• Brembo and BMW working on offering carbon ceramic brake options for M models including the F10 M5 and F12 M6

      This information comes from Bimmerfile who was able to confirm with a member of BMW's board of directors, Dr. Hubert Diess, that carbon ceramic braking options are coming. BMW is working with Brembo who will be producing the discs and likely the rotors as well. We hope the carbon discs and rotors are from Brembo as one looking for an upgrade for the traditionally weak BMW brakes tends to go to aftermarket Brembo big brake setups anyway.

      This will mean that for the first time a BMW or M car will have a carbon ceramic braking options. How much will they run? Well, these brakes are not cheap and on makes that offer them the price is usually well over $10k. Maybe with a greater production number and being available on the M5, M6, and likely future M models as well the price will be driven down. This brake package is about a year away but has a chance of debuting with the sale of the F10 M5 in the USA.

      This article was originally published in forum thread: Brembo and BMW working on offering carbon ceramic brake options for M models including the F10 M5 and F12 M6 started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 58 Comments
      1. Sorena's Avatar
        Sorena -
        That's not really true. The ceramic brakes manufactures always point to the high effect of ceramic brakes in higher temps. in a customer's mind, this means the brakes aren't effective in lower temps and they are good for higher temps. but this isn't true, ceramic brakes like normal brakes are effective in lower temps, but in higher temps unlike normal brakes they are still effective.
      1. fastgti69's Avatar
        fastgti69 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Well then Chevy can't match BMW on what the warranty covers as I loved BMW replacing my brake parts all the time.
        Yep, BMW FTW..
      1. M3GTtt's Avatar
        M3GTtt -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sorena Click here to enlarge
        That's not really true. The ceramic brakes manufactures always point to the high effect of ceramic brakes in higher temps. in a customer's mind, this means the brakes aren't effective in lower temps and they are good for higher temps. but this isn't true, ceramic brakes like normal brakes are effective in lower temps, but in higher temps unlike normal brakes they are still effective.
        This is 100% true, Carbon Ceramics are not like the Formula1 brakes which need high temps to work, they just need a bit and it builds up quickly. I have driven quite many modern cars with ceramics and they have amazing stoping power even when "cold"
        On most modern cars the brake system is used to keep them warm. On my car however.. there is no such system, only the old school brake booster of the M3, this means that if I do a long autobach run at high temps, and a truck pulls in front of me.. I have almost no stopping power instantly, therefore I have adopted the habit of left-foot braking a touch every 2-3 minutes massage them warm Click here to enlarge
      1. M3_WC's Avatar
        M3_WC -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Why?

        Who is going track this heavy boat every weekend?

        The whole point of carbon ceramic brakes to prevent brake fade during longs periods abuse/heat on the track.

        A complete waste of money on a DD giant sedan. Owners of the 1M or M3 would get much more use out of them.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge
        Who is going track this heavy boat every weekend?

        The whole point of carbon ceramic brakes to prevent brake fade during longs periods abuse/heat on the track.

        A complete waste of money on a DD giant sedan. Owners of the 1M or M3 would get much more use out of them.
        Doesn't even matter if you track it. Just with street driving I can get my M3 brakes to fade, would not mind ceramics especially in a heavier car.

        The point is not just brake fade around a road course.
      1. M3_WC's Avatar
        M3_WC -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Doesn't even matter if you track it. Just with street driving I can get my M3 brakes to fade, would not mind ceramics especially in a heavier car.

        The point is not just brake fade around a road course.
        You can't use the $#@! brakes that come on the M3 as example of why someone needs carbon ceramic brakes on a daily driven M5.

        If BMW had a decent set of brakes on the M3 it would be a different story.

        Take the GT3 for example. The steel brakes are more that adequate for road use, no one will see brake fade during street driving. For most they would more than adequate for tracking the car. But there is carbon ceramic for the owners that will be thrashing their GT3's on the tracks on a consistent basis.

        Carbon ceramic brakes are way overkill for a DD M5. If BMW puts a decent steel Brembo setup on the M5, that is more than enough. Most people ordering carbon ceramic brakes for the M5 are the same piston-counting d-bags.
      1. M3_WC's Avatar
        M3_WC -
        Looks like "M" finally took some time to build a quality standard steel brake setup. About $#@!ing time.

      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge
        You can't use the $#@! brakes that come on the M3 as example of why someone needs carbon ceramic brakes on a daily driven M5.
        Why not? I am familiar with M brakes. I always had them fade on me even on the street. Why would I not be interested in ceramic options on a much heavier car?

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge
        If BMW had a decent set of brakes on the M3 it would be a different story.
        Like ceramics?

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge
        Take the GT3 for example. The steel brakes are more that adequate for road use, no one will see brake fade during street driving. For most they would more than adequate for tracking the car. But there is carbon ceramic for the owners that will be thrashing their GT3's on the tracks on a consistent basis.
        Right, and Porsche gives you the option. BMW will now be doing the same, finally.

