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    • Vargas Stage III Turbo upgrade for 335/135 N54 motor hits 572 wheel horsepower on 91 octane pump gas (no meth injection) with Cobb flash

      Well here are some results for the Vargas Stage III upgrade that has caused the N54 forum section to basically be engaged in chaos for the past few months. From accusations of vaporware, to comparison to single turbo upgrades, to countless other arguments the day has come and the Stage III Vargas Turbo upgrade dyno'd on 91 octane with no meth 572 horsepower to the rear wheels. This is with a Cobb flash tuned by BimmerBoost vendor Pro-Tuning Freaks.


      Impressive? Yep, sure is and this seems to also be a 91 octane pump gas only world record for the N54. Now keep in mind this is just the beginning. What will it do with meth? What will do on E85? What will it do with race gas and big boost? What about different turbos? Sky appears to be the limit but for now this kind of performance on pump gas sure is a big boost (hah, get it?) to the N54 scene.

      Congratulations to all involved, Vargas Turbo Tech, Pro-Tuning Freaks, Cobb, and just the N54 community as well. The impossible just became possible. Pictures, video, and dynograph below.




      This article was originally published in forum thread: 572WHP 537WTQ - ACN 91 Octane, no meth - VTT Stage 3 Early Dynos PTF / COBB Protune started by VargasTurboTech View original post
      Comments 575 Comments
      1. Legionofboom's Avatar
        Legionofboom -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
        Thats my point... it will be meth... I guarantee it.
        You're thinking a TB plate with 2 meth nozzles?
      1. nafoo's Avatar
        nafoo -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90SoFlo Click here to enlarge
        You're thinking a TB plate with 2 meth nozzles?
        If it's meth, isn't it going to be too close to atomize?
      1. Q4P's Avatar
        Q4P -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90SoFlo Click here to enlarge
        You're thinking a TB plate with 2 meth nozzles?
        I won't pretend to be a fueling expert... but solely from a technical and convenience standpoint; how is this better than the classic charge pipe spray? I know shiv was spraying into the IC as well...
      1. Legionofboom's Avatar
        Legionofboom -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by nafoo Click here to enlarge
        If it's meth, isn't it going to be too close to atomize?
        (No expert of any means so this would just be a guess)
        I would think that would all depend on the size of the jets.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
        I won't pretend to be a fueling expert... but solely from a technical and convenience standpoint; how is this better than the classic charge pipe spray? I know shiv was spraying into the IC as well...
        Its not. Just an option a few people have been tossing around quite heavily.
      1. Sered's Avatar
        Sered -
        Jeez. Judging by the attitude 'over there', is this kit going to become a forum dividing line or something? Serious asshattery over there.
      1. klipseracer's Avatar
        klipseracer -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by nafoo Click here to enlarge
        If it's meth, isn't it going to be too close to atomize?
        Direct port meth would be the way to go if you could tune it:

        Attachment 28030
        Attachment 28031

        Although port injecting E85 is better in my opinion considering the fuel is coming from the tank, less lines, less maintenance, higher energy content than meth, etc etc. Wouldn't hurt to run a bit of meth for IAT and octane.
      1. Q4P's Avatar
        Q4P -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by klipseracer Click here to enlarge
        Direct port meth would be the way to go if you could tune it:

        Attachment 28030
        Attachment 28031

        Although port injecting E85 is better in my opinion considering the fuel is coming from the tank, less lines, less maintenance, higher energy content than meth, etc etc. Wouldn't hurt to run a bit of meth for IAT and octane.
        Are you talking about running E85 in the tank the normal DI way and having a second set of port injectors for even more E85 at high load? Am I understanding this correctly?
      1. klipseracer's Avatar
        klipseracer -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
        Are you talking about running E85 in the tank the normal DI way and having a second set of port injectors for even more E85 at high load? Am I understanding this correctly?
        Correct. Either injecting using a secondary fuel rail through a new manifold, modified manifold, manifold/head spacer or the simplest way, a Throttle Body Spacer with a couple injectors mounted there. The last one is a solution I already have lined up to be tested as it is the simplest and least costly, has proven effective on other platforms and the closed loop DME will be good at adjusting trims for us. It does great when dumping methanol in. Increase fuel by boost, load, rpm and let the DME adjust the trims and other variables as it already has proven to do extremely well with methanol. Depending on the controller used, but it is highly tunable in how much extra fuel is added and I'm confident it will work well.

