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    • BMW sandbagging the F10 M5? 22 psi vs. 17 psi of boost for the S63tu compared to the X5 and X6 M S63 + higher compression ratio and VALVETRONIC

      BMW provided a press release today with some new details on the F10 M5. Included in these details were that the boost is higher at 22 psi in the S63tu (F10 M5 motor) vs. 17.4 psi in the standard S63 V8 twin turbo in the X5 and X6 M. The compression ratio is also at 10.0:1 the same as the N63. The X5 and X6 M as you remember from our twin turbo V8 comparison article have 9.3:1 compression ratios. So the F10 M5 is higher compression and higher boost yet only rated 5 horsepower higher with rear wheel drive?

      The compression ratio was not included in the press release but we e-mailed BMWNA and did receive confirmation the F10 M5 will have a 10.0:1 compression ratio. Will the pistons be the same as those in the N63? Certainly an interesting question.

      The other interesting development is that the F10 M5 S63tu will have VALVETRONIC which BMW claims effectively gives the motor 16 individual throttles. VALVETRONIC being a variable valve control system. The ECU controls engine power directly by varying lift of the intake valves. This system minimizes losses which of course provides a MPG as well as torque boost. The claim is also that it will sharpen throttle response.

      Is this car putting out more than just 5 horsepower more than the X5 and X6 M? We think so.

      This article was originally published in forum thread: BMW sandbagging the F10 M5? 22 psi vs. 17 psi of boost compared to the X5 and X6 M + higher compression ratio and valvetronic started by Sticky View original post
      Comments 63 Comments
      1. DCAFS's Avatar
        DCAFS -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I don't think so. BMW states 17.4 psi max boost pressure for the S63 so it would only make sense for the S63tu at 22 psi to be max boost pressure.
        Hmmm....here are the BMW specs in bar pressure....notice the term 'absolute".

        Can you post up yours?

        Attachment 8423
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by DCAFS Click here to enlarge
        Hmmm....here are the BMW specs in bar pressure....notice the term 'absolute".

        Can you post up yours?
        Yep, look here, see maximum boost pressure but not absolute: http://www.bimmerboost.com/content.p...and-S63-motors
      1. fundahl's Avatar
        fundahl -
        Pretty cool what you can do with Direct Injection.


        Wonder what EGTs get to.......
      1. Jimefam's Avatar
        Jimefam -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I ran 305's with less torque and launching was still a $#@! unless on drag radials. So no, not kidding.

        From a roll not a problem it's from a stop where AWD sure is nice.
        Why would you go to the drag strip without the right tires? Anyone who is serious about modifying these cars shouldn't have a problem spending 1k for drag wheels and tires to be able to utilize that power. As you said for highway runs it's no problem.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Jimefam Click here to enlarge
        Why would you go to the drag strip without the right tires? Anyone who is serious about modifying these cars shouldn't have a problem spending 1k for drag wheels and tires to be able to utilize that power. As you said for highway runs it's no problem.
        You aren't always trying to put the power down just on the drag strip. What about in a low speed turn (AWD would be great) or from a stop on the street?

        I have no problem spending money for a drag setup (which I have) but the point still is that AWD offers numerous traction advantages in the real world.
      1. Jimefam's Avatar
        Jimefam -
        Why would I be mashing the gas on a low speed turn? And as I've heard you preach on this forum before racing is for the track. I've driven monster torque domestics on the street and wasn't spinning the wheels everytime I took off or made a turn lol. If anyone boost power on this car to the point where they need awd on the street to keep traction their tuner screwed them IMO.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Jimefam Click here to enlarge
        Why would I be mashing the gas on a low speed turn? And as I've heard you preach on this forum before racing is for the track. I've driven monster torque domestics on the street and wasn't spinning the wheels everytime I took off or made a turn lol. If anyone boost power on this car to the point where they need awd on the street to keep traction their tuner screwed them IMO.
        I'm not even talking about racing necessarily. I could be taking a turn and want to get on the gas but in a RWD car with big power you have to wait.

