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    • Already severely outgunned? Car Magazine claims the new F80 M3 will have 444 horsepower from its turbo inline-6

      Bavaria, we have a problem. The new M3 is coming and it isn't packing enough of a punch under the hood. We knew it would have a turbocharged inline-6 but we did not seriously think it would only have another 30 horses on the E9X M3 with its 414 horsepower naturally aspirated V8. The new C63 AMG is rumored to have a twin turbo 4.0 liter V8 and considering the C63 AMG (in Black Series trim) already is putting out more to the wheels than this M3 will be rated at the crank let alone what the new turbo C63 AMG will put out the new M3 is going to get smacked around badly if this is true.


      Someone at BMW apparently thinks only another 30 horses is a good idea. The S65 V8 in the E92 M3 offered another 70 horsepower AT THE WHEELS over the E46 M3 it replaced. With Mercedes bringing the heat and Audi set to go to a turbo motor, this does not look like it is going to cut it. 30 more horsepower? Is this a joke?

      The only bright side BimmerBoost can see is that the new M3 may be severely underrated just like the F10 M5. Let's assume this is the case and apply what we have all seen with the F10 M5 to the new M3. That would mean 417 wheel horsepower for the new M3 despite its appallingly low crank rating. That would also mean an increase of 67 wheel horsepower over the E92 M3 which is a hell of a lot better than 30 horsepower at the crank.

      With the new turbo motors BMW is making a habit of underrating them especially in M trim. The low crank rating likely designed not to insight a horsepower war with Mercedes and Audi which is already going on anyway with Mercedes already raising the stakes in the V8 arena. Regardless, assuming about 420 wheel horsepower (which is a best case scenario with a 444 hp crank rating) BMW is not going to win the raw power battle as they did with the F10 M5 temporarily until Mercedes regains the crown.

      BMW M3 fans may be starting to sweat just a bit.
      This article was originally published in forum thread: Already severely outgunned? Car Magazine claims the new F80 M3 will have 444 horsepower from its turbo inline-6 started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 164 Comments
      1. LostMarine's Avatar
        LostMarine -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
        funny u say?
        i found this hysterical Click here to enlarge

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
        500 HP / 400 TQwould have been a great goal w a beautiful DCT.
      1. Q4P's Avatar
        Q4P -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        i found this hysterical Click here to enlarge
        Well u can't really go much higher than that considering it's an M3 and will eat into the M5s sales.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Q4P Click here to enlarge
        Well u can't really go much higher than that considering it's an M3 and will eat into the M5s sales.
        Yep. Don't even bother trying to explain brand hierarchy heads will explode.
      1. Legionofboom's Avatar
        Legionofboom -
        I dont think its good.

        Considering ZL1 went faster, more whp. It would be a clear choice.

        Hopefully it gets a quick mod scene involved. I think that would be a big improvement
      1. mhabs's Avatar
        mhabs -
        If weighs ~3,400 lbs, that's a weight to power ratio of 7.66, which is similar than the M5 and should perform along the lines of the CRT/GTS, maybe a bit less given suspension will be more street-friendly vs the GTS/CRT. What's troubling is that BMW had a press conference at the Detroit Auto show, and when pressed with questions, the BMW guy said something to the effect of "More powerful may not necessarily mean more horsepower" (ie performance improvement will be via weight reduction and more torque). So weight will be critical to the equation. Makes the case for a tuned E9x M3 with bolt-ons not being that far off from the new gen just in terms of straight line performance (and will still have warranty if simple bolt ons), not to mention the sublime experience of the S65 engine.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mhabs Click here to enlarge
        If weighs ~3,400 lbs, that's a weight to power ratio of 7.66, which is similar than the M5 and should perform along the lines of the CRT/GTS, maybe a bit less given suspension will be more street-friendly vs the GTS/CRT. What's troubling is that BMW had a press conference at the Detroit Auto show, and when pressed with questions, the BMW guy said something to the effect of "More powerful may not necessarily mean more horsepower" (ie performance improvement will be via weight reduction and more torque). So weight will be critical to the equation. Makes the case for a tuned E9x M3 with bolt-ons not being that far off from the new gen just in terms of straight line performance (and will still have warranty if simple bolt ons), not to mention the sublime experience of the S65 engine.
        I'll have something interesting regarding this later in the week.
      1. bobS's Avatar
        bobS -
        I think it will be the same performance as the m5..roughly. Same 1/4 mile, better handling than the m5
      1. mhabs's Avatar
        mhabs -
        Cool... yeah here's the link in case anyone missed it. Personally think the Car magazine guess is probably closer to reality (BMW will sell more if they can actually show a hp gain, however modest it will be).