        Although, the pictures I posted were for methanol, obviously, as that is what was being talked about previously.
      1. DefactoM6's Avatar
        DefactoM6 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by VargasTurboTech Click here to enlarge
        Since my last attempt at trusting someone else with it was a bust. I was at my fabricators today with one on the bench figuring stuffs out. D put a bug in my ear a while back and we are moving on it.
        OOOO I know what's going down Click here to enlarge, D's idea had never occurred to me but would be quite a $#@!in fix if it can be pulled off Click here to enlarge.
      1. BEAR-AvHistory's Avatar
        BEAR-AvHistory -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sered Click here to enlarge
        Jeez. Judging by the attitude 'over there', is this kit going to become a forum dividing line or something? Serious asshattery over there.
        Thing is the typical fall into line behind Shiv did not happen, expect they are shocked simply shocked at people speaking outClick here to enlarge
      1. Njz's Avatar
        Njz -
        had to chime in over there:
        tony, dont post $#@! else until you have your glory runs on full race gas and meth so the power curves, afr, timing, ect is dead on perfect. Thats how the single kit was marketed when it was developed so fair is fair. You have nothing to prove here IMO, 99 percent of these people posting didnt buy a single turbo solution and likely the same amount are not in the market for a stage 3 solution so dont let them piss on your parade. This kit is a tremendous achievement and will be the main choice for people looking to push this platform to the limits. I would be curious to see dyno results from the first week of tuning on the singles (pre production vs pre production) and I think the results speak for themselves. Also keep in mind that the tuning is being done remotely with limited time on the dyno. Tony keep up the great work, when your done with this end of the project and have time to look into the 135i fitment I am greatly interested.

        Remember I posted this to the e90post crowd, here at least the discussions are more technical and productive. I just couldnt read any more $#@! over there and be silent.
      1. funkmobster's Avatar
        funkmobster -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory Click here to enlarge
        Thing is the typical fall into line behind Shiv did not happen, expect they are shocked simply shocked at people speaking outClick here to enlarge

        Yeah and you sure go all the way ass kissing Vargas in that thread. Didn't you spend all your time complaining in Shiv's thread that there should be suspension upgrades included in the ST kit?

        Your hate against Shiv is getting $#@!ing ridiculous .
      1. Brey335i's Avatar
        Brey335i -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by funkmobster Click here to enlarge
        Yeah and you sure go all the way ass kissing Vargas in that thread. Didn't you spend all your time complaining in Shiv's thread that there should be suspension upgrades included in the ST kit?

        Your hate against Shiv is getting $#@!ing ridiculous .
        IIRC, he didn't complain that suspension mods weren't included but rather that Shiv marketed the ST as a complete solution. Shiv's major argument was that you could simply slap on a ST and dust Veyrons. His point was that to take advantage of the ST, you would need serious suspension mods, LSD, etc. Also that Shiv's test car was outfitted with such and therefore not an accurate representation of what you can expect if you only buy a ST kit.

        Now note what Vargas included in the OP of his Stage 3 pricing thread: "Please note: This is a full bolt on turbo kit with everything needed to install these turbochargers on your vehicle. This does not include any tuning or other upgrades you should perform to your car to take advantage of this turbo upgrade. This includes but is not limited to clutch, intercooler, charge pipe, exhaust, etc. Also keep in mind we are using Garretts HP numbers they released with the turbos. What you will get on your own vehicle of course is 100% based on your tune, supporting mods, fuel etc."

