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    • PRO TUNING FREAKS Cobb AP tuned upgraded turbo and ported cylinder head N54 E90 335i hits 553 wheel horsepower 631 wheel torque on pump gas and meth - N54 Twin Turbo World Record

      Last night I hit the dyno to see what the car can do with the new ported N54 cylinder head, RB turbos, 3.5bar TMAP sensor from the new BMW N20 four-cylinder motor, FBO (catless), pump 94 octane and meth, stock turbo inlet pipes. Key thing here, this is with a tune that sees ZERO timing corrections everywhere on all cylinders and timing that is set right at MBT for this level of boost and this car's given octane. I've run the car on the street with this exact setup this morning, number of pulls, it's pretty ridiculous.

      553WHP/631WTQ - PUMP GAS (94 Octane) + METH


      In terms of the tune, it was running more than 22.5psi in midrange, 19.7psi peak at 6k rpm, 17.5-18psi at redline. Logs of actual boost in midrange aren't available as I found out that ATP's datalogging needs to be updated to accomodate the 3.5bar scaling. I was going off my p3 gauge for midrange boost when pushed past the 22.5psi datalogging limit. I don't recommend this to anyone before ATP is updated for 3.5bar datalog scaling, it just had to be done last night and I decided to push on as I get to do what I feel is best for my car LOL and that's make some power

      No leanouts or fuel issues. LTFTs goes down to zero during the pull, STFTs trend to high negative 20s with meth. The car was running close to if not 100% meth, three 1.0mm nozzles, two of them in the FMIC outlet silicone coupler and another up in the ER charge pipe past the elbow.

      I'll be fine tuning things over the coming days but to be perfectly honest and blunt, last night was about turning things UP and NOT fine tuning. It was to find MBT and push boost as far as it can go while limiting wastegate duty cycle to about 73-74% everywhere especially past 6k rpm. It was also to experiment with various VANOS changes. I experimented with higher wg duty cycles before and RBs didn't like it. It also introduces too much backpressure into the system even fully catless that the car doesn't like it.

      So, is there more power left here. We'll see when the intake pipes are swapped for something better flowing. @George Smooth reported +19whp at his high altitude in South Africa so possibly another 20 in there without any changes. Then there's mixing race gas or E85 into it to see if there's anything there in terms of additional power through more timing. All out its very possible this will be a 575-585whp setup once all is said and done, dare I say 600 LOL

      Other runs from last night:


      By the way, on Smoothing of zero the car made 555WHP Nice even number easy to remember

      When that torque hits it feels like a big turbo came on!! Swoooooosh!

      Specs:

      PTF Cobb AP Tune
      PTF Ported Cylinder Head w/ +1mm enlarged Super Alloy Exhaust Valves
      RB Turbos
      3.5bar BMW N20 engine TMAP sensor
      Aquamist HFS-4 Methanol Injection (100% meth, three 1.0mm nozzles, Howerton 2.2gal trunk mounted tank)
      AR Catless Downpipes
      HKS Legamax Exhaust
      Custom Mr.5-like intake
      KL Racing (aka Big Tom) FMIC
      ER 3" post FMIC piping (up pipe, charge Pipe) + Tial BOV
      Okada Plasma Ignition Coils + OEM Plugs
      HPF Stage 2 Feramic Clutch + OEM Dual Mass Flywheel
      DSS 1000hp rear axles
      Rear m3 suspension bits
      2.56 Quaife LSD
      17x9 APEX ARC-8 wheels
      Nitto 555 245/45/17 front, Nitto 555R 275/40/17 rear tires
      Vorsteiner Carbon Fiber hood (single sided, vented)
      Carbon Fiber trunk
      Sunoco (Petro Canada) pump 94 Octane




      EDIT: Some people asked to see the conditions from the dyno, STD correction factor as well as the same run but in SAE. Here they are below:

      CONDITIONS AND STD CORRECTION (i.e. STD resulted in 1.00 correction, so no correction basically):



      SAE numbers for the same run (SAE correction was 0.97, so 3% lower than STD):

      This article was originally published in forum thread: PTF UPDATE: 553WHP 631WTQ - N54 TwinTurbo World Record started by dzenno@ProTUNING Freaks View original post
      Comments 217 Comments
      1. rudypoochris's Avatar
        rudypoochris -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by klipseracer Click here to enlarge
        Great numbers. His much has the new gearing influenced the figures??
        I didn't think gearing and tire size were inputs for dynojets? Shouldn't have any meaningful effect imho.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
        I didn't think gearing and tire size were inputs for dynojets? Shouldn't have any meaningful effect imho.
        Wheels, tires, and what gear you run do have an effect.

