ultimateendz -
        i cant wait to see the results....should interesting to see how this stacks up against a V stock, 2.9L whipple, and 4L whipple Click here to enlarge
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        i dont see anything a small shot of meth wont cure
        It won't cure it. Glad you read what DBFIU said about meth in the thread I created though.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        hasnt stopped you in any other thread in which you have less experience..
        You really need to stop talking as if you are an authority. You're making little strides keep going. Do more reading as you have been.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ultimateendz Click here to enlarge
        i cant wait to see the results....should interesting to see how is stacks up against a V stock, 2.9L whipple, and 4L whipple Click here to enlarge
        This isn't something that will stack up against a 2.9 or 4 liter whipple. It's a 1.7 liter blower, comparatively small.

        This is something for low 500's at the wheels. Not a big power platform. It's just going to make the car a hell of a lot faster and more enjoyable. It gives the S65 a lot more torque down low.

        Regarding stacking up against a 4.0 liter whipple V that would be my YSI setup.
      1. ultimateendz's Avatar
        ultimateendz -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        It won't cure it. Glad you read what DBFIU said about meth in the thread I created though.



        You really need to stop talking as if you are an authority. You're making little strides keep going. Do more reading as you have been.

        what did he say about the meth?
      1. mfatuation's Avatar
        mfatuation -
        Hey guys, that was my 2013 Santorini Blue E92 M3 at Bimmerfest. The Harrop kit was installed earlier this week, still needs to be tuned which should be happening within the next few days. I will try to keep you updated as best I can.
      1. ultimateendz's Avatar
        ultimateendz -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        This isn't something that will stack up against a 2.9 or 4 liter whipple. It's a 1.7 liter blower, comparatively small.

        This is something for low 500's at the wheels. Not a big power platform. It's just going to make the car a hell of a lot faster and more enjoyable. It gives the S65 a lot more torque down low.

        Regarding stacking up against a 4.0 liter whipple V that would be my YSI setup.

        The F1-X V is alive btw sticky...numbers to come soon Click here to enlarge 1xxxwhp
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mfatuation Click here to enlarge
        Hey guys, that was my 2013 Santorini Blue E92 M3 at Bimmerfest. The Harrop kit was installed earlier this week, still needs to be tuned which should be happening within the next few days. I will try to keep you updated as best I can.
        Hey, whats up! You're the guy from isntagram right? Click here to enlarge

        I remember your car, very nice.

        That's right, this still needs to be tuned. Still work to do but it's phenomenal where they are at. I was blown away.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by ultimateendz Click here to enlarge
        The F1-X V is alive btw sticky...numbers to come soon Click here to enlarge 1xxxwhp
        Ya I believe it! Monster blower wish I could run it. I'll likely be just short of 1xxx unfortunately with the YSI maxed Click here to enlarge

        What are you going to hit with the 4.0 liter?

        I'm thinking after my comparison with the weistec supercharged cars we should do a comparison test too if you are interested since I'll be at least reasonably close to your side of the country.

        What do you think? @ultimateendz
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Can't we assume (dangerous word) that once this setup has been figured out, it'll open the doors for larger twin-screw blowers that'll have a greater power potential? AFAIK, the tuning is going to be the most difficult thing, but since built S65s have already been done (lowered compression, sleeved blocks, anti-flex plates, etc etc) that would be able to withstand the higher stress, that's the biggest thing slowing down someone putting on a Whipple?
      1. mfatuation's Avatar
        mfatuation -
        Yeah, that's me! I actually few out to California from NJ to check in on the build and go to Bimmerfest, unfortunately I had to cut my trip short and head back Saturday morning. From the pics that they have sent me, I've been really impressed so far. Really glad you liked it!
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mfatuation Click here to enlarge
        Yeah, that's me! I actually few out to California from NJ to check in on the build and go to Bimmerfest, unfortunately I had to cut my trip short and head back Saturday morning. From the pics that they have sent me, I've been really impressed so far. Really glad you liked it!
        Checking this whole setup and talking to them in person... I was blown away. It's soooooo damn cool to see something different and innovation on the platform. Also nice to see someone pull off what nobody else was willing to tackle.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        Can't we assume (dangerous word) that once this setup has been figured out, it'll open the doors for larger twin-screw blowers that'll have a greater power potential?
        No. Because the problem is where do you put the larger blower at that point?

        I asked them this question and they said they can probably go one size up.

        I mean what are you going to do, move the throttle bodies further apart and cut a hole in the hood?
      1. ultimateendz's Avatar
        ultimateendz -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Ya I believe it! Monster blower wish I could run it. I'll likely be just short of 1xxx unfortunately with the YSI maxed Click here to enlarge

        What are you going to hit with the 4.0 liter?

        I'm thinking after my comparison with the weistec supercharged cars we should do a comparison test too if you are interested since I'll be at least reasonably close to your side of the country.

        What do you think? @ultimateendz
        no idea what numbers im going to hit....a ZL1 hit 1000whp already with it...thing is im gonna have to finish the R&D on the 4L....the guy that had it it decided to go TT....