        Notice the difference in approaches here?
      1. jpsimon's Avatar
        jpsimon -
        oh god, you should $#@!ing assume you need suspension mods no matter what if you want to fully take advantage of any big power mods. People crying about not being told in a disclaimer that they should upgrade suspension are just looking for something to complain about and are being 100% ridiculous.
      1. Eleventeen's Avatar
        Eleventeen -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DefactoM6 Click here to enlarge
        OOOO I know what's going down Click here to enlarge, D's idea had never occurred to me but would be quite a $#@!in fix if it can be pulled off Click here to enlarge.
        Dual HPFP setup?
      1. Torgus's Avatar
        Torgus -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jpsimon Click here to enlarge
        oh god, you should $#@!ing assume you need suspension mods no matter what if you want to fully take advantage of any big power mods. People crying about not being told in a disclaimer that they should upgrade suspension are just looking for something to complain about and are being 100% ridiculous.
        This.
      1. klipseracer's Avatar
        klipseracer -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jpsimon Click here to enlarge
        oh god, you should $#@!ing assume you need suspension mods no matter what if you want to fully take advantage of any big power mods. People crying about not being told in a disclaimer that they should upgrade suspension are just looking for something to complain about and are being 100% ridiculous.
        I mostly agree, but it was indirectly assumed with his kit you could pretty much run 10's, but there was some serious suspension stuff going on, like specialized ohlins or something, I can't remember. And its Shiv's reputation for small amounts of grey area deceit that they are picking the bone on.
      1. Brey335i's Avatar
        Brey335i -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jpsimon Click here to enlarge
        oh god, you should $#@!ing assume you need suspension mods no matter what if you want to fully take advantage of any big power mods. People crying about not being told in a disclaimer that they should upgrade suspension are just looking for something to complain about and are being 100% ridiculous.
        I agree on both counts. But Shiv was being equally ridiculous with his exaggerated promises and usual BS. That's what some people argued about. And then the banhammer fell hard on both the trolls and the decent forum members.
      1. Q4P's Avatar
        Q4P -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Brey335i Click here to enlarge
        I agree on both counts. But Shiv was being equally ridiculous with his exaggerated promises and usual BS. That's what some people argued about. And then the banhammer fell hard on both the trolls and the decent forum members.
        u mean like skipping 10s and running 9s or having a no problem 10 second dd?? lololol...
      1. V8Bait's Avatar
        V8Bait -
        Gotta bump it.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
        Cheers to transparency! Click here to enlarge
        Click here to enlarge

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by klipseracer Click here to enlarge
        Direct port meth would be the way to go if you could tune it:


        Although port injecting E85 is better in my opinion considering the fuel is coming from the tank, less lines, less maintenance, higher energy content than meth, etc etc. Wouldn't hurt to run a bit of meth for IAT and octane.
        Nothing beats meth but nitromethane. E85 is probably better for cooling through the DI system than meth through a port fuel/TBI setup, but meth would still make more power (higher energy content per lbs of fuel, just takes much more fuel). If you run true E85 I'd be shocked if you need meth for IAT and octane, even with no intercooler. For those without E85 availability, methanol will still rein king. I think the supplemental fuel setup would be THE thing to have for cars with access to E85.

        Well, asides from any HPFP magic Tony can work out. That would be best.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by jpsimon Click here to enlarge
        oh god, you should $#@!ing assume you need suspension mods no matter what if you want to fully take advantage of any big power mods. People crying about not being told in a disclaimer that they should upgrade suspension are just looking for something to complain about and are being 100% ridiculous.
        Suspension mods? I am trying to remember what somebody said about those that was epic and the same way I roll, it went like "I will make as much power as the engine and tune is content with making, and if the suspension doesn't like it, well that's just too bad for the suspension". Click here to enlarge

        I guess nobody here has every tried to drag an old chevy with a big blower sticking out of the hood. Suspension? lol. Just shackle it down.