• Boosted E9X M3 Showdown - Supercharged ESS VT1-535 w/meth vs. Active Autowerke Stage 2+ w/meth + ESS VT2-600 - All DCT

      Here is a nice little boosted M3 battle for your viewing pleasure. This comes courtesy of BimmerBoost member LostMarine who is the camera car with his supercharged DCT E92 M3 running the ESS VT1-535 kit with a higher boost pulley and meth. The white E90 M3 belongs to BimmerBoost member akh23456 also being a DCT car but running an Active Autowerke Stage 2+ setup with a bigger blower and meth. The final car is running the ESS VT2-600 supercharger kit with a catless exhaust.


      Now, the Active Autowerke car puts a hurting on Lost Marine's ESS-VT1 setup. It straight up dusts him there is no easy way to say it. That is fine considering he is running the lowest power kit from ESS and it has no intercooler. What is fairly surprising is how well he does against the ESS VT2-600 setup, losing, but putting up a very good fight until the VT2-600 slowly pulls up top. We are guessing that VT2-600 owner is going to be looking into meth very quickly.

      No transmission or shift excuses in this video with all M3's having the dual clutch transmission. All cars are supposedly on 93 octane but you never know. We do not get to see the Active Autowerke car run the ESS VT2-600 setup but it's not difficult to come to the realization that he would make easy work of it. That is one very quick M3 and we would like to get the full specs on the upgraded blower it is running as soon as possible. Very nice races, enjoy.

      @LostMarine @akh23456

      This article was originally published in forum thread: AA Stg2+ E90 M3 Vs ESS VT1535 w/Meth E92 M3 Vs ESS VT2600 E92 M3- All DCT started by LostMarine View original post
      Comments 199 Comments
      1. Sorena's Avatar
        Sorena -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Come on man, you don't make their business model.

        They never did a turbo "kit" for the E46 M3 they were one-off builds.

        The approach they are taking with their SC kits is the right one. Let others worry about N54 turbo upgrades. They can't just do big investments on multiple platforms to satisfy curiosity.
        You are right and i apologize. I went off my limits.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
        You are right and i apologize. I went off my limits.
        I don't think you did anything wrong I just think the current economic climate dictates much stricter budgets.
      1. flipm3's Avatar
        flipm3 -
        Just to kind of throw this out in the field. I took a dyno posted by Omar when he worked for AA for the prior AA Stage2 with GTS5550 at 8psi. Then I took another dyno posted by Jean at VelosDesignwerks of a VT2-625 at 7.5psi. They were both dyno'd in Miami, FL. I am not sure if it was done at the same location or even the same conditions.

        What I did was use the handy dandy Photoshop, and I transformed each graph so that the X and Y axis and scaling lined up. Believe it or not, it actually lined up significantly better than I expected. I purposely left the right side of the image sloppy so you can see how I lined everything up.

        So take this photo for what it's worth. I did it just so we can visually see the differences between the two kits that seem most comparable without having any DRF files.

        Click here to enlarge
        I know it's not the most scientific nor controlled comparison. But I specifically chose these dynos because of where they were conducted and the close levels of boost. Considering that Andrew@AA mentioned that the newer GTS5555 holds power better up top and may be good for 10hp or so, I would LOVE to see what a current out-of-the-box AA Stage 2 and ESS VT2-625 stack up on the dyno and track. No extra modifications to the standard offered kit. No funky tunes. No funky pulleys.

        Of course that would be in the ideal world, which is likely to not happen, haha.

        ORIGINAL DYNOS are property of Active Autowerke and Velos Designwerks respectively. If you want me to take down this photo, I will gladly do so. My intention was just to provide a visual representation of what is being discussed here, not to step on any ones toes.
      1. LostMarine's Avatar
        LostMarine -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by flipm3 Click here to enlarge
        Just to kind of throw this out in the field. I took a dyno posted by Omar when he worked for AA for the prior AA Stage2 with GTS5550 at 8psi. Then I took another dyno posted by Jean at VelosDesignwerks of a VT2-625 at 7.5psi. They were both dyno'd in Miami, FL. I am not sure if it was done at the same location or even the same conditions.

        What I did was use the handy dandy Photoshop, and I transformed each graph so that the X and Y axis and scaling lined up. Believe it or not, it actually lined up significantly better than I expected. I purposely left the right side of the image sloppy so you can see how I lined everything up.

        So take this photo for what it's worth. I did it just so we can visually see the differences between the two kits that seem most comparable without having any DRF files.

        I know it's not the most scientific nor controlled comparison. But I specifically chose these dynos because of where they were conducted and the close levels of boost. Considering that Andrew@AA mentioned that the newer GTS5555 holds power better up top and may be good for 10hp or so, I would LOVE to see what a current out-of-the-box AA Stage 2 and ESS VT2-625 stack up on the dyno and track. No extra modifications to the standard offered kit. No funky tunes. No funky pulleys.

        Of course that would be in the ideal world, which is likely to not happen, haha.

