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    • Trouble in paradise? Vishnu/FFtec N54 335ii Single Turbo kits experiencing issues as a BimmerBoost member runs 12.5@121 with misfires and having to short shift

      BimmerBoost would like to thank member GeorgiaTech335Coupe for his openness and honesty regarding his Vishnu/FFTEC single turbo setup. Recently, this member took his single turbo upgraded 6-speed manual 335i to the PBIR (Palm Beach International Raceway) dragstrip in Florida to do some testing. His best run was a 12.50@121.6 alongside a 12.8@117. Yes, these times are quite a ways away from the 10.8@131 glory pass from Vishnu demonstrating the kits capability.


      This is in no way the fault of GeorgiaTech335Coupe who experienced misfires on his car and had to short shift at 6300 rpm in order to avoid them. Now, Vishnu has basically portrayed this kit as perfect and ready for sale with nobody having any issues. The reason BimmerBoost is bringing this issue to the attention of the community is for potential buyers to understand what they are getting into.


      There is absolutely nothing wrong with having issues when modifying a car to this level and BimmerBoost is confident Vishnu will resolve them. There is something wrong with pretending nothing is wrong. A few cars with the single turbo kits have gone up for sale and apparently a total of three people, that are willing to open their mouths, are having misfire issues with these kits.

      These issues will no doubt get resolved but potential buyers and current customers needs to be aware of the process, effort, and that progress is being made. Pretending nothing is wrong and collecting money simply is the wrong way to go about this and once again (it's becoming a trend) BimmerBoost is the only site bringing these issues to the attention of the community.

      For the record, a member by the name of @tmo335tt says he has a hardware solution for the misfires that he will likely share with Vishnu (hopefully not for free). Interesting that it isn't Vishnu but the community solving this.

      Thanks again to @GeorgiaTech335Coupe for sharing his details, good or bad, as we all learn thanks to honesty and openness. There is more to tuning than just collecting money.

      This article was originally published in forum thread: Vishnu Single Turbo at PBIR - 12.50@121.6 having to shift all gears at 6300rpm started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 1090 Comments
      1. bigdnno98's Avatar
        bigdnno98 -
        But you can manipulate the tables however you want. The only issue I see is the wastegate controll. I'm no expert but I don't see how it's impossible.
      1. BuraQ's Avatar
        BuraQ -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by GeorgiaTech335Coupe Click here to enlarge
        Do it! The top end gain (from the little I can experience) feels great. Very different than stock.
        Yup, I dont have to feel jealous anymore when seeing a GTR.... LOL.... and spend less to do what they do and still enjoy BMW quality
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
        @GeorgiaTech335Coupe , sorry to hear you're having issues with your car after having put in so much into it. I will tell you right now, you'll just end up getting very frustrated trying to resolve the issue with further hardware replacement. I've even opened up my motor in hopes of finding "something" that will prove to be the cause. I hoped for a head gasket, a burnt valve, weak spring, all sorts of things just to be finally able to put my finger on what it is. I've played with gaps on the plugs, NGK coils, injector replacement. In other words, I strongly recommend you don't go down the same path. Many seem to have this issue which ends up getting unresolved and they end up never mentioning a thing on the forums which doesn't shed enough light on this issue.

        My issue started with putting in RB turbos. I did have Procede on the car at the time. However, hotrod has also had the same issue reported and he never ran anything but the JB. I tried all the major tunes after it started to misfire as well and the issue was still there with everything 100% functionally working.

        My best advice to you as I want to see you enjoy your car, get good numbers out of it and not end up regretting going for more power is to just turn off misfire detection. I am well aware of what this entails and that its not a solution but a workaround but trust me, you will start regretting your decision to go with a single turbo only to be troubleshooting and dumping money into it to solve this issue when it may very well end up being something that the stock DME wasn't built to handle properly. If Shiv's flash can't turn off misfire detection just get an AP, ask him to move the settings over and be done with it.

