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    • Already severely outgunned? Car Magazine claims the new F80 M3 will have 444 horsepower from its turbo inline-6

      Bavaria, we have a problem. The new M3 is coming and it isn't packing enough of a punch under the hood. We knew it would have a turbocharged inline-6 but we did not seriously think it would only have another 30 horses on the E9X M3 with its 414 horsepower naturally aspirated V8. The new C63 AMG is rumored to have a twin turbo 4.0 liter V8 and considering the C63 AMG (in Black Series trim) already is putting out more to the wheels than this M3 will be rated at the crank let alone what the new turbo C63 AMG will put out the new M3 is going to get smacked around badly if this is true.


      Someone at BMW apparently thinks only another 30 horses is a good idea. The S65 V8 in the E92 M3 offered another 70 horsepower AT THE WHEELS over the E46 M3 it replaced. With Mercedes bringing the heat and Audi set to go to a turbo motor, this does not look like it is going to cut it. 30 more horsepower? Is this a joke?

      The only bright side BimmerBoost can see is that the new M3 may be severely underrated just like the F10 M5. Let's assume this is the case and apply what we have all seen with the F10 M5 to the new M3. That would mean 417 wheel horsepower for the new M3 despite its appallingly low crank rating. That would also mean an increase of 67 wheel horsepower over the E92 M3 which is a hell of a lot better than 30 horsepower at the crank.

      With the new turbo motors BMW is making a habit of underrating them especially in M trim. The low crank rating likely designed not to insight a horsepower war with Mercedes and Audi which is already going on anyway with Mercedes already raising the stakes in the V8 arena. Regardless, assuming about 420 wheel horsepower (which is a best case scenario with a 444 hp crank rating) BMW is not going to win the raw power battle as they did with the F10 M5 temporarily until Mercedes regains the crown.

      BMW M3 fans may be starting to sweat just a bit.
      This article was originally published in forum thread: Already severely outgunned? Car Magazine claims the new F80 M3 will have 444 horsepower from its turbo inline-6 started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 164 Comments
      1. bobS's Avatar
        bobS -
        I don't know why, but I have a Lot of faith in this next m3....despite people hating on the turbo motors, if you look at bmw's turbo lineup...the engines are very potent, less lag than others, and very smooth. I mean the n20, n54, n55 and so on are really really good motors.

        I think BMW will have a very well balanced, aggressive looking, quick turbo m3.
      1. mtarone's Avatar
        mtarone -
        Totally agree, I can't wait to see it! Click here to enlarge
      1. Q4P's Avatar
        Q4P -
        if its 450 whp after tune and a few bolt ons... it will be a success

        if its 400 whp, then buy an n54
      1. LostMarine's Avatar
        LostMarine -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
        if its 450 whp after tune and a few bolt ons... it will be a success

        if its 400 whp, then buy an n54
        considering its FI already, I think, anything less than 390-400 stock and 460+ with tune/bolt-ons is a failure
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge
        Where do you arrive at your theory that the C63 will be over 4,000 lbs? When Benz themselves said weight reduction is on their priority list as well.
        Said this earlier, the new AMG cars are going to have AMG-spec 4matic (AWD) systems. You don't think all the supporting drivetrain components (transfer case, drive axles, drive shaft, etc) won't add ~200 lbs+? Put a driver in the car & you're easily over 4,000 lbs
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        An all wheel drive twin turbo V8 C-Class is going to be a HEAVY $#@!.
      1. bobS's Avatar
        bobS -
        Yea but it may provide better traction, right now the c63 is a tire melting beast, some awd could make that car dominate.
      1. inlineS54B32's Avatar
        inlineS54B32 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        Said this earlier, the new AMG cars are going to have AMG-spec 4matic (AWD) systems. You don't think all the supporting drivetrain components (transfer case, drive axles, drive shaft, etc) won't add ~200 lbs+? Put a driver in the car & you're easily over 4,000 lbs
        Everything in total adds 70 kilograms (mentioned in the linked article), so about 155 pounds. It's not going to be a featherweight, that's for sure.
      1. Sorena's Avatar
        Sorena -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LZH Click here to enlarge
        it's gonna be an inline 6 and sound like a little fart can.
        I neg repped you on accident. Not that i agree with this statement though as the straight six is one of the best soundings layout, if not the best, IMO.
      1. Sorena's Avatar
        Sorena -
        Not sure how it's already outgunned. The difference between the current M3 and the C63 is 70bhp and still the M3 manages to keep up and outpace the C63 (Not talking about tuning potential here). The next M3 is going to be a lot lighter than the C63 and i don't think MB is going to give the C63 over 70bhp advantage on the M3. So things look good so far.
      1. Q4P's Avatar
        Q4P -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
        Not sure how it's already outgunned. The difference between the current M3 and the C63 is 70bhp and still the M3 manages to keep up and outpace the C63 (Not talking about tuning potential here). The next M3 is going to be a lot lighter than the C63 and i don't think MB is going to give the C63 over 70bhp advantage on the M3. So things look good so far.
        70 BHP? You mean 31? 420 vs 451?