        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge
        Carbon ceramic brakes are way overkill for a DD M5. If BMW puts a decent steel Brembo setup on the M5, that is more than enough. Most people ordering carbon ceramic brakes for the M5 are the same piston-counting d-bags.
        I disagree. I think Carbon brakes were one of the best upgrades for Cayenne's as well simply due to the vehicles immense heft which will cause fade on steels much faster. Even great steels like Porsche's I get to fade EASILY. The Cayenne is not a track car but benefits from the ceramic upgrade tremendously.
      1. M3GTtt's Avatar
        M3GTtt -
        Why then buy the M5... you dont need all that power. Just go for a 550iDon't need comments are always a bit funny to me, specially when talking about powerfull cars. Things you dont need on a Porsche 911 Turbo... a rear windshield wiper and the "Horst Tappert as Derrick" cord-phone. But if you are going for a high performance car, then get it with the best driving equipment possible.I still agree that the standard steel brake setup on the ///M lineup is worthless. They should have the OEM steel setup at least a multi piston GT set from Brembo.
      1. angelic0-'s Avatar
        angelic0- -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
        Mine are the Carbon Ceramic disks and 8pot Brembo calipers from the McLaren SLR (used on a wide range of other high end cars). They are not drilled though, they are Generation 1 but more than enough for my car which is about 1350-1400kg.

        Aparently they are about 1500Kw worth of stopping power.

        Other cars using the same setup are for example Mercedes, Audi and early Ferraris. The rotors are 370x38mm, and huge 8 piston calipers. They never fade and they also weigh a lot less than the metal rotors.

        Do you have the 8 pison calipers Viktor?
        Wow i forgot you have the 8 piston calipers, mine are only 6 piston but i still have the 370x38mm rotors, just not in Carbon Ceramic form Click here to enlarge

        And for the Ceramic debate, i have toasted brakes on both E39 and E60 M5s in traffic... guess i'm abusing them like crazy huh' ?

        E39 M5 brakes are well under-engineered for the beast that it is.... E60 are ALMOST sufficient !

        Carbon Ceramic is essential on everything with M3/M5 like power Click here to enlarge
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
        Why then buy the M5... you dont need all that power. Just go for a 550iDon't need comments are always a bit funny to me, specially when talking about powerfull cars. Things you dont need on a Porsche 911 Turbo... a rear windshield wiper and the "Horst Tappert as Derrick" cord-phone. But if you are going for a high performance car, then get it with the best driving equipment possible.I still agree that the standard steel brake setup on the ///M lineup is worthless. They should have the OEM steel setup at least a multi piston GT set from Brembo.
        Options don't hurt.
      1. M3GTtt's Avatar
        M3GTtt -
        =>Sticky, just saying. As a car nut the "too much" phrase I dont understand Click here to enlarge

        =>Angelic0, your disks are in fact 380x32mm if im not mistaken. The Ceramic rotors are much thicker, but 1cm smaller in diameter.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
        =>Sticky, just saying. As a car nut the "too much" phrase I dont understand
        Fair enough.
      1. angelic0-'s Avatar
        angelic0- -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
        =>Sticky, just saying. As a car nut the "too much" phrase I dont understand Click here to enlarge

        =>Angelic0, your disks are in fact 380x32mm if im not mistaken. The Ceramic rotors are much thicker, but 1cm smaller in diameter.
        You sir, are correct Click here to enlarge but i'm pretty sure that they are 38mm thick though... at least they are HUGE !
      1. M3GTtt's Avatar
        M3GTtt -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by angelic0- Click here to enlarge
        You sir, are correct Click here to enlarge but i'm pretty sure that they are 38mm thick though... at least they are HUGE !
        Not that it's realy that important, but all the Brembo steel disks in the larger diameter disks are 32mm and if they would be 38 they would weigh way to much.

        The only disks available in the 38mm thickness are the ceramic disk. When I recieved my set I could carry both disks and calipers under one arm with no real effort, not that I am a strongman.

        The big difference that Ceramic disks make is not only that they have no brake fade (provided that you have decent calipers, fluids and brake lines, but that they weigh a lot less.. and less unsprung weight makes a hell of a difference.
      1. angelic0-'s Avatar
        angelic0- -
        I guess i'll have to eat my socks now.... i had dad measure the thickness and they are 31,5mm (guess they were 32mm when new)...

        They will have enough stop force for me i beleive, did you not have to modify your master cylinder in any way ? because after installing, i can swear the pedal feels a lot lower, almost as if there is air in the system Click here to enlarge
      1. M3GTtt's Avatar
        M3GTtt -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by angelic0- Click here to enlarge
        I guess i'll have to eat my socks now.... i had dad measure the thickness and they are 31,5mm (guess they were 32mm when new)...

        They will have enough stop force for me i beleive, did you not have to modify your master cylinder in any way ? because after installing, i can swear the pedal feels a lot lower, almost as if there is air in the system Click here to enlarge
        No, break feel is stock, pedal firm and no problems.

        Its probably just air in the system unless you are using the original brake lines and they have gone soft.. I would recomend steel-braded, but I guess there is not really that much tracktime in Iceland.
      1. angelic0-'s Avatar
        angelic0- -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3GTtt Click here to enlarge
        No, break feel is stock, pedal firm and no problems.

        Its probably just air in the system unless you are using the original brake lines and they have gone soft.. I would recomend steel-braded, but I guess there is not really that much tracktime in Iceland.
        Not yet, althoug i am very optimistic that there will be significant changes in these matters in then next year or two Click here to enlarge
      1. 5mall5nail5's Avatar
        5mall5nail5 -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        Brembo who will be producing the discs and likely the rotors as well
        wut
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by 5mall5nail5 Click here to enlarge
        wut
        Ooops, heh, meant caliper.