        People need to realize and understand what misfire detection is about and what a "misfire" represents and most importantly WHY has BMW decided to shut down fuel injection entirely as a result of misfires. The reason is environmental/emissions. An incomplete burn will pollute the environment and to conform to regulations they must do this. This wasn't the case in the past with cars as they'd just let you feel the actual misfires and in most cases they'd give you a check engine light only, not cut fuel to the cylinders or in this case to the entire bank.

        Obviously since this issue is quite new to you you'll be eager to solve it the "right" way but I strongly advise you not to go down that road, turn off misfire detection, put the car on the dyno and see if there are power issues in that misfire prone rev range and if there are none I wouldn't worry about it at all until more is known. See how the car "feels" with the detection off.

        If I had to guess the issue is to do with misfire detection algorithms and we don't have access to those just yet to be able to adjust or begin to understand the reasons why. It may be just too sensitive given what's happening with the motor at higher power levels and dumping time/parts at it can be deemed a waste at this point as I have very little doubt its anything hardware related.

        Having said all that, I do have to say that its ironic it came back to bite Shiv again. He went to such lengths in undermining all my efforts with the N54 after I left the procede camp to even mock me because of the car misfiring in the same way you, Big Tom, hotrod, and a bunch of others did. He even brainwashed sikh335 into mocking the same way only to have this issue come back on his ST cars. I recall Former_Boosted_IS's car also misfiring on the dyno but they were fixed with NGK plugs gapped at 0.022" apparently. I've learned not to trust anything coming from Vishnu and really do appreciate your openness on the subject sir. Anything you may need, any questions let me know. I'll be glad to help as much as I can.

        Again, just turn that misfire detection off, you'll be glad you did.
        So what, ultimately the solution to the misfire woes at least in your case is just to turn the detection off?
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        So what, ultimately the solution to the misfire woes at least in your case is just to turn the detection off?
        You clearly missed the part where I said its not a solution but a workaround and explained its temporary until we know what it is. I feel it is not hardware, that there is no actual misfire and it is programming related as the car shows no issues once it is turned off both on/off dyno as evidenced even in my recent 553whp/631wtq dyno runs. I was looking at them at zero smoothing to make sure there was no sudden dips or anything looking remotely off up there.
      1. Legionofboom's Avatar
        Legionofboom -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
        You clearly missed the part where I said its not a solution but a workaround and explained its temporary until we know what it is. I feel it is not hardware, there is no actual misfire and it is programming related as the car shows no issues once it is turned off on/off dyno as evidenced even in my recent 553whp/631wtq dyno runs. I was looking at them at zero smoothing to make sure there was no sudden dips or anything looking remotely off up there.
        Opinons on will these misfires continue with larger twins as well? On all tuning platforms?
      1. Ak335i's Avatar
        Ak335i -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BuraQ Click here to enlarge
        Yup, I dont have to feel jealous anymore when seeing a GTR.... LOL.... and spend less to do what they do and still enjoy BMW quality
        Yup theres gonna be a few of us with upgraded turbo(s) in the area soon Click here to enlarge lots of fun coming to south/central florida and lots of drag times and info
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90SoFlo Click here to enlarge
        Opinons on will these misfires continue with larger twins as well? On all tuning platforms?
        I'd say yes.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
        You clearly missed the part where I said its not a solution but a workaround and explained its temporary until we know what it is. I feel it is not hardware, that there is no actual misfire and it is programming related as the car shows no issues once it is turned off both on/off dyno as evidenced even in my recent 553whp/631wtq dyno runs. I was looking at them at zero smoothing to make sure there was no sudden dips or anything looking remotely off up there.
        I wasn't criticizing you I was saying your solution was to disable misfire detection right?
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I wasn't criticizing you I was saying your solution was to disable misfire detection right?
        Just a workaround until we have enough visibility into the DME's inner workings behind misfire detection and what it entails instead of dumping more parts and wasting time on it. Its becoming very clear that this issue is not hardware related. On top of that is already VERY clear the car will not have a serious issue with misfire detection disabled. If anyone would've had it I would have already.
      1. Terry@BMS's Avatar
        Terry@BMS -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
        The guy's having tuning/hardware issues, been there, done that. I've run 12.1@122.5 on RB turbos, does this mean I'm faster than he is? In the quarter mile maybe, but from a roll, I don't stand a chance.
        Eh, you might be surprised. As it stands now the autos are really not much faster than a properly tuned RB car. Maybe when they can rev higher they will shine a bit more.
      1. Legionofboom's Avatar
        Legionofboom -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Terry@BMS Click here to enlarge
        Eh, you might be surprised. As it stands now the autos are really not much faster than a properly tuned RB car. Maybe when they can rev higher they will shine a bit more.
        RB (550whp) vs ST-AT (580whp) good point. Also you have to remember the difference on how the different turbo's react.
      1. themyst's Avatar
        themyst -
        I seriously believe that the misfire issues are caused by something in the Procede inner workings. Other than a few outliers, the common denominator is that those who have phantom misfires all ran the Procede extensively.