        http://www.edmunds.com/auto-shows/de...uild-both.html
      1. LZH's Avatar
        LZH -
        What they don't make up for in a HP increase they could make up in weight reduction - just sayin...
      1. BuraQ's Avatar
        BuraQ -
        I will just sit where I am until I see some big improvement in numers by a tunner with little mods
      1. mhabs's Avatar
        mhabs -
        How does it work with tuned turbocharged cars....if you increase PSI, won't dealer easily see in stored memory (even if flashed back) and void the warranty? For N/A cars, so long as tune doesn't result in rev limit increase or you go past speed limiter and you have only standard bolt ons (with cats remaining), there are no potential warranty issues.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BuraQ Click here to enlarge
        I will just sit where I am until I see some big improvement in numers by a tunner with little mods
      1. mhabs's Avatar
        mhabs -
        How does it work with tuned turbocharged cars....if you increase boost PSI, won't dealer easily see in stored memory (even if flashed back) and void the warranty? For N/A cars, so long as tune doesn't result in rev limit increase or you go past speed limiter and you have only standard bolt ons (with cats remaining), there are no potential warranty issues.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BuraQ Click here to enlarge
        I will just sit where I am until I see some big improvement in numers by a tunner with little mods
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by bobS Click here to enlarge
        I think it will be the same performance as the m5..roughly. Same 1/4 mile, better handling than the m5
        It won't hit the same trap but ET will be close.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mhabs Click here to enlarge
        Cool... yeah here's the link in case anyone missed it. Personally think the Car magazine guess is probably closer to reality (BMW will sell more if they can actually show a hp gain, however modest it will be).

        http://www.edmunds.com/auto-shows/de...uild-both.html
        Of course they will build both, don't know why Edmunds thinks that is a revelation.
      1. pho_e92's Avatar
        pho_e92 -
        Man i was hoping the hp would be around 480 with weight reduction. If the new M3 doesnt impress me i might have to look into the new C63.
      1. mhabs's Avatar
        mhabs -
        True... actually the worthwhile part of the article was at the bottom, which quoted an M guy about power on the M3 at a press conference.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Of course they will build both, don't know why Edmunds thinks that is a revelation.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by mhabs Click here to enlarge
        True... actually the worthwhile part of the article was at the bottom, which quoted an M guy about power on the M3 at a press conference.
        I like what he said about the curb weight... but not the power.
      1. Sledgehammer's Avatar
        Sledgehammer -
        Less weight and a modest power increase coupled with some aftermarket mods and all will be well.
      1. mtarone's Avatar
        mtarone -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
        Less weight and a modest power increase coupled with some aftermarket mods and all will be well.
        As a potential owner, I'd be comfortable with that approach, it should make for a better handling vehicle. A great power to weight ratio is why I bought a 1M. Click here to enlarge
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Was talking to Jake about the new M3 when I got ProTuned, we both agreed that if the new motor is as responsive to tuning & basic bolt-ons like the N54, we'll be golden. BUT it really depends a lot on the specific turbos that are used & how much aftermarket boost we'll be able to add.

        It obviously a LOT easier to increase performance vs. losing weight, so I'm not the least bit upset with the strong emphasis on weight reduction