        ORIGINAL DYNOS are property of Active Autowerke and Velos Designwerks respectively. If you want me to take down this photo, I will gladly do so. My intention was just to provide a visual representation of what is being discussed here, not to step on any ones toes.

        Thanks! That looks damn good actually. I thought I saw an overlay by PG with this before since he is the "Dyno Master" (IIRC he used it with a different intent)
        But here, i think it relates perfectly to what we saw on the road
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by flipm3 Click here to enlarge
        Just to kind of throw this out in the field. I took a dyno posted by Omar when he worked for AA for the prior AA Stage2 with GTS5550 at 8psi. Then I took another dyno posted by Jean at VelosDesignwerks of a VT2-625 at 7.5psi. They were both dyno'd in Miami, FL. I am not sure if it was done at the same location or even the same conditions.

        What I did was use the handy dandy Photoshop, and I transformed each graph so that the X and Y axis and scaling lined up. Believe it or not, it actually lined up significantly better than I expected. I purposely left the right side of the image sloppy so you can see how I lined everything up.

        So take this photo for what it's worth. I did it just so we can visually see the differences between the two kits that seem most comparable without having any DRF files.

        I know it's not the most scientific nor controlled comparison. But I specifically chose these dynos because of where they were conducted and the close levels of boost. Considering that Andrew@AA mentioned that the newer GTS5555 holds power better up top and may be good for 10hp or so, I would LOVE to see what a current out-of-the-box AA Stage 2 and ESS VT2-625 stack up on the dyno and track. No extra modifications to the standard offered kit. No funky tunes. No funky pulleys.

        Of course that would be in the ideal world, which is likely to not happen, haha.

        ORIGINAL DYNOS are property of Active Autowerke and Velos Designwerks respectively. If you want me to take down this photo, I will gladly do so. My intention was just to provide a visual representation of what is being discussed here, not to step on any ones toes.
        Interesting, so green is the HKS at 8 psi?

        Well done. Would you mind doing a cleaner one though just because? Or do you think you need the .drf files at this point?
      1. LostMarine's Avatar
        LostMarine -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Interesting, so green is the HKS at 8 psi?

        Well done. Would you mind doing a cleaner one though just because? Or do you think you need the .drf files at this point?

        drf files are like passwords, everyone has them, but noone wants to share..
      1. flipm3's Avatar
        flipm3 -
        I cleaned up the previous graph I photoshopped. In addition, I found another AA Stage 2 graph that seamed fair to compare with the same ESS VT2-625.

        All of these graphs were found publicly posted on various forums throughout the internet. They are property of Active Autowerke and Velos Designwerks respectively.

        I took the liberty of combining different graphs due to the lack of publicly shared .drf files. This was done by the use of Photoshop. These are by no means clear cut nor accurate comparison. My sole purpose is simply to provide a vague visual representation of the discussion of HKS GTS5550/GTS5555 supercharger potentially providing more midrange horsepower and torque than centrifugal Vortech V3si superchargers. It must be noted that both of these kits are supposedly 100% off-the-shelf. No upgraded pulleys or deviations from the publicly standard advertised kit. In addition, my understanding is that these AA Stage 2 kits are the older HKS GTS5550 supercharger that seems to be recently replaced by the HKS GTS5555. The difference between the two being that the newer variation may hold power better at the top end and possibly good for another 10hp and 5tq.

        As always, take this with a very fine grain of salt. Dyno comparisons can often be rather moot considering the extremely long list of debatable variances that all take effect on results. I encourage one to look at the bigger picture, looking at power delivery, weather conditions, etc. Every minute piece plays a big role in the end equation.

        Enjoy and discuss. To both Active Autowerke and ESS Tuning, you both make an incredible kit that that has through history shown to make incredible power and performance times. I encourage you all to keep raising the bar and pushing the S65B40 to the absolute limit...and then some Click here to enlarge
        Click here to enlarge

        Click here to enlarge
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by flipm3 Click here to enlarge
        discussion of HKS supercharger potentially providing more midrange horsepower and torque than centrifugal Vortech superchargers.
        I just want to clarify that we are not speaking about Vortech superchargers as a whole but of the V3si used by ESS in their kits. I think a Vortech T-Trim would provide a bit more meat, but there are different Vortech blowers and compressor maps.
      1. flipm3's Avatar
        flipm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I just want to clarify that we are not speaking about Vortech superchargers as a whole but of the V3si used by ESS in their kits. I think a Vortech T-Trim would provide a bit more meat, but there are different Vortech blowers and compressor maps.
        Good catch! I quickly edited the post to also clarify that point. Thanks!
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Wowwww..... the AA manhandled the ESS in that 2nd graph. Be interesting if we could get the Gintani & VF620 numbers in there too
      1. flipm3's Avatar
        flipm3 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        Wowwww..... the AA manhandled the ESS in that 2nd graph. Be interesting if we could get the Gintani & VF620 numbers in there too
        I would love to see that too! The only reason I specifically chose these very few several graphs was because they seem to be the most fair comparison. Reasons being; the individuals who personally dyno'd and posted them now work for the same company which slightly reduces personal bias and the location of both being Miami which kind of levels the variance of weather conditions.