        For example even with just bolt on's I came across a GTR once that wanted to play. He was in front of me and took the right hand turn but was able to stay on the power. I wasn't and by the time I got on it he was gone. Didn't even have to break the speedlimit to leave me in the dust because I couldn't apply the throttle as quickly.

        It isn't even a matter of how much you boost the power but just RWD in general. It also is very hard to put the power down from a stop on street tires. You may not necessarily be racing high speed but just want to pass someone quickly but from a stop that is rather difficult if your tires just light up.

        If you can't see the practical application of AWD in these scenarios I'm not sure what to say.
      1. George Smooth's Avatar
        George Smooth -
        The peak boost might not mean anything. They might peak it early and bleed it out higher up the rev range. The 0-200 of 13second just isn't impressive and equates to the power output they have announced.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by George Smooth Click here to enlarge
        The peak boost might not mean anything. They might peak it early and bleed it out higher up the rev range. The 0-200 of 13second just isn't impressive and equates to the power output they have announced.
        I rarely if ever go by BMW provided performance figures.

        This car will be fast, very fast.
      1. George Smooth's Avatar
        George Smooth -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        I rarely if ever go by BMW provided performance figures.

        This car will be fast, very fast.
        What I am praying is that the X5/6M motor is not the N54 and this is the N55 when it comes to mods.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by George Smooth Click here to enlarge
        What I am praying is that the X5/6M motor is not the N54 and this is the N55 when it comes to mods.
        ? The N54 is the better mod platform for now .
      1. George Smooth's Avatar
        George Smooth -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        ? The N54 is the better mod platform for now .
        Sure, by the time the N55 catches up there will be a turbo M3 so it won't make a diff to most.
      1. BavarianBullet's Avatar
        BavarianBullet -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
        You aren't always trying to put the power down just on the drag strip. What about in a low speed turn (AWD would be great) or from a stop on the street?

        I have no problem spending money for a drag setup (which I have) but the point still is that AWD offers numerous traction advantages in the real world.
        not everyone lives in the desert or so cal.

        did you see the vid of that 335xi on n54tech that busted a 3.8 0-60 in the rain? http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12517

        the first 335xi with 500whp is going to be a trip if the awd can hold together.

        The F10 M5 awd done well could be sick if bmw builds it right and it isnt 4500lbs.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BavarianBullet Click here to enlarge
        The F10 M5 awd done well could be sick if bmw builds it right and it isnt 4500lbs.
        Certainly has potential but the AWD BMW's are getting insanely heavy.
      1. M3_WC's Avatar
        M3_WC -
        Of course they are sandbagging. This thing is heavy, considering the 550i weighs in at 4,370 curb weight. The new M5 needs that extra power to run with the other big boys in the segment.
      1. M3_WC's Avatar
        M3_WC -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by BavarianBullet Click here to enlarge
        The F10 M5 awd done well could be sick if bmw builds it right and it isnt 4500lbs.
        Not looking good.........

        550i - 4,376 lbs

        550xi - 4,519 lbs
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by M3_WC Click here to enlarge
        Not looking good.........

        550i - 4,376 lbs

        550xi - 4,519 lbs
        So then an AWD M5 will be what, 4600+?

        Things are bad when Audi's are looking light.
      1. Jimefam's Avatar
        Jimefam -
        I'm sure certain steps were taken to lighten it and I would hope it to weigh what the 550xi weighs.
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Jimefam Click here to enlarge
        I'm sure certain steps were taken to lighten it and I would hope it to weigh what the 550xi weighs.
        M's usually weigh more than their counterparts.

        I'm thinking if the weight was impressive BMW would have told us already.
      1. 654's Avatar
        654 -
        M5 gets special lightweight parts compared to 550i. However, the power is disappointing.