        You try to run in 1:1 on a dynojet.
      1. rudypoochris's Avatar
        rudypoochris -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Wheels, tires, and what gear you run do have an effect.

        You try to run in 1:1 on a dynojet.
        Well yeah, but I wouldn't expect the difference to be huge.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
        Well yeah, but I wouldn't expect the difference to be huge.
        It can be...
      1. Flinchy's Avatar
        Flinchy -
        Gearing/tyre selection is one thing that makes dyno results meaningless in a real world scenario... Dzenno has a 2.5x final drive, this results in much MUCH greater in-gear speeds, totally changes the torque feel of the car...

        with this power level/torque level, it would be much MUCH more manageable to drive around with the long gearing.

        ED: i have no idea if it effects dyno results, or how they're calculated

        but actual torque to the wheels will differ between 2.56/3.06/3.46...

        http://www.team-integra.net/forum/14...es-torque.html

        explains it perfectly

        "Gaining power with a different transmission? They didn't teach us that at Import Tuner magazine school. This will of course not be shown on a dyno because they take the RPM signal and roller speed to correct down to a 1:1 ratio to get a clean measurement."

        important part, i guess.

        the torque shown in this thread is not indicative of what is actually seen at the wheels... unless this dyno in particular doesn't work like that, and shows what is actually seen at the wheels in gear?... considering that 631wtq is about as high as it gets anyway, i'm guessing not.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
        the torque shown in this thread is not indicative of what is actually seen at the wheels...
        Exactly and this is why so many of the N54 guys who talk about "OMG so much torque" are complete retards. Not referring to the torque this particular car is making I'm saying generally.
      1. rudypoochris's Avatar
        rudypoochris -
        Torque and power are referenced at peak usually which just really tells you want the power curve looks like. Obviously the torque to the wheels changes via gearing... that is what gears do. I wouldn't o with a 2.56 personally sine the ratios will be way too long for most realistic use, but that's just me.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
        I wouldn't o with a 2.56 personally sine the ratios will be way too long for most realistic use, but that's just me.
        It serves a purpose though lower the torque while extending it over a longer MPH range. Making it easier to put down and eliminating as frequent of shifting and also holding more torque on average over a longer span.
      1. rudypoochris's Avatar
        rudypoochris -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        It serves a purpose though lower the torque while extending it over a longer MPH range. Making it easier to put down and eliminating as frequent of shifting and also holding more torque on average over a longer span.
        The benefit is in less shifts really.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
        The benefit is in less shifts really.
        Not just that like I said more average torque over a broader speed range. Once the shorter gear set shifts the longer gear set now has more torque.

        I'm just going to prove this in practice by going to longer gears and testing it on the track.
      1. Flinchy's Avatar
        Flinchy -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Not just that like I said more average torque over a broader speed range. Once the shorter gear set shifts the longer gear set now has more torque.

        I'm just going to prove this in practice by going to longer gears and testing it on the track.
        My thought is that longer gearing would be more beneficial on the strip (and smoother on the street) but less so on the track?

        i mean, it has to be a balance, super short gears suck, and so would super long gears


        but i can't really see a 2.56fd going around a track faster than a 3.x

        you may get a broader in gear torque/speed spread, but the wheels see less.. a LOT less.
      1. DefactoM6's Avatar
        DefactoM6 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Exactly and this is why so many of the N54 guys who talk about "OMG so much torque" are complete retards. Not referring to the torque this particular car is making I'm saying generally.
        Awww...don't be mad that this car makes more torque than the godly S65, you'll still have eleventy billion WHP to go with that 450wtq...
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DefactoM6 Click here to enlarge
        Awww...don't be mad that this car makes more torque than the godly S65, you'll still have eleventy billion WHP to go with that 450wtq...
        You do a perfect job as an example of retard as applied in my comment.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
        My thought is that longer gearing would be more beneficial on the strip (and smoother on the street) but less so on the track?
        For the most part, yes. Depends on the track but usually you will want tighter spacing for the speeds you will be at on the roadcourse.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
        you may get a broader in gear torque/speed spread, but the wheels see less.. a LOT less.
        If you calculate the math out the wheels will only see less at certain speeds but more at certain speeds.

        Shorter gears for example will have more torque until the 1st to 2nd shift. So once in 2nd the longer gears still in first will have more torque up until it shifts into second. This process then repeats itself but multiplication is greatest in 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and then levels out pretty hard.

