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    • A visit with CP-E at SEMA - Pictures of prototype N54 twin turbo upgrade

      BimmerBoost stopped by the CP-E (Custom Performance Engineering) booth at SEMA 2011. What immediately caught our attention was the N54 twin turbo upgrade prototype they had on display. We asked a lot of questions but did not really get any concrete answers. Basically, this is going to go on their shop car. There will be two different turbo options the smaller of which should bolt in and the larger turbos requiring permanent modification to the engine bay / chassis to make them fit. Do not expect these until Summer next year although they were talking maybe even Spring.

      How about the tuning? Well, the Standback was suggested for it. As far as fuel to support 700+ horsepower goals there were not really any answers but secondary injection was suggested along with a new HPFP (high pressure fuel pump). We know everyone is going to be following this closely to see what comes of it and we wish CP-E the best with this project which is obviously at very early stages.

      The entire product offering is pictured and pictures were taken of all the CP-E BMW products that were on display. This includes the N54 blow off valve kit, N54 downpipes, dual cone intake, N54 FMIC, N55 downpipe, and their 1M exhaust.





























      This article was originally published in forum thread: A visit with CP-E at SEMA - Pictures of prototype N54 twin turbo upgrade started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 93 Comments
      1. BES335xi's Avatar
        BES335xi -
        Interesting....Updates pls! Click here to enlarge
      1. oddjob2021's Avatar
        oddjob2021 -
        +1 carcars... good luck getting an update. if they do plan further development for this kit they'll definitely update 'us' as we, the forums, are a huge customer bank for them. now why i don't see further development happening? they wont be able to beat the single kits pricing/power. and if the customer wants twins and not a single, he/she already has two very viable options available, with one about to get a major overhaul/upgrade.
      1. carcars's Avatar
        carcars -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by oddjob2021 Click here to enlarge
        +1 carcars... good luck getting an update. if they do plan further development for this kit they'll definitely update 'us' as we, the forums, are a huge customer bank for them. now why i don't see further development happening? they wont be able to beat the single kits pricing/power. and if the customer wants twins and not a single, he/she already has two very viable options available, with one about to get a major overhaul/upgrade.
        cp-e has great products and downpipe, IC, exhaust etc etc ....

        I do not understand as they are capable of giving false information turbosClick here to enlarge
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by oddjob2021 Click here to enlarge
        and if the customer wants twins and not a single, he/she already has two very viable options available, with one about to get a major overhaul/upgrade.
        Click here to enlarge you're talking ASR again? what major overhaul/upgrade? we haven't seen anything yet about those how would anyone know there is anything to overhaul or upgrade in the first place? just sayin' no offense
      1. oddjob2021's Avatar
        oddjob2021 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by carcars Click here to enlarge
        cp-e has great products and downpipe, IC, exhaust etc etc ....

        I do not understand as they are capable of giving false information turbosClick here to enlarge
        indeed they do have a great line of products, and i respect their company. maybe they just need more time than any other company to push a kit out. i never said they would release 'false' information (maybe it's just the language barrier), just that i don't see an update anytime soon, especially now that the single boys have come to play.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno Click here to enlarge
        Click here to enlarge you're talking ASR again? what major overhaul/upgrade? we haven't seen anything yet about those how would anyone know there is anything to overhaul or upgrade in the first place? just sayin' no offense
        indeed i am. and i mentioned some of it on my 'hello, i'm back' thread. there is still information i am not allowed to make public, yet, but the larger compressor wheel i can talk about. put it this way, he expects near 600wheel on racegas and low 500's on pump. that may or may not be a far-fetched claim, time will tell. prototype testing is still being done on the asr 1. they are quite thorough.
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by oddjob2021 Click here to enlarge
        indeed i am. and i mentioned some of it on my 'hello, i'm back' thread. there is still information i am not allowed to make public, yet, but the larger compressor wheel i can talk about. put it this way, he expects near 600wheel on racegas and low 500's on pump. that may or may not be a far-fetched claim, time will tell. prototype testing is still being done on the asr 1. they are quite thorough.
        lol its either them or you that's full of $#@! not sure hehehe Click here to enlarge just kidding
      1. oddjob2021's Avatar
        oddjob2021 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno Click here to enlarge
        lol its either them or you that's full of $#@! not sure hehehe Click here to enlarge just kidding
        well your two statements contradict each other, so i'm hoping you really mean the latter (just kidding). hey i didn't make the claim, i'm just a customer, but we'll see. i would be very surprised if by when he wants to display/sell his new update he has not dyno'd the 1 on the new turbo setup yet.
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        i just find it funny that they said they'll upgrade a compressor wheel and get 600wheel out of it that's all..i can tell you right now that won't do anything and compressor wheel is already maxed for the housing..
      1. fundahl's Avatar
        fundahl -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno Click here to enlarge
        i just find it funny that they said they'll upgrade a compressor wheel and get 600wheel out of it that's all..i can tell you right now that won't do anything and compressor wheel is already maxed for the housing..
        Yeah, most of the reason the N54 gets all crappy at high RPM is extreme back-pressure/heat from those tiny exhaust wheels and housings.