        And yes, the M3 outpaces the C63... on a track, definitely not on the streets. Let's remember these are first and foremost street cars.
      1. Sorena's Avatar
        Sorena -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
        70 BHP? You mean 31? 420 vs 451?

        And yes, the M3 outpaces the C63... on a track, definitely not on the streets. Let's remember these are first and foremost street cars.
        The newer C63's make 484 hp or something close to that. 484 - 414 = 70 Click here to enlarge

        And for the street racing, it's illegal Click here to enlarge But, even though i'm not a fan of the DCT, with it an M3 can keep up with the C63.
      1. Q4P's Avatar
        Q4P -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
        The newer C63's make 484 hp or something close to that. 484 - 414 = 70 Click here to enlarge

        And for the street racing, it's illegal Click here to enlarge But, even though i'm not a fan of the DCT, with it an M3 can keep up with the C63.
        Performance Package cars make 481 but no one buys that crap because you can tune it yourself for way less money. So show me a non PP package car get kept up with by a DCT M3... both stock, both on the streets in a straight line. People make way to much hoopla of the M3's perfect chassis, handling and race technology even though they will never ever use it. The engine has to deliver on the streets... it's not an option.

        this is the closest that I can find... (albeit a proper turbo motor will dust both of them)

      1. Sorena's Avatar
        Sorena -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
        Performance Package cars make 481 but no one buys that crap because you can tune it yourself for way less money. So show me a non PP package car get kept up with by a DCT M3... both stock, both on the streets in a straight line. People make way to much hoopla of the M3's perfect chassis, handling and race technology even though they will never ever use it. The engine has to deliver on the streets... it's not an option.

        this is the closest that I can find... (albeit a proper turbo motor will dust both of them)

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THCvPgQxvhM
        One thing you fail to see is that MOST of the buyers do not care about aftermarket tuning. That's why P31 package sell well. And if i'm not mistaken, that package is included in C63 coupes in here.

        A turbo motor will dust them both? Of course it will. A jet engine will dust the turbo motor. There is something faster out there all the time. Honestly i don't get the point here.

        And here a M3 pulls, barely, on a C63.


        EDIT: And i do track my car. At least once a month.
      1. Q4P's Avatar
        Q4P -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
        One thing you fail to see is that MOST of the buyers do not care about aftermarket tuning. That's why P31 package sell well. And if i'm not mistaken, that package is included in C63 coupes in here.

        A turbo motor will dust them both? Of course it will. A jet engine will dust the turbo motor. There is something faster out there all the time. Honestly i don't get the point here.

        And here a M3 pulls, barely, on a C63.
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h30D_PngRqk

        EDIT: And i do track my car. At least once a month.
        The turbo comment was made since we are talking about a new M3 that will be turbod... I just hope it's as good as the competition (no guarantees there since we are talking about BMW). You do track your car... but you are part of the 15% of M3 owners. That is a fact.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
        The difference between the current M3 and the C63 is 70bhp
        On what planet?
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
        The newer C63's make 484 hp or something close to that. 484 - 414 = 70
        Um you mean P31 not "newer" C63s.
      1. Sorena's Avatar
        Sorena -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        On what planet?
        Planet earth. Do you know it?
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
        Planet earth. Do you know it?
        I know the planet Earth where math doesn't function based on opinion. Maybe learn basic arithmetic?

        Click here to enlarge
      1. mhabs's Avatar
        mhabs -
        According to the Car Magazine Article, the F80 M3 will weigh around 3,306 lbs or less. So 3,306 lbs/ 444 hp would put the weight/power at 7.4x, which is better than the M5/M6 and the current M3 GTS. If the weight to power ratio is the same as the M5/6 at 7.6-7.7x, at 3306 lbs the new M3 should produce 435 hp, or at around 3450 lbs, produce 454 hp. Guess the question is whether BMW would allow the weight/power be better on the M3/M4 vs M5/6 from strictly a straight line perspective..