        Haven't ever heard of a long-time Cobb user ever having these phantom misfires.
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90SoFlo Click here to enlarge
        RB (550whp) vs ST-AT (580whp) good point. Also you have to remember the difference on how the different turbo's react.
        Just to clarify and to set expectations accordingly, 550whp is not a realistic reliable number for any RB car out there at least not at the moment. Those dynos from my car that were posted were all-out and were not done with a stock cylinder head or with high reliability in mind from the turbos point of view. Power curves are also VERY different. My dynos were there to push the setup to its limits and see what it might do at levels never tested before along with cylinder head testing.
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
        I seriously believe that the misfire issues are caused by something in the Procede inner workings. Other than a few outliers, the common denominator is that those who have phantom misfires all ran the Procede extensively.

        Haven't ever heard of a long-time Cobb user ever having these phantom misfires.
        hotrod had the same issue on the JB. Its not procede, or jb and given enough time I'd put my money on it that a car that's never seen a piggyback would also exhibit the same problem.
      1. themyst's Avatar
        themyst -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
        Just to clarify and to set expectations accordingly, 550whp is not a realistic reliable number for any RB car out there at least not at the moment. Those dynos from my car that were posted were all-out and were not done with a stock cylinder head or with high reliability in mind from the turbos point of view. Power curves are also VERY different. My dynos were there to push the setup to its limits and see what it might do at levels never tested before along with cylinder head testing.
        580whp isn't a reliable number for the ST; what's your point?
      1. Terry@BMS's Avatar
        Terry@BMS -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by E90SoFlo Click here to enlarge
        RB (550whp) vs ST-AT (580whp) good point. Also you have to remember the difference on how the different turbo's react.
        No I'm talking just RBs @ 500-520rw vs. ST-AT @ 570-580rw. I saw it first hand during the runway races when comparing various races. The extra 50rw up to is nerfed by the 50rw-100rw less down low. Net result is it's not much faster if at all.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
        Just a workaround until we have enough visibility into the DME's inner workings behind misfire detection and what it entails instead of dumping more parts and wasting time on it. Its becoming very clear that this issue is not hardware related. On top of that is already VERY clear the car will not have a serious issue with misfire detection disabled. If anyone would've had it I would have already.
        So the answer is yes, thanks.
      1. themyst's Avatar
        themyst -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks Click here to enlarge
        hotrod had the same issue on the JB. Its not procede, or jb and given enough time I'd put my money on it that a car that's never seen a piggyback would also exhibit the same problem.
        Care to provide any examples of a cobb only user exhibiting this issue? My current car I have never ran the procede extensively, mostly cobb with some jb4 stacking.
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
        580whp isn't a reliable number for the ST; what's your point?
        Read again. I made a reference to the comment on the 550whp out of an RB car.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        So the answer is yes, thanks.
        Answer was no as I disagree its a solution. Its a workaround. In my world those two are very different.
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by themyst Click here to enlarge
        Care to provide any examples of a cobb only user exhibiting this issue? My current car I have never ran the procede extensively, mostly cobb with some jb4 stacking.
        How does providing an example here prove your point?