        A full twin kit like the CP-E prototype would likely work REALLY well.
      1. dzenno@PTF's Avatar
        dzenno@PTF -
        Unless its a twinscroll manifold I'm honestly not interested in upgrading at all...i love seeing this motor handle tons of power and pushing the limits but for I'll personally never go for a typical single...just like i never bit the bullet for nitrous even though it was always tempting due to the easy power adder ability...no rushing things, RBs are honestly way more than plenty on the street for now and its fun tuning them too with Cobb and learning along the way
      1. carcars's Avatar
        carcars -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno Click here to enlarge
        Unless its a twinscroll manifold I'm honestly not interested in upgrading at all...i love seeing this motor handle tons of power and pushing the limits but for I'll personally never go for a typical single...just like i never bit the bullet for nitrous even though it was always tempting due to the easy power adder ability...no rushing things, RBs are honestly way more than plenty on the street for now and its fun tuning them too with Cobb and learning along the way
        yesterday bought a set of turbos rb for a client,perhaps the change by mine hehehe ...

        see that such work and compare withlobamotorsport
      1. Rob@RBTurbo's Avatar
        Rob@RBTurbo -
        ASR needs to adopt a Version naming convention whilst realizing there's a time and a place for Hybrids such as ASR and RBs. Minor changes such as are so often noted are simply not going to amount to much in the grand scheme of things. Biggest concern at this time should be induction tubes. Then maybe compressor housings with new hotside intercooler to turbo pipes. The OEM actuators are great, nothing to do there. The internal gates are junk and need replacement 95% of the time. Water cooling is a plus. Without a new housing the compressor size is limited. After that you can tune away to the most the turbine housings will allow... But don't expect too much, be happy with what they are known for being capable of as it's quite an improvement with a fairly simple install and low cost.
      1. oddjob2021's Avatar
        oddjob2021 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by dzenno Click here to enlarge
        i just find it funny that they said they'll upgrade a compressor wheel and get 600wheel out of it that's all..i can tell you right now that won't do anything and compressor wheel is already maxed for the housing..
        luckily for them, that's not all of the modification being done. unfortunately for the forums i cannot divulge deeply into each and every piece of the puzzle... yet. patience should be simple in this case as only a handful of people on this forum own a set. and the ones who do probably know the same as i do, as they got the upgrade pitch/purchase from the man himself. now that you mention it, a new compressor housing is also on the burner for an even larger compressor but that is way down the pipeline if ever happening.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by SlicktopTTZ Click here to enlarge
        Yeah, most of the reason the N54 gets all crappy at high RPM is extreme back-pressure/heat from those tiny exhaust wheels and housings.

        A full twin kit like the CP-E prototype would likely work REALLY well.
        i would tend to agree, but are you honestly expecting an update any time soon? the mani's sure look great and are probably functional... the problem i foresee is not much gain over the stock mani/full upgraded chra combo, so not much sales because of the large price difference. time will tell as always.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Rob@RBTurbo Click here to enlarge
        ASR needs to adopt a Version naming convention whilst realizing there's a time and a place for Hybrids such as ASR and RBs. Minor changes such as are so often noted are simply not going to amount to much in the grand scheme of things. Biggest concern at this time should be induction tubes. Then maybe compressor housings with new hotside intercooler to turbo pipes. The OEM actuators are great, nothing to do there. The internal gates are junk and need replacement 95% of the time. Water cooling is a plus. Without a new housing the compressor size is limited. After that you can tune away to the most the turbine housings will allow... But don't expect too much, be happy with what they are known for being capable of as it's quite an improvement with a fairly simple install and low cost.
        ah rob, you cease to amaze me. and you seem to know a few little facts that i purposely left out, so you have some spies somewhere, or maybe called as a mock customer interested? yes the new design chra's will be water-cooled and oil cooled like the rb set-up and stock chra. the new actuators will be only piston type. that's all the information i can release i'm sorry. time'll go faster than you think and we'll have a new asr dyno for people to bash and call fake/fabricated.
      1. Rob@RBTurbo's Avatar
        Rob@RBTurbo -
        No spies here. Just common layman concepts that's all. None of which will amount to much as I've said prior. The turbine housing is still a small turbine housing, capable of only so much of flow. Nothing against ASR, in fact if any spies had ever contacted me they'd probably say that I've praised their efforts. I just think they waste much effort in areas that don't really matter (ie. several different styles of wastegate actuators, ever changing compressors, slightly different turbine housing maching strategies etc). It doesn't take a spy for this type of data when I can just read about how it's going to increase power by about 100rwhp to be the supreme Hybrid on BimmerBoost.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by carcars Click here to enlarge
        cp-e has great products and downpipe, IC, exhaust etc etc ....