        See here, not an N54 but it applies as well:

        Click here to enlarge
      1. DefactoM6's Avatar
        DefactoM6 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        You do a perfect job as an example of retard as applied in my comment.
        What's really retarded is bringing gearing into a discussion about dyno numbers. We're not talking about trans losses, which is why you run 1:1...or weight of the wheel/tire combo...these are dyno numbers. Just like your eleventy billion WHP.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
        you may get a broader in gear torque/speed spread, but the wheels see less.. a LOT less.
        Here is what happens when you take the blue line, dct, from 3.15 final drive stock as in the previous graph to 3.62 as shown in this one. More torque, but for less MPH. I ran 3.62 gears, hurt trap:

        Click here to enlarge
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DefactoM6 Click here to enlarge
        What's really retarded is bringing gearing into a discussion about dyno numbers.
        OMG, wow, you seriously just said this? Gearing is a huge part as you don't race on the dyno and secondly others were asking about how his longer gears apply. Obviously you are more concerned with irrelevant comments and and attempting to be negative.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DefactoM6 Click here to enlarge
        We're not talking about trans losses, which is why you run 1:1...or weight of the wheel/tire combo...these are dyno numbers. Just like your eleventy billion WHP.
        You're honestly just plain stupid and messing up the thread. Since you obviously aren't grasping the topic move along so other people can discuss it. Not going to tell you again.
      1. DefactoM6's Avatar
        DefactoM6 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        OMG, wow, you seriously just said this? Gearing is a huge part as you don't race on the dyno and secondly others were asking about how his longer gears apply. Obviously you are more concerned with irrelevant comments and and attempting to be negative.
        You're honestly just stupid and messing up the thread. Since you obviously aren't grasping the topic move along so other people can discuss it. Not going to tell you again.
        Again, resorting to personal attacks without actually addressing the issue. Real mature. I'm not denying the fact that gearing plays a huge role in RACING. Dzenno, however, did not race...he spun some rollers on a DYNO. Which correct for things like gearing, since that amount of torque is obviously not what is actually seen at the wheels in ANY gear. Read what I actually said before you get all fired up.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DefactoM6 Click here to enlarge
        Again, resorting to personal attacks without actually addressing the issue. Real mature. I'm not denying the fact that gearing plays a huge role in RACING. Dzenno, however, did not race...he spun some rollers on a DYNO. Which correct for things like gearing, since that amount of torque is obviously not what is actually seen at the wheels in ANY gear. Read what I actually said before you get all fired up.
        No you coming in here with a negative tone designed to put down the motor you know I have was a veiled personal attack and immature. I don't have time for this and secondly this is taking the discussion off topic so I'm removing you from the thread.

        You said it's retarded to bring gearing into a discussion about dyno numbers when first of all, as you just stated gearing plays a huge role, and secondly users asked about how his longer gearing plays into this.

        Anyway, since I have seen your posting pattern as of late I'm not going to waste a good thread sitting here tutoring you and allowing you to crap all over it. Back on topic and you won't be posting any longer in this thread.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Flinchy Click here to enlarge
        My thought is that longer gearing would be more beneficial on the strip (and smoother on the street) but less so on the track?

        i mean, it has to be a balance, super short gears suck, and so would super long gears


        but i can't really see a 2.56fd going around a track faster than a 3.x

        you may get a broader in gear torque/speed spread, but the wheels see less.. a LOT less.
        I thankfully found an old post of mine I have been looking for... for well forever. If you take these dyno results, then do the math with his gears and final drive, you'll get something that looks like this:

        Click here to enlarge

        So that's how you can figure out what gearing you want for what speeds.

        This should explain what you are seeing:

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        There is a chunk from about 88 mph to 102 mph where the 6 speed is making more torque at the axle.

        This takes place after the 1/8 mile. The fastest 1/8 mile recorded is mine: 7.876 @ 91.640.

        Now, that 1/8 mile is faster both in ET and trap than the fastest 1/4 mile trapping M3 which is eagletangogreen at 115.9 mph.

        Now, his car is manual and it reflects the gearing difference perfectly.

        My car DCT:

        1/8: 7.920 @ 91.6 mph
        1/4: 12.19 @ 115.170

        His car 6MT:

        1/8: 8.133 @ 89.8 mph
        1/4: 12.36 @ 115.9

        So, even though I am pulling harder at the 1/8 mile and get there quicker in my DCT, because the DCT has to shift to 4th gear it has less torque @ the axle for a significantly long period after the 1/8. His results reflect this as the manual is able to erase the difference in trap speed at the 1/8 and actually start to pull.

        It is not enough of a difference for him to catch me by the 1/4, but hope this shows that the shorter gearing of the DCT is actually a detriment in the 1/4 but an advantage in the 1/8. It would be an advantage on the road course.