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    • BMW may finally be taking on AMG's Black Series Head to Head? BMW to compete with AMG's Black Series and will bring these models to the USA

      BMW currently has been getting smacked around by, well, everyone in the German performance scene. The M3 has remained basically stagnant while Mercedes continues to improve the C63 AMG with available options to increase horsepower as well as hardcore black series variants for which BMW has no answer. The M3 GTS being the closest thing but that is not available in the United States. And even if it was there still is the SLS AMG Black Series not to mention the other Black Series models Mercedes has released and in the pipeline.


      So, the company claiming to make the Ultimate Driving Machine has yet to provide an answer for the Mercedes hardcore drivers cars. Even Audi has the R8 (no answer from BMW for this one either, see the pattern?) and is bringing more RS models to the USA. Is BMW just blind? Not aware of the competition?

      At the North American International Auto Show BMW PR employees showed they were very aware of Black Series models from Mercedes and also that their previous hardcore models like the CSL, GTS, CRT, etc., did not make it to the USA. Instead we got a joke of a special edition M3 which is about as special as a standard M3 with a bunch of option boxes checked: Pointless BMW M3 DTM Championship Edition. It would appear this is all set to change:


      Ok, well, BMW has offered hardcore cars before but they never came to the USA. Instead we get crap left over from the parts bin that BMW calls "special" and people who don't know any better purchase. BMW may finally stop screwing over the American BMW enthusiast:


      You may be asking, where is this information coming from? Well, from a journalist working for Automobile magazine who had an interview with the BMW M executives for the magazine. Thanks to the Twitter feed, we get an early look and yes BimmerBoost did get confirmation:


      So, BMW may be getting its balls back. But, some of us need to see it to believe it. BMW has gone soft for so long this enthusiast doubts they can get it up to their classic M standards again.
      This article was originally published in forum thread: BMW may finally be taking on AMG's Black Series Head to Head? BMW to compete with AMG's Black Series and bring these models to the USA started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 43 Comments
      1. mpowerct's Avatar
        mpowerct -
        Thank god!!! Long overdue! Too many classics (Csl, etc)have gone to be only enjoyed in europe and other parts of the world. This is so needed for BMW! Especially with all these great Black Series not to mention RS versions too. BMW used to be the standard for drivers cars Among Mercedes and Audi... Now its much Different. All the others have made great strides where BMW has just skated by. I am Not used to this.I remember when I bought my Brand New 01 E46 M3.. That car killed its competitors then, Same for the E39 M5... My how the times have changed. HOPEFULLY THIS NEWS IS TRUE! ALSO build a R8/ SLS killer BMW. I hate how they do not have a car to compete with those cars and its still being debated by the current President of M who I think sucks a$$ for not approving it!! If It does we will not see it for a minimum of 2 years..
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mpowerct Click here to enlarge
        Too many classics (Csl, etc)
        I will never forgive them for the E46 M3 CSL. Too little, too late.
      1. M3_WC's Avatar
        M3_WC -
        Just put in the 4.4L S65 into a Z4M and they can keep the overpriced low volume special models.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge
        Just put in the 4.4L S65 into a Z4M and they can keep the overpriced low volume special models.
        Exactly. Maybe they will do a special Z4 with the 4.4? That is what they should do...
      1. Legionofboom's Avatar
        Legionofboom -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        Well $100k car brand new or a $100k car? BUT I'm on the same page though, thinking the next big "automobile investment" will be a proven platform that's capable of 1k WHP.

        I'd say $250k+ and you're getting into super car/exotics money, but the C63 Black Series is a $100k
        Well being the practical minded person I am, I would more then likely buy a used car that has had its price cut in half. *cough gallardo*
      1. uniter's Avatar
        uniter -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mkodama Click here to enlarge
        Hmm, should be interesting. Hopefully they don't just give it only a matte paint job, a new exhaust, and wheels.
        You forgot the limited edition trim badges!
      1. fast4door's Avatar
        fast4door -
        GTS's and CSL's would be nice but theyre going to need some serious HP to compete with the Black Series..BMW defense was always "these arent drag cars, theyre made for the track"..well those Black Series cars are HP monsters, and not all that great on the track..if BMW really wants to compete theyre gonna have to stop acting like everyone has a race track in their backyard..MB realized this, and thats why they ahead of BMW in the performance division..

        I think most people care more about 1/4 mile times, 60-120, etc..not lap times.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by fast4door Click here to enlarge
        GTS's and CSL's would be nice but theyre going to need some serious HP to compete with the Black Series
        Or serious weight reduction.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by fast4door Click here to enlarge
        well those Black Series cars are HP monsters, and not all that great on the track..
        Um, no, they are pretty great on the track. Black Series isn't about drag racing.
      1. fast4door's Avatar
        fast4door -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Or serious weight reduction.