        I do not understand as they are capable of giving false information turbosClick here to enlarge
        I can't even get a hold of CP-E...
      1. Eleventeen's Avatar
        Eleventeen -
        Unless ASR is going to cut off the stock turbos and weld on larger frame turbos (e.g. TD04), then they are wasting their time. I have about 7 Mitsubishi turbos in my garage, and 4 of them are our stock TD03 units. One of them has been disected pretty well, and I can honestly say that I am impressed with the results Rob has had with his turbos, considering the limitations of the stock housings. I really don't foresee much more power being RELIABLY pushed through those units.

        Click here to enlarge

        Actually, for a TD03 frame, I think our 10T compressor wheel is as large as they come from Mitsubishi. Yes we can continue to add larger compressor wheels (like a 19T with a new compressor housing), but the amount of compressor surge and backpressure will be retarded.
      1. Brey335i's Avatar
        Brey335i -
        The only thing ASR does well is ripping people off...
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Brey335i Click here to enlarge
        The only thing ASR does well is ripping people off...
        Click here to enlarge
      1. oddjob2021's Avatar
        oddjob2021 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Rob@RBTurbo Click here to enlarge
        No spies here. Just common layman concepts that's all. None of which will amount to much as I've said prior. The turbine housing is still a small turbine housing, capable of only so much of flow. Nothing against ASR, in fact if any spies had ever contacted me they'd probably say that I've praised their efforts. I just think they waste much effort in areas that don't really matter (ie. several different styles of wastegate actuators, ever changing compressors, slightly different turbine housing maching strategies etc). It doesn't take a spy for this type of data when I can just read about how it's going to increase power by about 100rwhp to be the supreme Hybrid on BimmerBoost.
        haha well i thought i'd ask anyway. was interested in how you'd respond. and i sincerely doubt they are trying to be the 'supreme' twin-upgrade 'on Bimmerboost', or any forum for that matter, they just want to push the envelope as far as it'll go. and now with shiv making 628 on pump+meth, high 500's/low 600's on racegas+meth doesn't seem too inconceivable for ASR's new units, i mean, they made ~540wheel years back on v3 with the 'current' set-up! you're saying the makeover + v5 couldn't amount to more than ~50rwhp? it's very possible the turbine or compressor housing will limit it, and in that case i'm sure he'll adjust to make even more power. i really thank shiv for being the guinea pig when it comes to motor destruction. seems as far as the stock MAP sensor goes we're good to go. I'm certain once that's changed and we see more boost, especially from a single, something will break... i mean it's open deck! oh and fwiw, asr's units can go above and beyond 20-22psi as well, and still be efficient, unfortunately, i doubt he'll ever make a compressor map public.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Eleventeen Click here to enlarge
        Unless ASR is going to cut off the stock turbos and weld on larger frame turbos (e.g. TD04), then they are wasting their time. I have about 7 Mitsubishi turbos in my garage, and 4 of them are our stock TD03 units. One of them has been disected pretty well, and I can honestly say that I am impressed with the results Rob has had with his turbos, considering the limitations of the stock housings. I really don't foresee much more power being RELIABLY pushed through those units.

        Click here to enlarge

        Actually, for a TD03 frame, I think our 10T compressor wheel is as large as they come from Mitsubishi. Yes we can continue to add larger compressor wheels (like a 19T with a new compressor housing), but the amount of compressor surge and backpressure will be retarded.
        indeed the 10T wheel is quite large for the stock turbine. this is why torque drops like a rock on stock units when you tune and try to extract more power, the compressor does well, but the turbine falters. the turbine cannot flow what the compressor and engine can. asr's upgrade, just like rb's, has a larger turbine. the turbine to compressor ratio is less than that of stock (at least on asr's). with the new comp. wheel the ratio will be almost identical to stock, however both are bigger because the turbine is bigger, make sense? the way he explained it to me is the turbine has a chunk of room left on it, that the compressor is slightly too small (few mm's). just clarifying info for those members that are not as familiar with turbo talk. if you think i'm beating a dead horse that's fine, i'm quite happy to leave this discussion where it is and wait for the numbers. if asr cannot make much more than 540-550 i would be more than willing to take back all i've said and apologize for the high hopes amounting to nothing. now my question to you is would you do the same if they reach the goal i've stated? would you say all that you posted pertaining to this matter was incorrect and misinformed, etc etc? somehow i doubt it.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Click here to enlarge
        perfect smiley for the comment brey335i made.
      1. Rob@RBTurbo's Avatar
        Rob@RBTurbo -
        I do agree with a ragged edge tune, race gas, friendly dyno, optimum conditions, all supporting mods, and for all they are worth, etc etc Glory Run... they should be able to achieve 550-575rwhp. I've said this for years regarding RBs, and am confident ASRs and TD2s are capable as well. I am just saying there is nothing more to do, and they are what they are... running around saying you are doing this or that is not going to change some fundamental facts of what hardware remains. So until he says he is replacing the whole turbo, there is not much value in discussing anything further about other minor changes. Hybrids are nice, they have their place that appeals to the majority of the folks out there who like their low end and quick spool and power increase at a fair price... but there comes a point when you seriously just have to realize they are only capable of so much.