        Any other dynojet dynos out there would pose way too many variables that I'd rather not even think about. Dyno comparisons give headaches...that's a known medical fact Click here to enlarge
      1. Sledgehammer's Avatar
        Sledgehammer -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I just want to clarify that we are not speaking about Vortech superchargers as a whole but of the V3si used by ESS in their kits. I think a Vortech T-Trim would provide a bit more meat, but there are different Vortech blowers and compressor maps.
        The differences between the V3-Si and the T trim are not that big. Talking 50cfm of flow and 50hp per Vortech. The V3 is pretty efficient
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sledgehammer Click here to enlarge
        The differences between the V3-Si and the T trim are not that big. Talking 50cfm of flow and 50hp per Vortech. The V3 is pretty efficient
        The T-trim can be overspun more and tends to work better towards the limit. It will outflow the V3.
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Some1 said it earlier in the thread (think LM with the cats analogy), but getting all those comparable kits on the same dyno in the same conditions is (sadly) going to be near impossible.


        I'm just very excited to see the non-meth kits battle it out: VF650 vs Evolve
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by benzy89 Click here to enlarge
        Some1 said it earlier in the thread (think LM with the cats analogy), but getting all those comparable kits on the same dyno in the same conditions is (sadly) going to be near impossible.
        I tried in the past... ESS backed out.
      1. benzy89's Avatar
        benzy89 -
        Party poopers
      1. akh23456's Avatar
        akh23456 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by flipm3 Click here to enlarge
        I cleaned up the previous graph I photoshopped. In addition, I found another AA Stage 2 graph that seamed fair to compare with the same ESS VT2-625.

        All of these graphs were found publicly posted on various forums throughout the internet. They are property of Active Autowerke and Velos Designwerks respectively.

        I took the liberty of combining different graphs due to the lack of publicly shared .drf files. This was done by the use of Photoshop. These are by no means clear cut nor accurate comparison. My sole purpose is simply to provide a vague visual representation of the discussion of HKS GTS5550/GTS5555 supercharger potentially providing more midrange horsepower and torque than centrifugal Vortech V3si superchargers. It must be noted that both of these kits are supposedly 100% off-the-shelf. No upgraded pulleys or deviations from the publicly standard advertised kit. In addition, my understanding is that these AA Stage 2 kits are the older HKS GTS5550 supercharger that seems to be recently replaced by the HKS GTS5555. The difference between the two being that the newer variation may hold power better at the top end and possibly good for another 10hp and 5tq.

        As always, take this with a very fine grain of salt. Dyno comparisons can often be rather moot considering the extremely long list of debatable variances that all take effect on results. I encourage one to look at the bigger picture, looking at power delivery, weather conditions, etc. Every minute piece plays a big role in the end equation.

        Enjoy and discuss. To both Active Autowerke and ESS Tuning, you both make an incredible kit that that has through history shown to make incredible power and performance times. I encourage you all to keep raising the bar and pushing the S65B40 to the absolute limit...and then some Click here to enlarge
        Great write up man. I know you understand Area under the Curve some people just don't.
      1. talontsi97's Avatar
        talontsi97 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BrenM3 Click here to enlarge
        Thats a td05 9.8 hotside evo8 turbo? Umm. You sure its not a stock "frame" red or green. I think bolted stroked its still looking at 420awhp no? Ive done a few.
        STOCK 10.5 turbo. Like prodigy said, owner just built the motor and is still working bugs out so no need to dump a big turbo kit yet. This setup with the midrange torque is to much fun.
      1. longboarder's Avatar
        longboarder -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by LostMarine Click here to enlarge
        All the runs were a 3rd gear roll for all cars, from 40-50mph start.The ER roll on event is coming around here shortly, dates TBD, but all these cars, and many more are encouraged and welcome to attend. No ESS cars were present for the last one, but AA and Gintani were. Im sure that will change, and more will attend now
        Wait...are you saying you did a 3rd gear roll-on at between 40-50 mph? My M3 is stock, but if I punch it in 3rd at that speed the car will barely accelerate. It's a f*ing slug at anything below 6,500 rpm. Even with a blower, you are still barely making boost at that RPM...and for that speed you'd have to be in 2nd gear to make optimal power. Was Akash starting in 2nd gear? If so, that would explain a lot. Can you ask him what gear he started in? Thanks.
      1. longboarder's Avatar
        longboarder -
        Actually from page 2 Akash said this:
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by akh23456 Click here to enlarge
        i dont remember the speed i think somewhere between 40-60 i was in 3rd gear i believe for both runs but i could be wrong.
        So was he in 2nd gear or 3rd gear? LM - sounds like you were definitely in 3rd. If Akash was in 2nd and you were in 3rd that would explain a lot as to me in this vid, it appears he has a 300 HP advantage. When I ran biglare in his 625 kit vs my stock turbo 335, he was making around 150-200 HP more than me and he walked me but pulled no where near as hard as Akash did on you LM.