        Um, no, they are pretty great on the track. Black Series isn't about drag racing.
        weight reduction could be a solution...

        And I guess I said that wrong..atleast to me anyways, the handling on a Mercedes never stood out to me very much.. I always preffered BMW is the handling department..I have driven a few AMG's, but never a Black Series..but from what Ive read, the C63 BS is no slouch around the track, but it isnt all that great either
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by fast4door Click here to enlarge
        the handling on a Mercedes never stood out to me very much.. I always preffered BMW is the handling department..I have driven a few AMG's, but never a Black Series..but from what Ive read, the C63 BS is no slouch around the track, but it isnt all that great either
        May want to look at this and where the C63 Black Series finished: http://www.germanboost.com/content.p...-M5-and-F13-M6
      1. lughed's Avatar
        lughed -
        BMW out sold MB and Audi in 2012 so they really have no reason to produce an all new car to compete with them in all segments. If i was a betting man, i would bet on a Z4 platform and priced to compete with the R8 and SLS. A new M3 is coming so that would have iterations to compete with the Black Series which wouldnt be anything new. The GTS from what i have read does out perform the Black on a track, though by a very slim margin.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by lughed Click here to enlarge
        BMW out sold MB and Audi in 2012 so they really have no reason to produce an all new car to compete with them in all segments.
        Sales does not equal quality.
      1. CubanJJ09's Avatar
        CubanJJ09 -
        Like that article said. Ill have to see it to believe it. And a $#@!ing new m3 csl (while a great car) isn't gonna keep up with mercs black series as a whole.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by CubanJJ09 Click here to enlarge
        Like that article said. Ill have to see it to believe it. And a $#@!ing new m3 csl (while a great car) isn't gonna keep up with mercs black series as a whole.
        I think Mercedes set a very high standard with the Black Series. BMW is still trying to figure out how to respond if they even will.
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by CubanJJ09 Click here to enlarge
        Like that article said. Ill have to see it to believe it. And a $#@!ing new m3 csl (while a great car) isn't gonna keep up with mercs black series as a whole.
        Who knows, if the new M3 CSL gets an AMG-like "Power Pack" with a legitimate performance tune (more aggressive timing & raised boost), it's a step in the right direction. Hopefully this new motor won't be as susceptible to oil problems/bearing issues as previous M motors & come with a great set of turbos that have a lot of "aftermarket tuning" potential.

        If anything, this "Lighter Car > More Power" mentality is going to kill the F3x M3
      1. CubanJJ09's Avatar
        CubanJJ09 -
        If merc "black series'd" a m3 csl theyd throw a super charger on it or a beefy ass v8 which is pretty much what I would take as a honest and true effort from bmw to compete. Until then it's more lime rock, dtm, trash in my book.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by CubanJJ09 Click here to enlarge
        If merc "black series'd" a m3 csl theyd throw a super charger on it or a beefy ass v8 which is pretty much what I would take as a honest and true effort from bmw to compete. Until then it's more lime rock, dtm, trash in my book.
        The CSL is old now so it can't compete with raw power but from a driver's car standpoint it likely still is superior to anything AMG has.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Finally some love from Autoblog: http://www.autoblog.com/2013/02/01/b...s-competitors/
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by CubanJJ09 Click here to enlarge
        If merc "black series'd" a m3 csl theyd throw a super charger on it or a beefy ass v8 which is pretty much what I would take as a honest and true effort from bmw to compete. Until then it's more lime rock, dtm, trash in my book.
        The thing is forced induction was traditionally an M car no-no. An FI motor obviously is not as immediately responsive as an naturally aspirated car. Whether it's turbo or supercharged, you're waiting on boost for the power to develop; it's also not as track friendly since you're more susceptible to over-heating with a forced induction motor than NA.

        Mercedes & the AMG cars doesn't really care about "track" setups because they realize most of their cars stay on the streets. That's why you have the W211 E55 AMG (I'm gonna focus on the E-class AMG car to illustrate my point) that were 5.5L supercharged, briefly received the 6.3L V8, but then the W212 went back to boost and are now twin turbo'd. The M3 is significantly more track friendly, but AMG realizes that HP sells cars & will continue to add HP as they go forward.
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Top Speed's also got BB love
        If rumors from BimmerBoost are true, it looks like BMW plans to unveil one or two special cars in the upcoming years, and they will be offered as a response to Mercedes Black Series model.
        http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-new...-ar146360.html